Manchester Metrolink master thread

[Moonshot]

I don't think a byelaw would apply to people who are on the streets of Manchester and aren't Metrolink users.

I would have thought that some sort of pedestrian metal fencing would be the answer.....but that may well introduce other issues which I cant think of just now

 

[12CSVT]

I don't think a byelaw would apply to people who are on the streets of Manchester and aren't Metrolink users.

I don't see why not. Some railway byelaws apply to everybody on railway premises regardless of whether or not they are railway passengers, and the council could introduce byelaws for the streets of Manchester.

 

[edwin_m]

I would have thought that some sort of pedestrian metal fencing would be the answer.....but that may well introduce other issues which I cant think of just now

With guardrail there is a serious risk of people being trapped. As well as looking hideous, in Piccadilly Gardens it would have to be well back from the tracks due to the throw of the vehicles on curves, and yet further back to provide a safe refuge because people will wander in between it because it looks as if there is loads of space already.

 

[Midlandman]

Sale & Altrincham Messenger reported yesterday that tram-train proposals for Altrincham to Hale (with possible extension to Knutsford), Altrincham to Stockport and ending the dual single-tracks at Navigation Road have been 'shelved' as uneconomic by TfGM, The Stockport line may still be revived following a review of transport arrangements to the airport. Meanwhile, Manchester - Marple DOES get the nod (although as that's not in Sale or Altrincham, the paper doesn't give details. Oh, and the article was illustrated by a photo of a 'typical' tram - a T68

 

[neilmc]

I don't see why not. Some railway byelaws apply to everybody on railway premises regardless of whether or not they are railway passengers, and the council could introduce byelaws for the streets of Manchester.

But in the city centre, particularly around Piccadilly Gardens, there's not a segregated track. It's a bit like Blackpool promenade, you just have to use a bit of common sense in the area.

 

[radamfi]

Trams in the city centre only run at 30 mph or less. You don't put railings between cars and pedestrians in city centre streets when cars run at 30 mph. Railings at pedestrian crossings are already a blight on streetscape and an anti-pedestrian measure. I can't think of anywhere that puts railings between trams and pedestrians. Which other countries install railings at pedestrian crossings?

 

[507 001]

Trams in the city centre only run at 30 mph or less. You don't put railings between cars and pedestrians in city centre streets when cars run at 30 mph. Railings at pedestrian crossings are already a blight on streetscape and an anti-pedestrian measure. I can't think of anywhere that puts railings between trams and pedestrians. Which other countries install railings at pedestrian crossings?

The line speed may be 30 in a few places but frankly anything over 20 is sheer lunacy. I don't know of a single driver who would even attempt to get up to 30 in the city.

Average speed in the city centre is about 15.

Makes the thought of railings even more ridiculous.

Yes it can be tricky to avoid pedestrians but all that's needed is a little more education.

We could do something like BR used to do, go into schools and give an assembly on tram line safety.

 

[317 forever]

Big news for Oldham Town Centre line.



http://www.tfgm.com/Corporate/media_centre/Pages/News.aspx?articleId=349

So ORL will be closed for week to connect wires and tracks from Mumps and Werneth but aleast I would still see trams running from Freehold to Mumps for ghost service that week I wonder if this mean that Rochdale Town Centre line wouldn't be opening same time as Oldham line then?

Thank you for reporting this. I shall now ride the current line via Oldham Mumps ex-BR in December for fear that even by February it might just be too late. I would then combine Oldham and Rochdale Town Centre stops at a later date.

 

[TOCDriver]

The line speed may be 30 in a few places but frankly anything over 20 is sheer lunacy. I don't know of a single driver who would even attempt to get up to 30 in the city.

Average speed in the city centre is about 15.

Makes the thought of railings even more ridiculous.

Yes it can be tricky to avoid pedestrians but all that's needed is a little more education.

We could do something like BR used to do, go into schools and give an assembly on tram line safety.

The run down to St Peters Square and up/down Deansgate is quite often done at 30mph with quite impressive acceleration from some drivers. Apart from that stretch, it is impossible to do 30 mph within city limits

 

[edwin_m]

Trams in the city centre only run at 30 mph or less. You don't put railings between cars and pedestrians in city centre streets when cars run at 30 mph. Railings at pedestrian crossings are already a blight on streetscape and an anti-pedestrian measure. I can't think of anywhere that puts railings between trams and pedestrians. Which other countries install railings at pedestrian crossings?

Guardrailing is often used in 30mph areas to "direct" pedestrians to what are considered as safe crossing places. See Portland Street around the entrances to Piccadilly Gardens bus station for example. People can be trapped the wrong side of it or injured if they try to climb over, and it probably makes some road drivers feel that they have absolute priority and can drive at 30mph regardless of the fact they are in a busy city centre. Hence the current view in many traffic engineering circles is that guardrailing should be minimised.

Guardrailing is also used on tramways including Metrolink, for example near Rochdale railway station and at most off-street pedestrian/cycle crossings away from tramstops (so trams may be going fast). This is usually where there is a specific hazard that wouldn't be obvious to the general public, although attitudes to it vary between councils and this also affects how much is provided on different parts of Metrolink.

 

[martin2345uk]

The run down to St Peters Square and up/down Deansgate is quite often done at 30mph with quite impressive acceleration from some drivers. Apart from that stretch, it is impossible to do 30 mph within city limits

Assuming you don't mean Deansgate, which road were you thinking of there?

 

[Manchester77]

Guessing he means Lower Mosley Street past the midland hotel and GMEX?

 

[TOCDriver]

Guessing he means Lower Mosley Street past the midland hotel and GMEX?

Correct. That's the only reasonable straight within the city limits

 

[Topgun333]

Correct. That's the only reasonable straight within the city limits

And the location for 23 tram crashes with cars in six years!

 

[Manchester77]

Yeah because people don't obey the rules of the road (well mainly taxis) - a tram can hardly swerve if some idiot has not read the road signs.

And I think you're thinking of a different place too which sees most RTCs in the city, it's the crossing where there are no traffic lights and so drivers have to use their eyes to check if the path is clear - far more common than the St Peters Square junction

 

[Jonny]

I don't see why not. Some railway byelaws apply to everybody on railway premises regardless of whether or not they are railway passengers, and the council could introduce byelaws for the streets of Manchester.

They would be a nightmare to enforce... allegations of profiteering from fines, enforcement staff compared to their third reich counterparts, interference with competent adults, etc; and I would wager that Manchester attracts the sort of person who would come up with such arguments (did I ever mention that I went to University there?). Besides, it isn't really the city council's problem as they are operationally independent from Metrolink.

 

[JackClare]

Deleted

 

[rogger13]

This news is panicking me now...........

Am off at the w/e and BBC weather says the sun is coming out.

So Im off hunting Mk 1's (T68s) as they call them in my house.

Is there anyway of increasing my chances of stumbling across them, if they are running at all?
Like hanging around Piccadilly Gardens...?

thanks

Clocked 1016/1009/1017 at Cornbrook on the Eccles service and 1013 stabled most of the day in Timperley siding for info.

 

[Manchester77]

1013 had probably failed ten if it was sat at Timperley

 

[rogger13]

Clocked 1016/1009/1017 at Cornbrook on the Eccles service and 1013 stabled most of the day in Timperley siding for info.

T68 Sunset

yesterday at Cornbrook

 

[rogger13]

1013 had probably failed ten if it was sat at Timperley

1013 and an unknown(forgot to get it) at timperley yesterday

 

[Manchester77]

Right it didn't fail then; 1013 and its partner were working specials and were spotted at St Peter's Square with Old Trafford on the blind, we thought it turned @ Old Trafford but it must've ran OOS to Timperley...

 

[TOCDriver]

And the location for 23 tram crashes with cars in six years!

That should be 23 car crashes with trams

 

[Boysteve]

The line speed may be 30 in a few places but frankly anything over 20 is sheer lunacy. I don't know of a single driver who would even attempt to get up to 30 in the city.

Average speed in the city centre is about 15.

I agree, I think that most Metrolink drivers do a great job of allowing for 'sleep walking' pedestrians. Which makes my observations on a tram driver doing a crossword between Piccadilly Gardens and St.Peter's Square very disturbing and unusual. It was several months ago and I did report it to Metrolink giving the tram ID number so that they could take action.

 

[Manchester77]

The end is nigh

A new Metrolink timetable starts on Wednesday 18th December and I understand from a reliable source that the plan is that the T68s and T68As will not be used in service from that date. This was announced at the LRTA Manchester meeting on 28th November.

Also a possibility Queens Road will open then too

 

[pemma]

An error with the PIS earlier meant every service showed as 'DELAYED'.

 

[Phil6219]

An error with the PIS earlier meant every service showed as 'DELAYED'.

Isn't that just business as usual?

Despite how much I loave the Metrolink I will miss the T68s when they go, they have a much better ride quality than the M5000s as well as more seats and did I mention the superior ride quality?

Phil

 

[507 001]

The line speed may be 30 in a few places but frankly anything over 20 is sheer lunacy. I don't know of a single driver who would even attempt to get up to 30 in the city.

Average speed in the city centre is about 15.

Makes the thought of railings even more ridiculous.

Yes it can be tricky to avoid pedestrians but all that's needed is a little more education.

We could do something like BR used to do, go into schools and give an assembly on tram line safety.

The run down to St Peters Square and up/down Deansgate is quite often done at 30mph with quite impressive acceleration from some drivers. Apart from that stretch, it is impossible to do 30 mph within city limits

We were taught to do no more than 25 down there.
There's no point doing 30 towards deans gate as line speed drops to 25 at the curve at the bottom if the ramp.
Coming down the ramp the bend at the bottom is blind (and there's a UTC just after) so again it's not really feasible.

 

[Darren R]

Despite how much I loave the Metrolink ...

Is that a typo for love or loathe - I couldn't decide!

 

[507 001]

2001 is looking rather sorry for itself at QRD.

it's sat on 5 road with its fenders up and not to be moved boards in the cabs. That's how most of the withdrawn ones at TFD have been left.