Manchester Victoria's 'lost' Subway

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Scouseinmanc

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Following Matacaster's post re. Dewsbury's lost subway; I vaguely remember seeing a photo of the same at Manchester Victoria.

I think it was located next to where Platform 1 is currently & presume it became disused at the time of remodelling, when building the Arena.

Did it provide access to all 17 platforms, back in the day?

Can it still be accessed by staff from anywhere else within the station? Or was it completely filled in?

Are there any more photos?

BR, SiM
 
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Bletchleyite

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It's interesting how the UK system is abandoning subways while European railways still prefer them. I guess the higher loading gauge over there is a large factor.
 

A0wen

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It's interesting how the UK system is abandoning subways while European railways still prefer them. I guess the higher loading gauge over there is a large factor.

It might also be that with DDA regulations it is easier to incorporate a lift onto a bridge structure than it is to sink it down around an under-pass.
 

Geeves

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What remained that wasnt totally filled in is now filled since the new roof was constructed. I believe one of the foundations for the roof supports goes into said underpass remains.
 

Xenophon PCDGS

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The subway provided access to the passenger platforms 12, 13, 14, 15 and 16. Platform 17 was separated from platform 16 by a brick wall with openings to allow motorised tractor units to access for purposes of loading and unloading.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
It might also be that with DDA regulations it is easier to incorporate a lift onto a bridge structure than it is to sink it down around an under-pass.

There is still the one at York that my wife and I used last Sunday that is still fully operational.
 

snowball

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The subway provided access to the passenger platforms 12, 13, 14, 15 and 16. Platform 17 was separated from platform 16 by a brick wall with openings to allow motorised tractor units to access for purposes of loading and unloading.

1-11 being accessible without use of the subway as numbers 10 and lower were bays.
 

Senex

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It's interesting how the UK system is abandoning subways while European railways still prefer them. I guess the higher loading gauge over there is a large factor.
It's a marked difference of approach. From the passenger's perspective the subway is a far better option as you do not have to descent nearly as far to get under the tracks as you have to rise to get comfortably over lines equipped with OLE -- not nearly as much effort needed.

Historically in this country subways do seem to have been the method of choice for getting across the lines in the early days (and after crossing on the level began to be frowned upon), but they started disappearting even before the end of the C19. York's two subways, which considerably antedate the present bridge, managed to linger on, known to and used by relatively few (and therefore forming a very fast way of getting between platforms) until in recent times they were fully modernised and brought back into general use.
 

61653 HTAFC

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Isn't there a class 142 cab front (possibly from the one that picked a fight with the buffers at Liverpool Lime Street) hidden somewhere beneath Manchester Victoria?
 

snowball

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Isn't there a class 142 cab front (possibly from the one that picked a fight with the buffers at Liverpool Lime Street) hidden somewhere beneath Manchester Victoria?
Yes, some pictures of Victoria subterraneana, including that, were posted on Skyscrapercity, perhaps 2 or 3 years ago.
 

Welshman

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Trains to the Calder Valley nearly all left from platform 13 at Manchester Victoria, and I remember, as a child, being quite frightened, being led through that subway just as a banked steam-hauled train to Huddersfield and Leeds thundered overhead on the middle lines at Victoria, having left Exchange, on its assault of Miles Platting bank.
 
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NorthernSpirit

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Isn't there a class 142 cab front (possibly from the one that picked a fight with the buffers at Liverpool Lime Street) hidden somewhere beneath Manchester Victoria?

As far as I'm aware the cab front was from 142059, its now stored somewhere but the Pacer Preservation Society website is down as it was mentioned on that.
 

rebmcr

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It's also worth noting that the catacombs are a different structure to this subway.
 

AndyHudds

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It's interesting how the UK system is abandoning subways while European railways still prefer them. I guess the higher loading gauge over there is a large factor.

And of course Huddersfield still has a subway, as does Hebden Bridge, Sowerby Bridge and Stalybridge...are they that rare?
 

40129

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Shrewsbury has one. It's the only way to get from the entrance to the main platform block (4-7) and from there to platform 3. The footbridge connecting the platforms went many years ago. The remaining footbridge forms part of The Dana footpath and does not afford access to the station
 
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Stoke-on-Trent has a subway, and if you need to use the lift, there's a bridge as well!
 
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61653 HTAFC

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Subways already established are probably okay, but for those where passenger numbers don't justify the cost of lift shafts as opposed to construction of an accessible footbridge. Batley is one location where either lifts or a replacement accessible footbridge will be required to meet disability legislation, and a lift shaft on the town side would be tricky and expensive I imagine. Mirfield is another location which will cost a fair bit to bring up to standards.
 

WatcherZero

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It's interesting how the UK system is abandoning subways while European railways still prefer them. I guess the higher loading gauge over there is a large factor.

A lot of European railways they don't mind if you simply walk across the tracks to change platforms.
 

edwin_m

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Many existing subways are dark, damp and uninviting.

When building a new crossing it's almost always easier to provide a bridge. Once the foundations are built this can (relatively) simply be lifted into place without disturbing the railway itself. A subway requires a section of the railway to be removed and reinstated unless the site is suitable to slide a structure in from one side (which it usually won't be at stations).
 

Ianno87

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I remember using the Manchester Victoria subway when I was very small, circa 1992 or so (Metrolink was definitely open by that point). The ramp came up alongside what is now Platform 2 (in the space between there and today's Platform 3).

I presume it was lost/filled in/sealed up during the 1994 re-build?
 

Xenophon PCDGS

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Subways already established are probably okay, but for those where passenger numbers don't justify the cost of lift shafts as opposed to construction of an accessible footbridge. Batley is one location where either lifts or a replacement accessible footbridge will be required to meet disability legislation, and a lift shaft on the town side would be tricky and expensive I imagine. Mirfield is another location which will cost a fair bit to bring up to standards.

Bear in mind, originally installed ramped subways or those more updated ones with lifts certainly come into their own where large luggage items need to be moved from platform to platform on some of the larger stations, where passengers attempting to manoeuvre large luggage items up and down overbridge flights of stairs is dangerous to say the least.
 

Bletchleyite

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A lot of European railways they don't mind if you simply walk across the tracks to change platforms.

That isn't so much the case today, I find. It was 20 years ago though.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Two that are open to passengers, both next to each other at the south end.

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/stations/sjp/PRE/stationOverview.xhtml

Though these aren't as heavily used as the bridge, which is more popular as the main[1] entrance is at bridge level.

[1] The fancy looking official main entrance isn't, but the one most people use is the small entrance/exit to the Fishergate Centre.
 

Clip

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Be interesting to see how TfL approach Norwood junction as apart from plat 1 everything is only accessed by the subway and there are only steps to do so also.
 

D1009

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Having travelled from Glasgow Central this morning I noticed a disused subway connecting platforms 9/10 to lower numbered platforms, probably formerly used for parcels transfer. It's opposite the gateline for platforms 11-14. I pondered whether this may originally have given access to the Low Level platforms pre 1964.
 

itsonlyme

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Don't forget the "new" subway at Crewe, made from a subway formerly connecting all plaforms to the Royal Mail Sorting Office, Refreshment rooms to each other etc. etc., and once part of an underground route from train to Crewe Arms Hotel for celebrities etc, but not normally open to the public. Now providing new station entrance, and subway commection from Platforms 1,2,3,4,5 to 6,7,8,9,10,11. Subway to Platform 12 still exists but not open to public.
 
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