Northern Class 170's

[pemma]

I think the confusing issue is that what will become connect routes may get other stock in the interim period such as 170's and 769's.

It's been reported 769s will work Windermere services for 18 months before it becomes a Northern Connect route, while 170s earmarked for Harrogate line services will be used on Calder Vale until 195s are introduced.

I guess its also possible some connect trains will work some non connect services especially the 331 EMU's

In the case of 331s that's not a possibility - that's a certainty. All 158s are being done up to the same specification so technically you could say that also applies to any 158 working a non-Connect service.

 

[pemma]

I'm thinking more 150/1 and 156. 150/2s if they can't change the layout need a thinner seat (i.e. ironing boards).

I think the problem is the 150s are so old that it's no economically viable to acquire brand new seats for them.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I think the problem is the 150s are so old that it's no economically viable to acquire brand new seats for them.

Not sure why it would be, as the seats could be put in something else later.

Scrapping a unit does not just put it in landfill. Components are recovered and sold.

 

[pemma]

Not sure why it would be, as the seats could be put in something else later.

Scrapping a unit does not just put it in landfill. Components are recovered and sold.

They can but unless a TOC is trying to do an on-the-cheap refurbishment at the same time as the 150s are scrapped and the 150s provide the right number of seats, it might be difficult to coordinate.

Hypothetically, Southeastern might need to refurbish a number of their trains but if they have to do it by 2025 under their franchise commitment and the 150s get scrapped in 2026 recycled 150s don't suit their needs. Alternatively, if Southeastern might have until 2028 but might need 5,000 seats and only 4,200 recycled seats are available - do they take on 4,200 recycled seats and obtain 800 new or just obtain 5,000 brand new?

 

[Intercity Exec]

What makes changing the seats on 170s unlikely is clear when you read the Northern Franchise document. The table contained shows standing and seating capacities pre and post refurbishment and 170s only show one figure, that equal to the seating capacity of the Scotrail 04-05 units. This suggests no change and economically it does not make sense anyway. Remember, the franchises are businesses and will only do what they have to (what it says in the Franchise document). Looking at other sets however (which I need not go into as they are not relevant to this thread) these figures make some interesting reading. Back to 170s I would expect the same interior layout, which is perfectly decent with replacement seat covers, carpets and a lick of paint. According to the same document all are due July 2018, which will possibly slip a little for the full fleet

 

[eastwestdivide]

Just photographed 170475 working Leeds Holbeck-Nottingham via Rotherham C, presumably a training run, today:
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/N13710/2018/03/27/advanced

It's scheduled to head back north later

 

[td97]

Just photographed 170475 working Leeds Holbeck-Nottingham via Rotherham C, presumably a training run, today:
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/N13710/2018/03/27/advanced

It's scheduled to head back north later

Is it in Scotrail or Northern livery?

 

[Domh245]

Just photographed 170475 working Leeds Holbeck-Nottingham via Rotherham C, presumably a training run, today:
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/N13710/2018/03/27/advanced

It's scheduled to head back north later

Ditto!

 

[td97]

Ah, it would appear to be SR livery. Thanks for the photos

 

[eastwestdivide]

Here it is at Rotherham Parkgate:

 

[xc170]

Smartest train Northern have...

 

[507021]

Ah, it would appear to be SR livery. Thanks for the photos

170476 is away for refurbishment at the moment, so it won't be too long before we see a Turbostar in the Northern livery.

 

[Geeves]

476 from the company group. Photographed by J.Dempsey

 

[507021]

476 from the company group. Photographed by J.Dempsey

Thanks for sharing this. I think these will really suit the Northern livery, so I'm looking forward to seeing this unit when it's finished.

 

[xc170]

476 from the company group. Photographed by J.Dempsey

Regarding this photo, everything is covered in sheeting, what are they doing?

 

[edwin_m]

Regarding this photo, everything is covered in sheeting, what are they doing?

There is a small unmasked area which I think corresponds to the white part of the Northern livery so I assume they are doing that part here. Though I would have thought they would do the white first, them mask and overspray the blue.

 

[physics34]

There is a small unmasked area which I think corresponds to the white part of the Northern livery so I assume they are doing that part here. Though I would have thought they would do the white first, them mask and overspray the blue.

the blue may well be vinyl.

 

[Domh245]

There is a small unmasked area which I think corresponds to the white part of the Northern livery so I assume they are doing that part here. Though I would have thought they would do the white first, them mask and overspray the blue.

I think that @xc170 was asking about the photo of the interior rather than the exterior! But the answer is also paint - the draught screens by the doors (ie immediately in front of the camera, and then again at the other end of the carriage) look freshly painted to me!

 

[humbersidejim]

Interesting to hear they've been on a Leeds - Nottingham training run, they'd be perfect for this inter-regional route with relatively long periods of higher speed running, rather than the stop-start Harrogates.

 

[capital12]

Thanks for sharing this. I think these will really suit the Northern livery, so I'm looking forward to seeing this unit when it's finished.

Hopefully they will, but I don’t hold out much hope - the new Northern livery looks pretty sh*te on everything else!

...and that’s before the white turns brown!!

 

[507021]

Hopefully they will, but I don’t hold out much hope - the new Northern livery looks pretty sh*te on everything else!

...and that’s before the white turns brown!!

I think the Northern livery looks quite decent on units with a curved front, but lately I've started to think it might look better if it had a silver band around the glazing.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I think the Northern livery looks quite decent on units with a curved front, but lately I've started to think it might look better if it had a silver band around the glazing.

A window band enhances most liveries. I bet the Northern livery will be best-looking on the Class 170s because the ribbon glazing will serve as one.

 

[edwin_m]

the blue may well be vinyl.

On passing through Piccadilly today I twigged what I should have known, that the unmasked area on the external photo of the 170 is actually the blue part of the latest Northern livery. So I think that photo was taken when they'd sprayed the whole train white and they were about to do the blue bit.

 

[xc170]

I think that @xc170 was asking about the photo of the interior rather than the exterior! But the answer is also paint - the draught screens by the doors (ie immediately in front of the camera, and then again at the other end of the carriage) look freshly painted to me!

Looks like you're right, I hadn't spotted they weren't covered.

They certainly weren't taking any chances with it!

 

[geoffk]

A 170 was tested on the Harrogate line yesterday, but there's an unofficial report that the doors scraped a couple of platforms. No idea how serious this is and whether it can be rectified by next week.

 

[175001]

I'd guess that the unofficial report is bull crap, unless our internal forum posts are all lies.

All go for next week according to our fleet team.

 

[geoffk]

I'd guess that the unofficial report is bull crap, unless our internal forum posts are all lies.

All go for next week according to our fleet team.

OK thanks.

 

[superkev]

It will be interesting to see where they eventually finish up as there's not many parts of the northern network where that can get out of fuel guzzling bottom gear (65mph). Nottingham perhaps, short sections of the Calder Valley, York- Leeds. (Any more).
K

 

[D365]

It will be interesting to see where they eventually finish up as there's not many parts of the northern network where that can get out of fuel guzzling bottom gear (65mph). Nottingham perhaps, short sections of the Calder Valley, York- Leeds. (Any more).

I thought York-Leeds via Harrogate is their confirmed primary route.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

170 476 at Crewe yesterday 15th May; photographed from 390 011...