Northern Railway Last Train Problems at Bridlington

[DunfordBridge]

I was catching the last train today from Sheffield to Scarborough departing Sheffield at 16:25 (sounds farcical already) when the train was delayed for 40 minutes at Doncaster due to problems with the swing bridge at Goole and the relieving train crew having problems getting to Doncaster in time.

In short, someone had taken a decision train to terminate the train short at Bridlington and run it back to Hull. I was assured there would be a taxi waiting for me at Bridlington for me to continue my onward journey but on arrival at Bridlington, no such taxi had been organised so I was left to make my own way back to Scarborough.

The details are as follows:

The delayed train was routed through Selby. There was little in the way of feedback, the driver was making announcements at Doncaster which were inaudible. When the train did set off from Doncaster, it set off, stalled then went back two yards before continuing on its way.

As the journey progressed, there were no announcements, but there was some woman on board in a Northern uniform who was traversing the length of the train talking to passengers. Initially, they did not know if the train would be going to Scarborough but it later transpired that the train would only go as far as Bridlington, hence the reassurance of a taxi.

Anyway, the train got to Hull for a little after half six where the train was kept waiting. It is my impression that my train was now forming the next scheduled service that normally runs as far as Bridlington usually arriving in Hull at 18:51 but this information was not communicated to us.

Anyway, the train got to Bridlington. I enquired with the guard about my taxi only to discover that it was not available. He explained that he had being trying to contact the station manager in Hull. Whilst this discussion was going off, the driver, far from sympathetic, was moaning that the train had to be back out in two minutes. I am sorry but it is hard to take someone seriously, who is wearing shorts and a T-shirt, complaining about punctuality.

Anyway, I walked to the back-end with the guard, who explained my options. All the while, the driver was staring down the platform at us, making me feel uncomfortable. Anyway, the guard said I could wait one hour whilst a taxi was summoned from Hull, or I could find a taxi myself and present the taxi receipt and my ticket for a total refund at Scarborough station the next day. What I find strange is that they could have ushered me off the train at Hull into a taxi and save me having to wait twenty minutes for the train to leave Hull.

Fortunately, there was a bus leaving Bridlington leaving at 20:20 as no taxis were available. Whilst waiting for the bus, I was harassed by some local wanting me to buy her wine because she had been barred from one of the shops, when I was after refreshment. As strange as it may seem, there is no provision of refreshments on what is normally a three hour service - even in these warm temperatures.

If things carry on at this rate, in five years time, everyone is going to be driving around in cars and the present TOCs will be successful, where even BR failed, in rationalising the UK rail network, because everyone will be too disgruntled to use the trains anymore.

 

[Bucephalus]

That sounds like a pretty rubbish situation

 

[yorkie]

None of this is a surprise to me.

What you describe is consistent with the experiences of others and is not unusual these days.

Just the other day a forum member had to wait an hour for a taxi to be summoned to go from Manchester Piccadilly.

Several forum members have reported being denied onward travel by a particularly poor member of staff at Victoria.

As for catering, I think the view of Northern is that of you want catering en route then you'd need to travel with alternative operators via York.

I agree that many people are being put off rail travel due to poor experiences with this train company, and I do not see any end to this on sight.

 

[DarloRich]

I was catching the last train today from Sheffield to Scarborough departing Sheffield at 16:25 (sounds farcical already) when the train was delayed for 40 minutes at Doncaster due to problems with the swing bridge at Goole and the relieving train crew having problems getting to Doncaster in time.

In short, someone had taken a decision train to terminate the train short at Bridlington and run it back to Hull. I was assured there would be a taxi waiting for me at Bridlington for me to continue my onward journey but on arrival at Bridlington, no such taxi had been organised so I was left to make my own way back to Scarborough.

The details are as follows:

The delayed train was routed through Selby. There was little in the way of feedback, the driver was making announcements at Doncaster which were inaudible. When the train did set off from Doncaster, it set off, stalled then went back two yards before continuing on its way.

As the journey progressed, there were no announcements, but there was some woman on board in a Northern uniform who was traversing the length of the train talking to passengers. Initially, they did not know if the train would be going to Scarborough but it later transpired that the train would only go as far as Bridlington, hence the reassurance of a taxi.

Anyway, the train got to Hull for a little after half six where the train was kept waiting. It is my impression that my train was now forming the next scheduled service that normally runs as far as Bridlington usually arriving in Hull at 18:51 but this information was not communicated to us.

Anyway, the train got to Bridlington. I enquired with the guard about my taxi only to discover that it was not available. He explained that he had being trying to contact the station manager in Hull. Whilst this discussion was going off, the driver, far from sympathetic, was moaning that the train had to be back out in two minutes. I am sorry but it is hard to take someone seriously, who is wearing shorts and a T-shirt, complaining about punctuality.

Anyway, I walked to the back-end with the guard, who explained my options. All the while, the driver was staring down the platform at us, making me feel uncomfortable. Anyway, the guard said I could wait one hour whilst a taxi was summoned from Hull, or I could find a taxi myself and present the taxi receipt and my ticket for a total refund at Scarborough station the next day. What I find strange is that they could have ushered me off the train at Hull into a taxi and save me having to wait twenty minutes for the train to leave Hull.

Fortunately, there was a bus leaving Bridlington leaving at 20:20 as no taxis were available. Whilst waiting for the bus, I was harassed by some local wanting me to buy her wine because she had been barred from one of the shops, when I was after refreshment. As strange as it may seem, there is no provision of refreshments on what is normally a three hour service - even in these warm temperatures.

If things carry on at this rate, in five years time, everyone is going to be driving around in cars and the present TOCs will be successful, where even BR failed, in rationalising the UK rail network, because everyone will be too disgruntled to use the trains anymore.

Your train was cancelled short and you were left without an onward transport solution. That is a very poor show.

I am not sure the rest of the story: routing via Selby ( awful place), catering, a common person you encountered in the street, the drivers outfit, the heat etc are of any consequence. I also like the dismissal of staff at work on the train trying to help people as "some woman"

BTW what outfit does a person have to wear to be take seriously in your view? Top hat, fob watch and frock coat?

I agree that many people are being put off rail travel due to poor experiences with this train company, and I do not see any end to this on sight.

It doesn't seem to be putting that many people off! numbers on the train are still high!
.

 

[ComUtoR]

Whilst this discussion was going off, the driver, far from sympathetic, was moaning that the train had to be back out in two minutes. I am sorry but it is hard to take someone seriously, who is wearing shorts and a T-shirt, complaining about punctuality.

Was the Driver wearing shorts and a T-Shirt ? Is that part of Northerns uniform ? It would be interesting to hear your opinion on uniforms in the staff uniform thread as there is a small debate as to what the uniform has on professionalism and passenger perception.

 

[bengley]

The driver would have been wearing a company issued Polo shirt, which does look like a t-shirt and shorts, which Northern have permitted staff to wear during the hot weather.

Whether you like what he was wearing or not, if the driver said the train had to go back out in 2 minutes, then I'd suggest what he said was to be taken seriously regardless.

 

[IanXC]

I was catching the last train today from Sheffield to Scarborough departing Sheffield at 16:25 (sounds farcical already) when the train was delayed for 40 minutes at Doncaster due to problems with the swing bridge at Goole and the relieving train crew having problems getting to Doncaster in time.

Presumably you found this out from the PA that later was 'inaudible?

He explained that he had being trying to contact the station manager in Hull.

Given you were entirely travelling on Northern, I'm not sure what the TPE station manager had to do with anything. This could well be where things have gone awry.

I am not sure the rest of the story: routing via Selby ( awful place), catering, a common person you encountered in the street, the drivers outfit, the heat etc are of any consequence. I also like the dismissal of staff at work on the train trying to help people as "some woman".

Theres an impressive amount of guff added to this tale isnt there - clearly the railway are responsible for the random Bridlingtonite who can't buy their own wine eh!

 

[bb21]

Was there no help point you could have used?

Was a taxi actually offered but you refused, or was none offered at all?

 

[DunfordBridge]

None of this is a surprise to me.
As for catering, I think the view of Northern is that of you want catering en route then you'd need to travel with alternative operators via York.

I agree that many people are being put off rail travel due to poor experiences with this train company, and I do not see any end to this on sight.

Ironically, one of my reasons for going through Hull is that I am trying to avoid the problems caused by the services from York to Scarborough terminating prematurely at Malton which has caused me endless inconvenience in recent months, as described in the thread, https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/scarborough-tpex-reliability.165578/. Normally, I like to go around in a big Rover but every so often, I prefer to use the train and do my bit for the environment.

Your train was cancelled short and you were left without an onward transport solution. That is a very poor show.

I am not sure the rest of the story: routing via Selby ( awful place), catering, a common person you encountered in the street, the drivers outfit, the heat etc are of any consequence. I also like the dismissal of staff at work on the train trying to help people as "some woman"

I really have no idea what the unidentified woman was doing on the train. All I know is that she was not train crew and she was not customer services but I was certainly left in some considerable doubt as to who was taking ownership of my problem, in fact I had to keep on badgering her when she passed by.

BTW what outfit does a person have to wear to be take seriously in your view? Top hat, fob watch and frock coat?

Top hat?? Not very practical for moving in and out of the cab, but there again, as a lesson in customer service, for a week, maybe the driver on the night could be forced to dress up as a butler and greet the passengers as they enter the train behind his cab.

I think the reason as to why I struggled to take the driver seriously is because he had such a casual attitude to my problem, a message which was only reinforced by what he was wearing.

Was the Driver wearing shorts and a T-Shirt ? Is that part of Northerns uniform ? It would be interesting to hear your opinion on uniforms in the staff uniform thread as there is a small debate as to what the uniform has on professionalism and passenger perception.

I would say it is now the standard uniform. Although the driver did look somewhat out of place, he certainly did not look ridiculous, to my mind, but I am not quite sure this new uniform is a look that certainly suits everyone. I have not seen this uniform thread but I am sure that if you can direct me there, I can certainly try to amuse you all by sharing some of my thoughts, suffice to say that given the prices paid for train tickets, you expect a certain standard of dress.

 

[xc170]

I travelled from Tamworth to Bridlington last Thursday with my son in his pushchair and it was one of the most unpleasant journeys I've had in a long time... Delays, cancellations, no working air con on more than one train, unhelpful staff, filthy trains...

In the last 18 months with the amount of strikes, timetable problems etc the railway must have done more damage to it's reputation than BR achieved in 20 years...

 

[DarloRich]

I really have no idea what the unidentified woman was doing on the train. All I know is that she was not train crew and she was not customer services but I was certainly left in some considerable doubt as to who was taking ownership of my problem, in fact I had to keep on badgering her when she passed by.

aka she didn't seem to treat me as the only passenger on the train and offer me a personal service at the expense of all others?

Top hat?? Not very practical for moving in and out of the cab, but there again, as a lesson in customer service, for a week, maybe the driver on the night could be forced to dress up as a butler and greet the passengers as they enter the train behind his cab.

I think the reason as to why I struggled to take the driver seriously is because he had such a casual attitude to my problem, a message which was only reinforced by what he was wearing.

I would say it is now the standard uniform. Although the driver did look somewhat out of place, he certainly did not look ridiculous, to my mind, but I am not quite sure this new uniform is a look that certainly suits everyone. I have not seen this uniform thread but I am sure that if you can direct me there, I can certainly try to amuse you all by sharing some of my thoughts, suffice to say that given the prices paid for train tickets, you expect a certain standard of dress.

I suspect this is more to do with a "snobby" attitude than an understanding of providing suitable attire for the working environment. Again you seem to expect they should delay an entire train load of passengers to deal with your issue exclusively. Please do share your thoughts. I suspect they may be a bit outlandish especially considering this line:

that given the prices paid for train tickets, you expect a certain standard of dress

 

[Darandio]

suffice to say that given the prices paid for train tickets, you expect a certain standard of dress.

It isn't the Henley Royal Regatta.

 

[CaptainHaddock]

Very odd - the OP's train is showing as cancelled at Doncaster because of the Goole Swing Bridge problem.

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Y23654/2018/07/08/advanced

Several cancellations followed and the next train in the Hull direction left Doncaster at 1851, arriving Hull 20 late at 2011, long after the last train to Bridlington had gone. Something doesn't quite ring true about this story......

 

[philjo]

Very odd - the OP's train is showing as cancelled at Doncaster because of the Goole Swing Bridge problem.

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Y23654/2018/07/08/advanced

Several cancellations followed and the next train in the Hull direction left Doncaster at 1851, arriving Hull 20 late at 2011, long after the last train to Bridlington had gone. Something doesn't quite ring true about this story......

The OP said the train was diverted via Selby so I assume it wasn't picked up by RTT. I have been on a few GN trains into Kings Cross in the last month that have had short notice alterations - either starting short or a cancelled train reinstated after it should have departed - some of these were showing on RTT (& on the station screens) as cancelled when I was on the train albeit some running up to 45 minutes late and omitting most stations. Some others had not reported on RTT at all.

 

[Llanigraham]

I think the reason as to why I struggled to take the driver seriously is because he had such a casual attitude to my problem, a message which was only reinforced by what he was wearing.

But passengers aren't his problem. He is employed to drive the train. And what he is wearing is immaterial, so I don't know why you keep mentioning it.

 

[DunfordBridge]

Maybe the title of the thread should be changed again, this time to Alleged Problems with Last Train at Bridlington - but not to worry - because it only affected one random posh person. I honestly hope that some of you people never find yourself in the same situation wondering if you are going to make it home this side of midnight. I have already posed the question with Northern Railway about what they would have done if a more vulnerable passenger than myself was involved.

Very odd - the OP's train is showing as cancelled at Doncaster because of the Goole Swing Bridge problem.

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Y23654/2018/07/08/advanced

Several cancellations followed and the next train in the Hull direction left Doncaster at 1851, arriving Hull 20 late at 2011, long after the last train to Bridlington had gone. Something doesn't quite ring true about this story......

So are you trying to say my story is a fabrication?

aka she didn't seem to treat me as the only passenger on the train and offer me a personal service at the expense of all others?

Do you not think that you are putting words into my mouth based on some preconception?

I suspect this is more to do with a "snobby" attitude than an understanding of providing suitable attire for the working environment. Again you seem to expect they should delay an entire train load of passengers to deal with your issue exclusively.

So have you actually ever worked on a railway? It just so happens that I work as train crew on a heritage railway and the rules for wearing suitable and safe clothing are quite unambiguous. You may have shot yourself in the foot with this comment.

a common person you encountered in the street

And you are calling me a snob?

Please do share your thoughts. I suspect they may be a bit outlandish especially considering this line:

that given the prices paid for train tickets, you expect a certain standard of dress

So what are we paying for these days. I cannot guarantee that my train will reach Scarborough these days, either through Hull or Malton.

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

So what are we paying for these days. I cannot guarantee that my train will reach Scarborough these days, either through Hull or Malton.

Legally, a standard class ticket gives you the right to carriage from its stated origin to its stated destination. This is ordinarily by train but the TOC may substitute any alternative method of transport as necessary. A first class ticket also guarantees you a seat (or rather, a refund of the difference to standard if you don't get a seat). The consumer Rights Act implies contractual terms such as that the TOC will perform the service with reasonable care and skill - but I don't think any of this implies that the TOC must ensure the staff members are dressed in any particular manner!

 

[DarloRich]

I honestly hope that some of you people never find yourself in the same situation wondering if you are going to make it home this side of midnight

Happens quite often. However, I make sure that I am equipped to get myself home. That said, I also know how to speak to people to obtain a positive result. Personally if I was promised a taxi an hour later i would have gone to the pub and waited.

So have you actually ever worked on a railway? It just so happens that I work as train crew on a heritage railway and the rules for wearing suitable and safe clothing are quite unambiguous. You may have shot yourself in the foot with this comment.

A heritage railway you say? No, I don't work on a heritage railway.

And you are calling me a snob?

Yes. You were the one commenting on how awful it was that a "down and out" spoke to you.

So what are we paying for these days. I cannot guarantee that my train will reach Scarborough these days, either through Hull or Malton.

and that impacts on the attire, empathy or competence of the driver how?

 

[Llanigraham]

So have you actually ever worked on a railway? It just so happens that I work as train crew on a heritage railway and the rules for wearing suitable and safe clothing are quite unambiguous. You may have shot yourself in the foot with this comment.

Whilst your wonderful heritage railway may have rules about what their volunteers wear, (and from what I have seen on some of them totally out of touch of what happened in the real world) the "big" railway has very few rules about "uniforms".
I suggest you never look in a signalbox at what we wear!

And you are calling me a snob?

Shall we say that some of your comments come across in a very superior way.

 

[Llanigraham]

So what are we paying for these days. I cannot guarantee that my train will reach Scarborough these days, either through Hull or Malton.

What has that got to do with what people are wearing?

 

[cactustwirly]

It isn't the Henley Royal Regatta.

You haven't seen saturday night during the regatta...

 

[ComUtoR]

I have not seen this uniform thread but I am sure that if you can direct me there, I can certainly try to amuse you all by sharing some of my thoughts, suffice to say that given the prices paid for train tickets, you expect a certain standard of dress.

https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/staff-uniforms.166551/page-4#post-3536902

Link for the uniform thread

 

[DunfordBridge]

Presumably you found this out from the PA that later was 'inaudible?

No, we were made aware by the first guard walking along the train repeating the message in person to passengers after the driver's announcement. The simple explanation is that the driver was probably holding the mouthpiece too far form his mouth. I know I used to exhibit the same problem when I have been working as a guard.

Given you were entirely travelling on Northern, I'm not sure what the TPE station manager had to do with anything. This could well be where things have gone awry.

It may have been easier to source a taxi from Scarborough rather than Hull or Bridlington.

Theres an impressive amount of guff added to this tale isnt there - clearly the railway are responsible for the random Bridlingtonite who can't buy their own wine eh!

Why do I get the impression that my story is somehow a gullibility test? I know it sounds incredible myself that I could not find a single taxi in Bridlington on a Sunday night. Who knows, travelling by train might have driven the woman to booze?

I believe that I have already pointed out that I have already raised the question in my complaint about what would have happened if a more vulnerable passenger than myself was involved. So my night was inconvenient but I was half expecting it, but would the railway have been content to leave a lone woman to fend for herself in similar circumstances to myself bit in the middle of winter after dark?

 

[DunfordBridge]

https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/staff-uniforms.166551/page-4#post-3536902

Link for the uniform thread

Thanks for the link. I am sure I will get round to contributing at some point.

 

[bb21]

I am still at a loss as to what actually happened so your questions are almost impossible to answer.

So, in order to establish what should have taken place and how things could have been improved, if you could answer the very simple questions I asked way up in Post 8 then it would help us understand a bit more what actually took place.

In addition, you mentioned vulnerability. If you at any time felt vulnerable while waiting for said taxi (assuming one was summoned and you indeed felt that way), did you attempt to use the station help point at all (if one were provided)? Did you at any point explain to the guard/driver that you felt vulnerable being left alone there? You should also be able to ring the police if you felt threatened in any way.

Having to wait up to an hour for a taxi isn't a rare occurrence, at a quiet time like Sunday nights at locations which are not particularly busy, depending on availability. All TOCs should have policies on dealing with vulnerable passengers but sometimes the vulnerability may not be obvious and may require the passenger to bring it to the company's attention.

 

[Hadders]

Last summer I had to wait over 2 hours for a taxi from Paddington. A delay to my journey from Exeter meant I misses my onward connection.

 

[DunfordBridge]

Last summer I had to wait over 2 hours for a taxi from Paddington. A delay to my journey from Exeter meant I misses my onward connection.

Would have been quicker to walk or catch an open-top tourist bus if it was going to your destination by any rare chance. It is farcical!

 

[DunfordBridge]

I am still at a loss as to what actually happened so your questions are almost impossible to answer.

So, in order to establish what should have taken place and how things could have been improved, if you could answer the very simple questions I asked way up in Post 8 then it would help us understand a bit more what actually took place.

In addition, you mentioned vulnerability. If you at any time felt vulnerable while waiting for said taxi (assuming one was summoned and you indeed felt that way), did you attempt to use the station help point at all (if one were provided)? Did you at any point explain to the guard/driver that you felt vulnerable being left alone there? You should also be able to ring the police if you felt threatened in any way.

Having to wait up to an hour for a taxi isn't a rare occurrence, at a quiet time like Sunday nights at locations which are not particularly busy, depending on availability. All TOCs should have policies on dealing with vulnerable passengers but sometimes the vulnerability may not be obvious and may require the passenger to bring it to the company's attention.

A taxi was offered but failed to materialise, apologies for my delay to your questions. It now transpires that the conductor, after trying to contact the Hull station manager, had not exercised the option of contacting Northern Customer Service, so I am led to believe.

I did not feel vulnerable on this occasion, it was broad daylight. I was somewhat concerned due to the lack of taxis outside Bridlington station but it did not occur to me that I should use a help point in the station. Thank you for bringing that option to my attention.

 

[DunfordBridge]

The driver would have been wearing a company issued Polo shirt, which does look like a t-shirt and shorts, which Northern have permitted staff to wear during the hot weather.

Whether you like what he was wearing or not, if the driver said the train had to go back out in 2 minutes, then I'd suggest what he said was to be taken seriously regardless.

Let us just get a few things straight. The driver cannot proceed unless he has both a signal for his route that is not showing danger and has received the signal from the guard that the train is ready to start once platform work has safely been completed. There will be variations for driver-only operated trains.

It just so happens that platform work was not complete on this occasion. The train driver would have had no concerns about punctuality if the guard had used all the options available to him or had approached me prior to our arrival in Bridlington informing me of the situation rather than me having to track down the guard when it was appropriate for me to do so. Everyone would have been happy (or happier) and the train driver would not have felt the need to stare at me as if I had just arrived from another planet.

 

[Hadders]

Would have been quicker to walk or catch an open-top tourist bus if it was going to your destination by any rare chance. It is farcical!

I don't think there are any tourist buses at 2am on a Monday morning

I was travelling from Exeter to Stevenge. The train into Paddington was delayed, arriving after 01:00 meaning the last train from Kings Cross to Stevenage was missed. I needed a taxi from Paddington to Stevenage but despite the guard on the train to Paddington collating all the info en-route this wasn't passed on leaving the staff at Paddington to sort things out. It was over 2 hours before I was in a taxi...