Old chestnuts list

[ChiefPlanner]

"I have a special / low fare for first class on Virgin Trains - what food delights can I expect for this "

One of my all time (too often) favourites.

 

[Mag_seven]

"In what only can be described as a moment of madness, I [insert fare evasion activity here]".

 

[Starmill]

ETA - Why is a service like Aberdeen to Penzance (which no sane person does end-to-end) booked for stock that is unsuitable for end-to-end journeys?

Your others were good but this is silly. I'm quite sure that there are people who use this service both end-to-end and nearly all the way. There are clearly some people who travel between the Northern Scotland and South West England, and rail may well be the only practical way.

In addition, a Voyager is of perfectly suitable stock type for this journey. The problems are merely cosmetic e.g. window view, toilet odour and capacity.

 

[Lankyline]

Reasons to re-open....................everything

 

[Busaholic]

What sells, sells. Physical distance is not the be-all-and-end-all of deciding price.

So no, it is not "completely rational".

If 'the market rules' is the defining ethos with no regard to any other principles then of course you are right: if,on the other hand, at some stage in the future long after I am dead, a dictator with floppy dyed blond hair decides to re-nationalise the railways and adopt a common fare structure, then the initial basis could well be a price per mile one. I am not saying that it would have to be rigidly applied. By the way, please do not tell me you think the current fares 'systems' are in any way rational: if you do think so, please tell me why no other country has come anywhere near to adopting anything similar?

 

[Flamingo]

So, which country has got an (unsubsidised) fare system that could be considered?

 

[Busaholic]

So, which country has got an (unsubsidised) fare system that could be considered?

I think you, possibly unwittingly, make my point for me

 

[Flamingo]

I think you, possibly unwittingly, make my point for me

Very unwittingly - you'll have to spell it out for me.

 

[yorksrob]

How about:

"Everyone who supports a route re-opening campaign, obviously wants every route closed by Beeching and more re-opened"

"Everyone who can remember life before privatisation and who doesn't see it as some sort of medieval hell full of plague, pestilence and famine, must be looking at the world through rose tinted glasses"

"It's impossible to open a passenger route unless it's through an urban industrial estate, and in spite of the fact that our Celtic neighbours manage reopenings, the fact that we can't manage any openings in England has everything to do with the fact that railways are somehow less effective at what they do in England than elsewhere, and nothing to do with England's deficient political system".
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Reasons to re-open....................everything

Reasons not to reopen anything, and if that's shown not to be the case, come up with any other excuse to put in anything other than a railway, be it road, guided busway, cycle route, magic carpet hub etc.

 

[sprinterguy]

In addition, a Voyager is of perfectly suitable stock type for this journey. The problems are merely cosmetic e.g. window view, toilet odour and capacity.

Outside of short distance commuter flows such as London - Reading, insufficient seats on a regular basis for the number of people travelling on a long distance train (regardless of whether they are making end to end journeys or not) does strike me as a fairly major indicator of unsuitability, personally. As to the former two points of criticism, isn't it astonishing, then, that a wide range of regional and long distance rolling stock has been built that doesn't feature either of these flaws to any great extent?

Sorry about that, I seem to have introduced one of the favourite "old chestnuts" of this forum into the thread detailing them - namely Voyager bashing.

 

[Lankyline]

Or complaining how threads seemingly manage to go off topic after page 2 !!

 

[DarloRich]

In addition, a Voyager is of perfectly suitable stock type for this journey. The problems are merely cosmetic e.g. window view, toilet odour and capacity.

No it isn't.

may i add that as an old chestnut:

Voyagers are suitable for long distance cross country services as they are never used for the full journey instead merely being used for short hops between two local stations.

 

[backontrack]

How about:

"Everyone who supports a route re-opening campaign, obviously wants every route closed by Beeching and more re-opened"

"Everyone who can remember life before privatisation and who doesn't see it as some sort of medieval hell full of plague, pestilence and famine, must be looking at the world through rose tinted glasses"

"It's impossible to open a passenger route unless it's through an urban industrial estate, and in spite of the fact that our Celtic neighbours manage reopenings, the fact that we can't manage any openings in England has everything to do with the fact that railways are somehow less effective at what they do in England than elsewhere, and nothing to do with England's deficient political system".

Reasons not to reopen anything, and if that's shown not to be the case, come up with any other excuse to put in anything other than a railway, be it road, guided busway, cycle route, magic carpet hub etc.

I agree with you 100%. I hope you agree with what I said earlier...?

 

[Flamingo]

Or complaining how threads seemingly manage to go off topic after page 2 !!

You mean go off on a tangent? Well, that reminds me...

 

[yorksrob]

I agree with you 100%. I hope you agree with what I said earlier...?

I agree with this:

Of course, there are the crayonistas - but on the flipside of that, there are the 'rubberistas' - where you talk about one line and you say 'I wish that hadn't closed', then someone comes along and calls you a 'deluded fantasist' or a 'tree-hugger'. Often their attitudes are much worse than those of crayonistas, and, while I don't support every reopening there has been suggested on here, I don't expect to be labelled as a 'fantasist' if I do suggest a reopening.

Although I have to confess, I do have a soft spot for Newhaven Marine

 

[Starmill]

No it isn't.

may i add that as an old chestnut:

Voyagers are suitable for long distance cross country services as they are never used for the full journey instead merely being used for short hops between two local stations.

I dislike Voyager travel as much as the next man, but I've supported my point with evidence. There's no reason why a Voyager which has some cosmetic improvements and sufficient capacity isn't suitable for long-distance travel. You're simply going on Voyagers being unsuitable because you dislike them.

 

[DarloRich]

I dislike Voyager travel as much as the next man, but I've supported my point with evidence. There's no reason why a Voyager which has some cosmetic improvements and sufficient capacity isn't suitable for long-distance travel. You're simply going on Voyagers being unsuitable because you dislike them.

yes I dislike them but they are awful on long distance runs. More coaches and better seats might help. Taking the engines out would be better

My point was more the idea that XC is only used for short distance travel.

 

[Harbornite]

yes I dislike them but they are awful on long distance runs. More coaches and better seats might help. Taking the engines out would be better

My point was more the idea that XC is only used for short distance travel.

That's a matter of opinion. I'd much rather have a HST or whatever, but I've traveled on Voyagers to Brum to York and other places, yet I've never felt the urge to complain... Other than the time I was near the bogs on a trip to Stafford. Having more coaches would be a definite improvement, and at least they don't have locos taking up platform space etc etc.