3. Less multiple crossings of rivers etc. (How many times does the Borders line cross/recross the Tweed ?)
Once, on an existing viaduct. You're maybe thinking of the Gala Water which is a bit cheaper to bridge. I imagine an east-west railway would have to cross a lot of rivers flowing south.
My stake, I meant the Gala Water.
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This rail forum isn't the best place to make suggestions for new/reopening lines unless you can show a good well thought through case.
The only reason that it is so hard to get others to support an idea is if they can see the benefit having been persuaded. (Of course there will always be some in either camp that will not agree, until the government say that it is going ahead.)
The Okehampton reopening debate is a good case study, if you want a fighting chance to get others to agree with a proposal you have read through those arguments and put together a strong argument to deal with the objections.
As if you didn't have to deal with them on here then you are only going to have to deal with the same questions when you present your ideas to the industry (even if the politicians all just sign up to the idea).
Yes, that's fine.
But all I'm Getting on here is complete negativity. Not one bit of support.
So you will say thats because its totally unfeasible.
But im the one who lives here, knows the area, the problems etc.
The people slamming this proposal on here have done next to zero research on this.
They cant possibly have done any because within MINUTES of the thread being started they had started criticising it.
Some of them know nothing about the area, nothing about the population demographics, travel patterns, levels of car ownership etc etc etc.
Ive done all that research already.
What applies to one railway reopening may roughly apply to another, but each one is unique.
Im merely pointing out that this line benefits from certain things that make it cheaper than other similar projects.
My main quibbles are with the overinflated prices some people are saying this project will cost, the fact that some see it as a threat to money being spent on projects in their area and people grossly underestimating demand for the line , and passenger demand on it.
People on here should know that the passenger forecasting models used by the industry are a joke.
E.g Alloa, first year forecast demand 155,000, actual around 400,000
(Before everybody jumps down my throat, that is from memory, approximate)
The people posting on this thread were never open to the idea of being persuaded, they made an instant 'basket case 'decision and have stubbornly stuck to that despite some evidence to the contrary because some people just don't like to admit they are wrong, or that they can be proved wrong.
I have learnt some stuff from here, I had [possibly underestimated the size of the task.
But if 30 miles of line can be built in Scotland , then 65 miles can be built.
Im NOT promoting this project over others, but alongside.
This will be about the third time ive said that Leven, Ellon/Buchan , Brechin etc are all good projects too.
Leven is no.1 priority in Scotland for rail reopenings.
BUt if the Aberdeen City deal is going to spend money rebuilding a line to a town of 10,000 people then NOBODY can say the Galloway line is unviable.
Other should be so generous.
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The Borders Railway (in my view) had demonstrably more passenger demand potential than Dumfries-Stranraer ever will.
The point is that the Borders railway did not *need* a freight flow for its case to stand up - D-S has such low passenger benefits that it *would* need freight benefits to stand half a chance - and those benefits aren't really there either.
Borders is about taking demand off a heavily congested section of the A7 (much more congested than the A75) into a major employment centre (Edinburgh, considerably larger than Dumfries) from an area that is moderately denselely populated (Galashiels, etc) or has potential for new, rail connected housing development for people to live in whilst commuting to Edinburgh. Other than Newton Stewart, I don't think there are other notable population centres over the vast distance this line would serve.
In short, the passenger demand potential on D-S is nowhere near the level on Borders, ergo no benefits to be had.
The Borders is not 'moderately densely populated'
Borders population, 102,000, Galashiels 14,000
D&Galloway pop 149,500 Dumfries 43.000
You miss Dalbeattie and Castle Douglas , both bigger than Newton Stewart.
I realise passenger demand would not be as high as the Borders line, ive never said it would be.
Re freight my point is a if a line with no, or next to no, freight potential can be built, then one with potential could be built. I haven't mentioned themassive timber extraction here and the BSW sawmill at Dalbeattie ADJACENT to the old formation.
