Pyreneenguy
Member
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Hmmmmmm Steam Man, full of hot-air !
Better to risk financial ruin than vote for Boris Johnson who has already proved himself to be morally bankrupt.
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Poll: Potential General Election: who are you voting for?
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Hmmmmmm Steam Man, full of hot-air !
Better to risk financial ruin than vote for Boris Johnson who has already proved himself to be morally bankrupt.
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edwin_m
Veteran Member
I agree with the first part. Excepting people who have high living costs due to disability, I don't think it's sensible that some people in employment rely on taxpayer support via credits or benefits. Rather than subsidizing these activities we should look at whether they can be done in a way that doesn't exploit people. This may result in some prices increasing, but they are things we have probably been paying too little for.
NoMorePacers
Established Member
Although Corbyn seems like he woke up on Christmas Day and Santa Claus gave him the Labour leadership all of a sudden, I’d still easily vote for him over De Piffle. If I ever get voting rights I would not vote Conservative even with an AK47 pressed to my head.
Aictos
Established Member
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- 28 Apr 2009
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- 10,403
£15 a hour is a lot especially for low paid workers who earn on average £8 a hour, I do find it insulting to suggest that those on low pay only have themselves to blame.
Surely it’s better that they are in employment then going to the local JCP every week even if it’s peanuts that they’re being paid?
Yes there are those who sponge off the state and wouldn’t know a days work but the fact that some do a honest days work for minimum wages should not be sneered at.
That said I believe £15 a hour is too much especially as the London wage is around £10?
Finally to finish here, I believe that people should be given the opportunity to stand on their own feet and encouraged to do this and not rely on the state propping them up with benefits.
Surely it’s better that they are in employment then going to the local JCP every week even if it’s peanuts that they’re being paid?
Yes there are those who sponge off the state and wouldn’t know a days work but the fact that some do a honest days work for minimum wages should not be sneered at.
That said I believe £15 a hour is too much especially as the London wage is around £10?
Finally to finish here, I believe that people should be given the opportunity to stand on their own feet and encouraged to do this and not rely on the state propping them up with benefits.
As opposed to a Conservative government that would make the country better off? The country is far deeper in debt than when they took over and for what? Have you seen the state of our public services? Have you seen the state of the country?
People like you need to get a grip on reality.
And how much will the no-deal Brexit that the PM is trying so hard to achieve cost the country?
Of course the debt has gone up , we are still running At a deficit which Is certainly in a better state than it was in 2010.
Those sort of quotes about debt has risen always makes me laugh , wonder what it Would be with labour sorry momentum in charge ?
As I do when reading those sort of quotes about deficit. Perhaps it's escaped your attention, but in 2010 we were coming out of a deep recession, so deficit spending is to be expected. Since then, the economy has improved significantly but, strangely, our deficit figures are no better than they were during the bad old days of profligate Labour spending before the crisis.
For example, see here: https://www.ft.com/content/16cb28c0-479f-11e8-8ae9-4b5ddcca99b3
Have we also not forgot that labour were in charge during a boom period and were still running at a deficit, to which the current economy is no where near as strong.
We are now running at below 3% deficit which is where they wanted to be as per protocol for excessive debt.
Labour are coming out with some frightening spending promises , to which I don’t think the U.K. would be able to survive if there is another economy crash.
And for the record yes I do vote conservative, however I certainly am not a fan of the current mob and would vote for labour at the last GE and this one is it was not for Corbyn / momentum taking them far to left for me.
I personally think this is a more balanced on the U.K. debt / deficit.
https://fullfact.org/economy/labour-and-conservative-records-national-debt/
Yes we are still running at a deficit, despite a 2010 promise from George Osborne to balance the books by 2015. We're still waiting.
Oh, and the Tories have borrowed more between 2010-19 than all combined Labour governments since 1945. Source.
That is completely not true as that statement says !
Good thing then that the PM is aiming for a no-deal Brexit, that'll be great for the economy. No, wait...
What a completely flawed argument that is , when we really know in real terms that’s no where near the truth
we all know that labour crashes the economy every time they’re in
Full Fact states whether adjusted for inflation (real terms) or not, the Tories have still borrowed more money in nine years than Labour in 33 years.
fullfact.org said:
It’s a flawed argument
NoMorePacers
Established Member
Can you prove its flaws?
And how bizarre labour voters have voted to leave and indeed the labour leader wants to leave
DynamicSpirit
Established Member
Yeah. Unlike those responsible and fiscally aware Conservatives who are promising loads of new public spending, to be paid for by ... ummm - cutting taxes - and who don't seem to have noticed the problem with that!
How about you provide some evidence to back up this claim?
If our economy is doing so well under the Tories, why are public services so poor?
yes , it’s states it in the very answer the poster gives.
Over those 33 years the economy would not have been as big and indeed nor the government hence the borrowing would be less.
It’s like comparing buying a house in 1970 to now. Average 3 bed house in London in 70’s around £17,500. Very same house now £600,000 guess what I have to borrow a lot more now to buy the same then
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My argument is not flawed, I have provided independent facts to support it. You clearly don't like those facts.
Actually, the recession aside, the UK's GDP between 1990 and 2016 has generally been better when Labour was in government. Growth in earnings has also been slower under the Tories. Source.
Oh, and the recession would have happened regardless of which party was in government.
I have no doubt wages may be growing slower prob due to the fact it’s recovering from a recession and not in a boom period.
I wonder what the cash borrowing of labour was between 1990 and 2016, I bet it’s greater then the previous 33 years of conservative governments ( not including war time )
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I read some very good analysis today about what is paralysing the UK economy. Low paid, low productivity work is systemic in the UK. The Government have been at pains to shout about the unemployment levels but that is totally ignoring the problems facing the UK at the moment. Because there is still an abundance of cheap labour available it is far cheaper for a business to hire a worker on low pay that it is to invest in machinery. If the economic conditions go bad and recession hits, no problem just sack all of your human workforce and reduce your production levels. Machinery on the other hand once you have made the investment its pretty much a permanent investment. I actually believe raising the minimum wage to over £10 an hour might be a very good idea. Stop business from going for the cheap labour option. Force companies to invest and create higher productivity work. The UK is stuck in low productivity cycle. The Government just wants people in some kind of work to make the unemployment figures look good. We need far higher quality jobs and higher skilled jobs. Not just more and more minimum wage nonsense work where people struggle just to get by everyday. I am definitely an advocate of raising the minimum wage radically to try and get the UK out of its low productivity rut it currently is in.
Your point being? Leave ≠ "No Deal"
thenorthern
Established Member
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- 27 May 2013
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Most likely Conservative although my current MP has had to stand aside as his estranged wife has successfully challenged him for his party's nomination which seems a bit odd.
That’s the second one that’s stood aside for their wife after sexual misconduct in the space of a week. https://www.theguardian.com/politic...x-texts-quits-election-to-allow-wife-to-stand
Sounds like he was somewhat forced after not winning the backing of his local party.
thenorthern
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From what I understand it was he lost the renomination ballot on Monday night by one vote (it ended in a tie which meant he didn't therefore have a majority). He then had to stand against others to get the nomination and when he turned up at the meeting he found out that his estranged wife was also there running as well so he dropped out.
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