Quiet Rail

[nanagrampy]

Hi all,

I am just wondering if anybody has done a comparison between rail and motorway noise - how do they compare? That could be a huge way of getting people to accept rail - if it was much quieter. I see Tata Steel have a silent rail track. Do you think this will ever become affordable for use on all railways?

 

[transmanche]

Unfortunately people's perception of noise is often at odds with what the figures will tell you.

Having lived for many years alongside a busy road (albeit an urban 30mph road, not a motorway), the level of noise is fairly constant and you soon switch off to the background level of noise. Railways (by their very nature) don't have a constant level of noise; just occasional 'bursts' of noise, as each train passes.

So even if a railway was quieter than a road, you may find that people notice the railway noise far more than the road noise.

However, this idea of 'silent' track sounds quite interesting. (Just googled it; claims to reduce noise by 50%.)

 

[nanagrampy]

Yes, it is certainly very interesting.

It would help a lot of people and make rail a better option to locals who may otherwise oppose the railway.

It might please a lot of HS2 opponents - though does it make that much of a difference?

 

[Cherry_Picker]

A railway line will give you twenty seconds of noise half a dozen times an hour.
A road is a constant drone for ten or fifteen hours a day.

This is common knowledge and has been for donkeys years, but people still wont believe it if it doesn't suit their argument.

 

[VTPreston_Tez]

My school is adjacent to the WCML and a busyish road. Can safely say the rail is quieter.

 

[button_boxer]

A railway line will give you twenty seconds of noise half a dozen times an hour.
A road is a constant drone for ten or fifteen hours a day.

A constant drone is much easier to ignore than a short burst, your brain will just tune it out after a while.

 

[Harbon 1]

I've managed to stop noticing voyagers and turbostars over the last 12 years, and the road, but I hear the road with horns and loud engines because it's far away enough to blank out, but close enough to hear changes

 

[Clip]

A constant drone is much easier to ignore than a short burst, your brain will just tune it out after a while.

Having lived backed onto the Chatham mainline for around 10 years in my youth I can tell you that you tune out those 20 second bursts after a while. Unless its a big steam train

 

[dvboy]

A constant drone is much easier to ignore than a short burst, your brain will just tune it out after a while.

Unless you suffer from hyperacusis, misophonia or other similar hearing problems.

 

[RichmondCommu]

Having lived backed onto the Chatham mainline for around 10 years in my youth I can tell you that you tune out those 20 second bursts after a while. Unless its a big steam train

In all fairness EMU's are much quieter than diesel powered trains. Another factor would be how fast the trains were going when they passed by your property.

 

[sonorguy]

Unless you suffer from hyperacusis, misophonia or other similar hearing problems.

In which case living near a road OR railway will be a problem.

 

[Harbon 1]

In all fairness EMU's are much quieter than diesel powered trains.

Unless its a Class 390 a speed, they scream through!

 

[coastwallker]

We back onto the line too and I don't hear the routine trains, but the once a day Cross Country and the odd freight train do break into the sub-concious. T

I find the main A road which is much further away more intrusive

 

[Essexman]

Residents made huge fuss about the High Speed Line at Purfleet where I work, but trains are much quieter than the C2C ones that rattle along on adjacent tracks and both are quieter than the A13 - try walking at Rainham marshes

 

[Sir_Clagalot]

I used to live next to a fairly major RAF station, and yes it was bloody noisy at times you got used to it!!

 

[Jeni]

Once you get used to the noise, you do notice when it stops. I used to live alongside the M5 and had big difficulties sleeping on the nights when it was closed!

To be honest, the few times I've been staying alongside a railway, it hasn't really been that noticeable!

 

[dvboy]

In which case living near a road OR railway will be a problem.

In which case living full stop can be a problem.

 

[nanagrampy]

Thank you all for your replies. Some very interesting points of view. I had been interested to see if railway could be a silent future for Britain but it seems that may never be the case.

 

[Harbon 1]

Once you get used to the noise, you do notice when it stops. I used to live alongside the M5 and had big difficulties sleeping on the nights when it was closed!

To be honest, the few times I've been staying alongside a railway, it hasn't really been that noticeable!

I knew something was up on a Saturday, it was all a bit quiet, and turns out the line was closed for engineering works

 

[Inspector999]

Walked over the Medway viaduct this weekend. safe to say I couldn't hear the trains for all the motorway racket. But a mile or so to the east with HS1 between me and the M2 a slightly different story: constant traffic drone and inaudible Javelins but the ageing Eurostars sounded like a jet fighter flying at 6" above ground level!!

 

[ATW Alex 101]

I would say a rail is quieter but not you will not get as used to it as a motorway, like somebody has pointed out, the motorway is just one drone. The worst is a duel carriageway, I once stayed in a place literally centimetres away from one and it was a very loud ZOOM every 10-15 seconds and it kept us all awake.

My house is on a road next to the A41 (the fence of the houses opposite back garden backs onto the A41) and I get used to it because it's a 40 limit. I can easily hear trains coming into Capenhurst if I'm standing outside, I can always hear the horns though.

I remember watching something about HS2 on tele ages ago and a village that could be affected by it gathered everyone and played a recording of trains passing though and they hated it, so why not they use this quiet rail for HS2?

 

[Mojo]

When I lived in Birmingham City Centre the traffic noise was constant from about 7am until 10pm. It was only when the traffic died down, and the general noise of the city, was I able to hear the trains on the line into New Street.

Of course another problem on the roads is the number of antisocial cars and motorbikes which make a huge racket when accelerating or when the driver has the radio turned up loud.

 

[VTPreston_Tez]

Once you get used to the noise, you do notice when it stops. I used to live alongside the M5 and had big difficulties sleeping on the nights when it was closed!

To be honest, the few times I've been staying alongside a railway, it hasn't really been that noticeable!

Agreed. I stayed next to Tower Gateway & Fenchurch Street stations once in London, with a view onto the tracks and after I got used to the 357s and the DLR noises I also experienced the same problems.

 

[Tiny Tim]

Noise from trains is, of course, intermittent which is bound to make it more noticeable to people nearby. Complaints about noise nuisance (whatever it's source) often seem to stem from an obsession on the part of the complainant. Environmental health officers are frequently called upon to test the noise emissions from factories, pubs, fairgrounds, skateboard parks, village halls and chickens. Mostly noise levels are well within statutory limits, the problem being one of mountains being made from molehills. Here in Devizes a local pub was the frequent object of complaints by one individual. When an EHO test failed to register any significant readings, the householder asked for the meter to be placed on the bedroom window sill. A strange place to sleep.

 

[Cliveblackpool]

There is Silenttrack® to make rail even quieter!

SilentTrack®
Reduces overall train pass-by noise by
3-7 dB (A).
tata Steel has developed Silenttrack® to help rail operators save costs on lines that pass through urban areas where noise levels must be minimised. Silenttrack® uses sound absorbers on the rail web and upper part of the foot to reduce noise – eliminating the need to construct expensive noise-abatement walls alongside the tracks.
http://www.tatasteeleurope.com/file...ess_Units/Rail/Rail Technical Guide Final.pdf

http://www.rail.co/2012/04/30/tata-steel-installs-silent-rail-tracks-in-london/

 

[swt_passenger]

There is Silenttrack® to make rail even quieter!

We've gone round in a circle...

As mentioned in the first post, although without the link...

 

[DaveNewcastle]

The acoustic barriers alongside the new bridge over Borough Market should achieve better results than 3-7dB.

Unfortunately people's perception of noise is often at odds with what the figures will tell you.

So true.

I completed a report for a client earlier this year which was in response to complaints of nuisance.
The location was in a City Centre overlooking a busy road junction (with busses and motorists with, er, flamboyant exhaust pipes), a nearby dual carriageway, a few bars with fairly constant lively music, groups of people loudly returning home or to hotels or just hanging around and a busy railway on a curve which produced that distinctive wheel-flange screech several times per hour.

However, the noise that the complainant was concerned with was only audible when there was no traffic, no trains, no pedestrians and no wind - it was hard for the analysts to capture the data because the offending noise was masked by all the other stuff for more than 95% of the time while it was present, and probably more than 99.95% of their entire time at the location.

But to them, that rarely audible and relatively quiet sound was 'nuisance'. And none of the evidentially louder noise mattered. To my ear, the frequent railway wheel flange screech would be the most annoying.

[and while I'm on the subject, a Noise Abatement Order has been issued against a Squash Club in respect of the nuisance created by the noise of the squash balls hitting the wall of the court, which are in separate grounds, beyond the foot of the garden of a house whose occupants claimed that the noise of those distant squash balls 'makes their lives a misery'.]

The perception of noise is indeed quite different from the data, and is not the same for all of us.

 

[Johnuk123]

A railway line will give you twenty seconds of noise half a dozen times an hour.
A road is a constant drone for ten or fifteen hours a day.

This is common knowledge and has been for donkeys years, but people still wont believe it if it doesn't suit their argument.

That's right, the worst railway for noise will never be as bad as a motorway.