Railway switchboard is no more

[Phil.]

Does this now presume to mean that all railway locations have access to a B.T. telephone to make emergency calls or have all railway telephones have the ability to route a 999 call straight to the B.T. emergency operator?

 

[Please Explain]

As someone who used this fantastic service almost every day I was / still am bitterly disappointed about the loss of the operator.
We had an email sent out a week before telling us that it is being shut down due to "new technology becoming available" and to start saving numbers we use regularly.
I'd love to know what this "new technology" is that is supposed to replace the national switchboard?

What are you supposed to do now if say your booking office staff somewhere in Essex and someone is traveling to say Thurso and something is going to pay on the other end using SILK, until last week you could have rang 100 and asked tk be put through to Thurso. What in gods green earth are you now supposed to do in a situation like this? As far as I know there is no national location directory with internal telephone numbers, if there is we don't have access to it.

BRT as it was known back in the day, had an interesting history, being sold off prior to privatisation it became BRT Racel (they even inherited few class 20 locos), was then absorbed by Thales in 1999 and then ended up being taken over by Network Rail. The operator switchboard staff (based at Glasgow and Crewe) became employed by Global Crossing, then finally TUPE'd to Level Three Communications in 2009, whom they were employed by until 23:59 on August 31.
All the operator staff were fantastic at what they did and were always happy to have chat with you on the phone before they connected you or gave you the required number.

I may have made one of the final calls to them about 23:50 that night to request some numbers to write down before they would possibly be lost forever. I was very sad to hear from the guy on the other end of the line in Glasgow that he and 90 of his colleagues would be made redundant at midnight and P45'd as Level Three had no other use for them. Great way to reward 10 years loyal service.. Crewe was stood down at 18:00 the day before. He said they had many safeguarded ex-BR staff there too, one lady who had done over 30 odd years, coming straight from school. Said he was taking a well earned holiday and then.. Who knows... Very sad.

About the 999 calls, he said that a skeleton crew were being retained for a week or so to handle these until they are migrated over to the national system so I believe yes, the emergency services will no longer be able to pinpoint our location in the same way the switchboard could. However I stand to be corrected on this as I'm no expert on telephony.

Overall, backward step and a great loss of a highly useful national service which as far as I'm aware has had no replacement put in place.

The switchboard will be missed. :cry:

 

[theageofthetra]

Prior to the closure of this very useful service if a pax or member of staff hit the emergency call button on one of the platform mounted information call points did you go straight to Glasgow? What happens now? Similarly what happens with the platform mounted emergency phones (not SPT's)

 

[Please Explain]

Cant speak for elsewhere in the country but if you hit the train information button here it will connect with Three Bridges ROC. The emergency button however, I believe it connected to the Level Three staff at either Glasgow or Crewe. As of now, it should connect directly to a 999 call handler with the emergency services, providing it has all been migrated over.

With regards to the ET's, they can still be used to make & receive calls (providing you know the number of course..), all that has changed is that you can no longer dial 100 for switchboard and ask to be connected to: XYZ. If you dial 100 now you will get: "This service is no longer available, please contact your help desk. Contact information should be available on your intranet."
Except it isn't!

 

[infobleep]

The internal Railway telephony infrastructure from the BR days is called Railnet and all Stations, network rail and signal boxes were/are connected. There has been no investment in bringing this Infrastructure into the 21st century and will no longer be a supported product. Railnet users have been asked to seek alternative telephony systems. Each TOC will be doing their own thing meaning there will eventually be less jointed fixed telephony in the rail industry. This is probably partially the reason behind the closing of the Switchboard, along with the improvement in Mobile comms. It is no longer simple to keep the same telephone number of a Station when it transfers between Franchises, when Franchises now use different Telcos .

Can't phone numbers be transferred, like can happen with landlines or to losing franchise holders like to keep their numbers, even though they are no longer running trains or managing stations?

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Stranded Individual, Location Known - it's a way of selling (only Anytime) tickets remotely if a third party is able to pay at a different ticket office.

Never knew such a thing were possible.

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A consequence of this is that there is no longer a railway emergency operator who can direct 999 calls and report your exact location - emergency calls will now go direct to the normal 999 operator, who will not have the location details of all ETD phones.

Well perhaps someone should give the normal. 999 operators details of all the ETD phones or is there a risk in shsring this information?

I don't agree with large companies not operating a switch board. However I'm not powerful enough to do anything about it.

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If the entire function could be automated both on a smartphone app and an interactive self service phone system this would be largely the same all be it self service

Sounds good so don't expect it anytime soon.

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[theageofthetra]

Cant speak for elsewhere in the country but if you hit the train information button here it will connect with Three Bridges ROC. The emergency button however, I believe it connected to the Level Three staff at either Glasgow or Crewe. As of now, it should connect directly to a 999 call handler with the emergency services, providing it has all been migrated over.

So whereas the specialist railway staff at Glasgow would know straight away which station/platform you were ringing from will the 999 service know that without the pax/staff giving the location?

The lack of information given to rail staff working in safety critical on this change to an important part of railway procedure is shocking.

 

[infobleep]

Cant speak for elsewhere in the country but if you hit the train information button here it will connect with Three Bridges ROC. The emergency button however, I believe it connected to the Level Three staff at either Glasgow or Crewe. As of now, it should connect directly to a 999 call handler with the emergency services, providing it has all been migrated over.

On the flip side though, this means it may actually get answered at night during disruption. Previously it wasn't always answered, from my personal experience.

Of course it also means non emergency calls might increase to 999 as it's very easy to hit the button but who cares about that.

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[hairyhandedfool]

....More likely staff are issued with a separate paper, possibly laminated, list of "useful" numbers and left to get on with it....

Haven't got the luxury of a company phone yet (apparently my manager (which I also technically don't have at the minute) has one for me that I have to sign for, then keep in my locker because it's only for work and I can't use it while on duty in the ticket office). I'm told that the phone does have 'important numbers' on it, though I am somewhat skeptical given the number of staff members (with mobiles) who ask around for phone numbers like HR, Payroll, I.S. (apparently it's not IT anymore), rosters, control and various main stations.

Silly question, but isn't there a railway telephone directory where you can look the numbers up and then dial yourself rather than go through the switchboard?

Northern (under Abellio) had a very searchable list of Northern staff and stations which was very useful and could be searched for various criteria, like "location" or "department". However in the final year they decided that in order to improve communication between manager and staff, they had to improve it.... by incorporating the search engine into that of the entire company website and removing the ability to select search criteria. In fact it is so hard to use I can barely find my own station's phone number, nevermind anyone else's. They might as well have bought a bail of hay, put it in the mess room and left me to search it for a needle they haven't bought yet.

 

[ag51ruk]

From the Network Rail Safety Advice published last week (available on Safety Central):

Previously the location of 999 emergency landline calls could be identified by our telecoms provider Level 3 Communications Ltd, aiding the caller, and emergency services, to locate the incident.

The supplier has given us notice to confirm they will no longer supply this service from 1 September.

This change affects all landline phones on Network Rail infrastructure and in corporate buildings.

From 1 September, all emergency calls will go directly to a British Telecommunications (BT) operator, just as they would if you made an emergency call from your personal mobile.

It is the supplier’s choice to withdraw this service and their only contractual obligation is to ensure that emergency calls reach a 999 operator .... Colleagues can still use landlines to call 999 but should be aware that they will need to give location information.

In addition to this, all emergency services have been briefed on the change and its implications.

 

[Please Explain]

On the flip side though, this means it may actually get answered at night during disruption. Previously it wasn't always answered, from my personal experience.

Of course it also means non emergency calls might increase to 999 as it's very easy to hit the button but who cares about that.

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Really? I believe it was manned 24/7, 365 right up until the end.
I never once had to wait when dialing 100. Though I've never used the ET to make a 999 call, if there was an emergency involving train movements the first person I'd be calling would be the signaller.

And yes, lots more nuisance calls from the help points with these changes I think...

 

[CharlieSpotted]

Regarding 999, the telecoms provider is required to submit an entry into a central database (maintained by BT) matching a caller ID to a specific location for each and every fixed line (that's capable of dialling 999) that they maintain.

I sure hope someone made sure that all those database entries for all those lines were up to date before they enabled them to dial 999 directly... The consequences (in terms of penalties and obviously the potential for real-world harm) are very severe.

 

[Please Explain]

So whereas the specialist railway staff at Glasgow would know straight away which station/platform you were ringing from will the 999 service know that without the pax/staff giving the location?.

Yes exactly, they would be able to pinpoint your location wherever you were on the network straight away and pass it onto the emergency services.
Now you will be directly connected with them and have to give them this exact information yourself, hence if someone is playing games with the help point or even just makes a genuine mistake and hits emergency instead of train information, they will now be wasting the valuable time of the emergency services.

 

[Dai Corner]

Yes exactly, they would be able to pinpoint your location wherever you were on the network straight away and pass it onto the emergency services.
Now you will be directly connected with them and have to give them this exact information yourself, hence if someone is playing games with the help point or even just makes a genuine mistake and hits emergency instead of train information, they will now be wasting the valuable time of the emergency services.

One hopes that this location information was not thrown away when the last shift clocked off but is made available to the (BT) emergency operators, as all public telecoms firms (are required to?) do.

 

[theageofthetra]

Will be interesting to see how many unnecessary calls to 999 there will now be as a pax, frustrated that the information button doesn't get responded to presses red.

 

[AngusH]

I originally posted that they were obliged to pass location information through for 999 calls. But I've realised that there's actually a valid loophole if they are not a "public" network operator.

Assuming it's officially a private network there is no requirement.


Doesn't sound at all right, but may be within the ofcom rules.

 

[deltic1989]

Stranded Individual, Location Known - it's a way of selling (only Anytime) tickets remotely if a third party is able to pay at a different ticket office.

This is as opposed to Location Unknown? I'm not taking the Mickey, is there such a procedure?

I was speaking to one of the lovely lady OM's on the Fratton desk for SWT last night who explained that thier phones were internet based, and that explained why they kept disconnecting. Made a job that was supposed to take 5 mins, last half an hour.

 

[wimbledonpete]

I left the railway back in 1998 but that number's brought back memories - used to be a Waterloo number unless I'm mistaken - 928 5151. Used to work in the TEB there back in 1986 which was 928 5100. Not sure why my brain remembers this.

 

[Gonzoiku]

I left the railway back in 1998 but that number's brought back memories - used to be a Waterloo number unless I'm mistaken - 928 5151. Used to work in the TEB there back in 1986 which was 928 5100. Not sure why my brain remembers this.

Not mistaken, Pete, I remember both those numbers from a stint at Eversholt St in 1989-90. Wish I could remember all the other numbers in the BRB phone directory!

GZ

 

[Surreytraveller]

This is as opposed to Location Unknown? I'm not taking the Mickey, is there such a procedure?

How would you issue them a ticket if you didn't know where they were?

 

[infobleep]

Really? I believe it was manned 24/7, 365 right up until the end.
I never once had to wait when dialing 100. Though I've never used the ET to make a 999 call, if there was an emergency involving train movements the first person I'd be calling would be the signaller.

And yes, lots more nuisance calls from the help points with these changes I think...

Well I never once saw a response when the button was hit. Nor was there a response from the info button, hence why the emergency button had been hit. I don't doubt it was manned 24/7 though.

I think if the info button isn't answered then people will pass emergency button. They won't know it calls 999. I wasn't even aware it previously went to a central call centre equivalent of 999.

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--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I originally posted that they were obliged to pass location information through for 999 calls. But I've realised that there's actually a valid loophole if they are not a "public" network operator.

Assuming it's officially a private network there is no requirement.


Doesn't sound at all right, but may be within the ofcom rules.

Well if it's within Ofcom rules then it's fine. Nothing to see here move along. Lol.

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[physics34]

Yep the switchboard was great

 

[theageofthetra]

So here's a hypothetical scenario. Passenger on the GTR down platform at St Pancras Intl(or any other station with multiple platforms/operators/level) right down the country end sees a person or object on the line. They press the red emergency button on the information point.

What I would like to know is the sequence of how trains would get stopped before and after the closure of the railway 999 switchboard & in particular how the location of that call is picked up.

 

[deltic1989]

How would you issue them a ticket if you didn't know where they were?

This is what I was thinking when I asked the question. On that basis then why would it be necessary to specify Location Known? For a different thread maybe.

 

[najaB]

On that basis then why would it be necessary to specify Location Known? For a different thread maybe.

Because SILK is a cool acronym?

 

[hairyhandedfool]

This is what I was thinking when I asked the question. On that basis then why would it be necessary to specify Location Known? For a different thread maybe.

For clarity?

 

[reddragon]

The railway telephone network was once second only to the post office (BT) phone network.

Not only were all BR stations, phone & offices on the network, plus all LUL stations, but so were all of London Transport, including bus depots, NBC bus depots and some city bus companies.

I can remember my dad taking an LT excursion bus out and the garage called internally the local destination bus garage to arrange fuelling, 55 Broadway for passes and BR stations for lost property etc.

A huge step backwards

 

[Please Explain]

The railway telephone network was once second only to the post office (BT) phone network.

Not only were all BR stations, phone & offices on the network, plus all LUL stations, but so were all of London Transport, including bus depots, NBC bus depots and some city bus companies.

I can remember my dad taking an LT excursion bus out and the garage called internally the local destination bus garage to arrange fuelling, 55 Broadway for passes and BR stations for lost property etc.

A huge step backwards

Thanks for sharing your memories, and yes its absolutely a backward step. It was an extremely useful service that will be sadly missed.

 

[theageofthetra]

Does the loss of the railway 999 service affect TFL, LO and TFL trams emergency call button routing?

 

[High Dyke]

Does this now presume to mean that all railway locations have access to a B.T. telephone to make emergency calls or have all railway telephones have the ability to route a 999 call straight to the B.T. emergency operator?

Far from it. We still have manned signalling locations that don't even have an outside phone line, just a direct line to the neighbouring signal box.

 

[janb]

Northern (under Abellio) had a very searchable list of Northern staff and stations which was very useful and could be searched for various criteria, like "location" or "department". However in the final year they decided that in order to improve communication between manager and staff, they had to improve it.... by incorporating the search engine into that of the entire company website and removing the ability to select search criteria. In fact it is so hard to use I can barely find my own station's phone number, nevermind anyone else's. They might as well have bought a bail of hay, put it in the mess room and left me to search it for a needle they haven't bought yet.

If you click on Who's Who in The Shed, then Stations Contacts you will get a spreadsheet with Northern station numbers on.