Reading Buses to operate some local buses in Slough

[cactustwirly]

That was very short lived, is there a replacements? The other company cant have put a dent in the service already?

Courtney's route is subsidised...
I doubt there was enough custom to support a commercial bus route in the first place, Windsor to Slough has a train every 20 minutes which is cheaper & faster than the bus.
Dedworth is rather small and quite affluent so I wouldn't imagine there would be too many bus users.
I really wasn't surprised when First cut the route tbh

 

[Wirewiper]

I wonder if Reading Buses took a gamble, that if they registered the 2 commercially Courtney would drop out?

 

[overthewater]

I thought there was a law banning Subadise routes competing with commercial ones?

 

[ACBest]

I thought there was a law banning Subadise routes competing with commercial ones?

Only if that subsidy is from a local authority if I remember correctly - private subsidy is okay.

 

[CatfordCat]

I thought there was a law banning Subadise routes competing with commercial ones?

The position isn't entirely black and white - the 1985 Transport Act included a duty on local authorities "not to inhibit competition" although the 2000 Transport Act gave authorities powers to set transport policies and procure services that met those policies if the commercial market wasn't.

Obviously this applies only to local transport authorities, so if a service is funded by a private developer or business park owner etc then they can set their own criteria.

Where you get a very infrequent commercial service, it's probably OK for an authority to fill some of the gaps. Or to contract a service at times of day / week the commercial service doesn't run (often evenings / Sundays).

But if you had (for example) a commercial service every half hour, it might be dubious if the authority put on a contracted service on the other quarters. And it's more complicated where a contracted service shares a bit of road with a commercial service, but the contracted service is the only route to a point beyond or off the line of the commercial route. (most councils will insist on the contracted operators' fares not undercutting the commercial operator on any shared bit of route for example.)

I have no idea just what's happened in this case, but it is possible that the decision to run commercially may have been made after the local council/s involved entered in to a contract - and I don't know what notice period there is in any such contract. Some councils will allow a situation like this a few months to settle down.

While I've absolutely no involvement or knowledge in what's happened here, it was not unknown in the earlier days of deregulation for a tendered service to be awarded to operator A, then operator B would register some / all of it commercially in the hope that council would terminate their contract. De-registration of some or all of operator B's commercial service would usually follow. Broadly, the industry has grown up a bit since then and I would be a bit surprised if that's what has happened here.

 

[Non Multi]

I wonder if Reading Buses took a gamble, that if they registered the 2 commercially Courtney would drop out?

From what I understood a while back was that Reading Transport management incorrectly assumed, after speaking to RBWM council that the route 2 wasn't going to be a contracted bus route. Reading Transport seem to think that running services in direct competition is a wasteful use of their resources; thus have axed TV2.

I wonder how viable the 2, 10 & 15 routes will be in the long term if Heathrow end (or reduce) their financial support, as has happened on First route 7. Route 7 (Slough-Heathrow) now has 4 buses per hour instead of 8.

As an aside, the Solo SR's that Courtney are using on the Heathrow/RBWM contracted routes are ex-BSkyB shuttle buses that have uncomfortable, thinly padded seats.

 

[nesw]

I’m of the opinion that Reading might be trying to do too many things at once and giving less attention to it’s local services. The latest Passenger Focus Bus survey shows a drop in satisfaction over a number of categories unrelated to congestion.

I know that additional revenue is welcomed by ‘sweating the assets’ with lucrative rail replacement work however, ventures such as the 702 and Slough local services are expensive and possibly low margin. Given the dramatic expansion of services from Reading to Bracknell in recent years following First pulling out and the Newbury contracts, that’s a heck of a lot of work in just a few years.

 

[4cryingoutloud]

There's an article in the latest issue of Passenger Transport magazine that suggests a new hourly route 703 starting under the Greenline brand between Bracknell and Heathrow - though I've not seen this mentioned anywhere online yet.

 

[overthewater]

Something interesting has turn up on twitter: Someone ask about No2 getting the chop and this was the reply.

Not entirely. We will be issuing a customer news update very shortly.

 

[Non Multi]

A while back I posted this:

RB should bring back the hourly 191 (Slough - Windsor - Ascot - Bracknell), to compliment the 702. IIRC, First (run from Southampton) withdrew the 191 and nearly withdrew the 702 from Bracknell in return for losing the bus war against Courtney. Courtney didn't want to take it on when they won. Even in the early 2000's it was a regular and frequent double deck route. All gone.

Greenline 703 (Bracknell - Heathrow) might revive the 191 service under a new number. The 191 in the late 1990's was Heathrow - Slough - Windsor - Ascot - Bracknell - Wokingham. I'm assuming the 703 is their replacement for TV2's Slough - Windsor route, dropping Dedworth; not replacing Greenline 702. Doubling the hourly Greenline services between Slough-Bracknell would certainly make the route more attractive, as well as easier to sell to potential passengers.

 

[alex397]

Another reply to a Tweet, this time on the GreenLine 702 feed:

"........The good news it that we will be doubling our service from Legoland from 8th May".

https://twitter.com/GreenLine702/status/975054315365847040 . Off-topic slightly, but looking at the replies between customer and Green Line, it shows the benefits of Twitter for customer service. Starting off with an annoyed customer, and ending up with a happy customer!

 

[darloscott]

If that's true I could imagine Heathrow to Legoland doing quite well if marketed to people with a stop over at Heathrow maybe.

 

[Non Multi]

Greenline 703 has been registered: https://www.vehicle-operator-licens...registered-local-bus-services/details/517039/

 

[Wirewiper]

On another forum the changes are reported as:

Route 2 - withdrawn
Route 702 - off-peak service withdrawn between Legoland and Bracknell (peak service continues to run through)
Route 703 - NEW ROUTE: Heathrow Terminal 5 - Slough - Windsor - Legoland - Bracknell

The changes to take effect from Tuesday 8th May (7th is a public holiday)

This is a cut-and-paste of the comments I made on that other forum:

[..] it seems like the resources from route 2 will be folded into the new 703, which will still allow Reading Buses to claim two buses an hour between Slough, Windsor and Legoland. Dedworth will be left to Courtney Buses.

The new 703 will also allow a more reliable service to operate between Windsor and Bracknell, where it doubles up as the local bus route, as it won't be subject to the vagaries of Central London traffic. Quite a lot of Legoland staff are young people living in Bracknell who don't have their own transport and they will welcome a more reliable link. The area also gets a new direct link to Heathrow Airport into the bargain - currently there isn't one from Bracknell and Ascot and there has not been one for many years.

All in all the changes recognise that, apart from the peak commuter flows, the route actually consists of two discrete markets, both of which have potential for growth - leisure travel from London to Windsor Castle and Legoland, and local travel along the Slough - Windsor - Ascot - Bracknell corridor.

 

[overthewater]

Is 703 hourly or 30mins? If I was them I would go for 30min service for the summer.

 

[cactustwirly]

I don't think the 703 will last very long, it won't be able to compete with the train on the Slough - Windsor & Bracknell - Ascot flows.
That just leaves Ascot to Windsor and Heathrow to Bracknell, I don't think the flows will be big enough to sustain a commercial bus operation.

 

[overthewater]

Mr doom and gloom here.

 

[cactustwirly]

Mr doom and gloom here.

Maybe I know the area well, I live there for half the year!
It's very affuent with a high car ownership, and good rail links.
I just don't see it working.

 

[Non Multi]

IIRC Bracknell to Heathrow by train involves SWR train to Feltham, then take the 490 or 285 London bus for Hatton Cross Station (for terminals via Piccadilly line) or Central Bus Station. I bet it's fun with loads of luggage.

If the 'Airtrack' Heathrow southern rail connection at Staines had been built (and not treated like a political football), I doubt serving Heathrow would be viable.

 

[wiltshirebloke]

I don't think the 703 will last very long, it won't be able to compete with the train on the Slough - Windsor & Bracknell - Ascot flows

But to get to Slough from Bracknell or Ascot would involve a change at Reading or Staines and a walk between Windsor Riverside & Central , so would be advantageous end to end.

 

[nesw]

Running to Heathrow will also be a ‘foot in the door’ should First decide to pull out.

 

[Robertj21a]

Running to Heathrow will also be a ‘foot in the door’ should First decide to pull out.

More likely 'when'.

 

[overthewater]

Maybe I know the area well, I live there for half the year!
It's very affuent with a high car ownership, and good rail links.
I just don't see it working.

That is all beside the point, where do you think new bus passengers are going to come from? should companies just sit back and let the decline carry on? Bus companies need to go after Car users

More likely 'when'.

You said it, not me

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

That is all beside the point, where do you think new bus passengers are going to come from? should companies just sit back and let the decline carry on? Bus companies need to go after Car users

Indeed - if only operators like Stagecoach, or Arriva, or Transdev could come up with some sort of premium offering - perhaps with leather seating, wifi, USB charging etc. Perhaps some sort of premium branding based on a precious metal or gemstone?

However, the problem in many instances is the lack of bus priority or that which is in place is poorly designed, applied or enforced. Therefore, buses get stuck in the same traffic but then also have to make stops etc.

 

[Busaholic]

Why the 703 number, which implies Green Line? I demand an extension to Wrotham.

 

[Wirewiper]

The 703 will be hourly I expect. Don't forget:

- The 702 will no longer be operating between Legoland and Bracknell except during peak hours, so it will replace that.
- The 703 uses resources freed up by no longer operating route 2 and by cutting back the 702 at off-peak times.

Despite doom and gloom, I reckon there is scope to grow the market along the 703 corridor. As I mentioned before, a number of the passengers are young people living in Bracknell and working in Legoland. The 702 is always going to struggle with reliability, due to traffic conditions in London. A more reliable 703 could encourage more young people in Bracknell to take up employment at Legoland and use the bus. I also think the link to Heathrow has potential, it provides a direct service from Bracknell and Ascot that has not existed for many years, and is also more direct from Windsor than the circuitous no. 8 (and unlike Courtney's no. 10, it runs all day and not just at Heathrow shift change times).

Busaholic - no extension to Wrotham I'm afraid, but you could campaign to extend the 703 to Wokingham

 

[Non Multi]

Why the 703 number, which implies Green Line? I demand an extension to Wrotham.

Of course in the 1970's the Green Line 726 service (what is now London Buses X26) ran between Windsor and Gravesend.

 

[wiltshirebloke]

Looks like First are trying to combat the new 703, as they are starting a 'fast' service between Windsor, Slough and T5 :

First Berkshire is in final stages of introducing a fast bus link connecting Windsor, Slough and Heathrow Terminal 5, the company announced. Airport workers in particular, as well as people needing to catch an early flight, will benefit from the service which starts just after 4am. The new service 9 starts on 2 June and will run 7 days a week, every 30 minutes Mondays to Saturdays and hourly on Sundays. The Service 9 will also link with Service 8 to form a circular service, calling at Slough, Terminal 5, Staines, Egham, Windsor, Slough.
​

https://www.firstgroup.com/berkshir...ws/coming-soon-fast-frequent-bus-link-between

 

[Wirewiper]

Looks like First are trying to combat the new 703, as they are starting a 'fast' service between Windsor, Slough and T5

The irony is, until last year First operated a route 77 which did precisely that! And it also served Dedworth for good measure ....

Reading Buses' Greenline 703 will still provide a unique link from Bracknell and Ascot to Heathrow, and the fares are pretty reasonable too - £5.50 adult single, and their simplyNetwork area is being extended to include Heathrow Terminal 5 so their Day and Group tickets will also be valid.

I should mention that full timetables and fare information for the 702 and 703 from 8th May is now available:

http://www.reading-buses.co.uk/articles/green-line-timetable-fares-change/

 

[W-on-Sea]

It's been reported locally that Reading Buses will be (or "are expected to be") effectively taking over (and substantially expanding) the town services in Henley-on-Thames too. Seemingly just a one-bus service, replacing the existing part-time service provided by White's Coaches (presuamably the Thames Travel X38 journeys that effectively provide part of this service when the White's one isn't running will continue) . http://www.henleystandard.co.uk/new...s-with-friendly-drivers-and-longer-hours.html , subsidised by the town council. But another small move out of their core geographic area.

The town council is expected to agree a deal with Reading Buses to take over the routes for the town centre from Whites Coaches.

The new service will run from 7am to 7pm every weekday compared with the current 151 to 154 services, which run from 9.30am to 2pm.

The new service will have new stops, including Townlands Memorial Hospital, the station and Highlands Park once the new houses there are occupied...