Santander Branches to close

[cjp]

But that is not a reason why I should choose branch banking, an archaic and inconvenient waste of my time, over mobile banking which is much more convenient.

FWIW I'd happily switch to mobile ticketing if the TOCs could actually get it right. I have noticed that on many journeys recently more than 50% of people seem to be using it even with its substantial faults.

You, and others, keep on about wasting time or saving time but tell me what do you do with the extra 30 seconds, or 30 minutes you have saved? How does the saved time enhance your life, your living standards?
Probably the same way that those who drive at 30mph in a 20mph limit are smug about their having saved a minute to spend at the next delay where I catch them up. My apologies if that is not you and you spend the minutes gained making the world a better place - I am just too cynical/realistic this morning

 

[cjp]

Arguably, "in person" banking facilities are still very accessible as you can pay in cheques and withdraw cash at post offices. Post offices exist in most larger villages and even modest sized towns have several branches. Post offices are often open in the evening and on Sunday.

True and I do use these "manual ATMs"

 

[Bletchleyite]

You, and others, keep on about wasting time or saving time but tell me what do you do with the extra 30 seconds, or 30 minutes you have saved? How does the saved time enhance your life, your living standards?

It would take me well over an hour to visit my nearest branch bank - 20 minutes to get there, park and walk from the car park (or just to walk all the way), 20 minutes ish to queue and conduct transactions, 20 minutes ish back. By bus make it an hour and a half due to the frequency. Not everyone lives near the centre of a small to medium-sized town.

Add to that that I can't really do it during the working day (unless I want not to have lunch on that day), and on Saturdays I prefer to do other things. Open it, as Metro Bank do, out of hours and Sundays and I might have more chance of getting there, but why should I pay the cost of an inferior service?

 

[Bletchleyite]

True and I do use these "manual ATMs"

Why would one even consider queueing to use a post office to withdraw a round sum of cash? It is a pointless waste of time with no benefit at all[1]. Use an ATM, or increasingly pay by card.

FWIW, I've noticed a bit of a shift over the last year or so in that near enough everywhere other than the likes of the local chippy (which is still cash only) now look at you funny if you don't pay by card - increasingly they will put it through to the card machine by default. Cash is dying, and that can't come soon enough.

[1] I do feel sorry for people whose only social interaction is the post office - but shouldn't we be providing, as a society, for these people better than that?

 

[underbank]

Cash is dying, and that can't come soon enough.

I doubt that the tens of thousands of people who were in areas with no electricity for several days due to Storm Desmond will agree with that!

I do feel sorry for people whose only social interaction is the post office - but shouldn't we be providing, as a society, for these people better than that?

Yes we should. It's a bit of a cop out expecting/requiring unprofitable businesses to stay open just so Great Aunt Mabel doesn't get lonely. That's definitely something that charities, churches or local councils should be dealing with. If a business/shop wants to become a "social hub" then perhaps it should get support to do so. There are more and more of such "hubs" in rural areas which is a good thing. In a local village where the council (Labour!) closed the library, it was re-opened by a group of village volunteers who now run it as a community hub which is probably the way forward.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I doubt that the tens of thousands of people who were in areas with no electricity for several days due to Storm Desmond will agree with that!

In most of the places that seriously affected, businesses were mostly not open due to failure of the likes of fridges and there being a foot of water on the ground anyway. So evacuation of such areas is the best bet anyway.

Yes we should. It's a bit of a cop out expecting/requiring unprofitable businesses to stay open just so Great Aunt Mabel doesn't get lonely. That's definitely something that charities, churches or local councils should be dealing with. If a business/shop wants to become a "social hub" then perhaps it should get support to do so. There are more and more of such "hubs" in rural areas which is a good thing. In a local village where the council (Labour!) closed the library, it was re-opened by a group of village volunteers who now run it as a community hub which is probably the way forward.

Agreed, and while I'm not happy for a bank to make my life difficult for this, I am happy for my Council Tax to be spent on such amenities.

 

[radamfi]

If you opened a Girobank account in the 70s and operated it using the post office and by post, not much has changed and you can still use the now Santander account just like you always have. There are fewer post offices now but the ones that are left now have longer opening hours.

 

[underbank]

In most of the places that seriously affected, businesses were mostly not open due to failure of the likes of fridges and there being a foot of water on the ground anyway. So evacuation of such areas is the best bet anyway.

Not in Lancaster/Morecambe/Heysham it wasn't. The actual flooding was very localised (including the electrical substation), so the vast majority of people/businesses weren't affected by flood water. It was the lack of electricity, phone lines and mobile signals that paralysed the area. Those with cash could access taxis, shops that were open, etc. Those without cash were reliant on charity and community spirit! Not a nice situation!

 

[Bletchleyite]

Not in Lancaster/Morecambe/Heysham it wasn't. The actual flooding was very localised (including the electrical substation), so the vast majority of people/businesses weren't affected by flood water. It was the lack of electricity, phone lines and mobile signals that paralysed the area. Those with cash could access taxis, shops that were open, etc. Those without cash were reliant on charity and community spirit! Not a nice situation!

Not a situation that should really have been allowed to happen (and go on as long as it did) without some official resolution, even if that was a free coach service taking people to Preston and back for the duration.

 

[underbank]

Not a situation that should really have been allowed to happen (and go on as long as it did) without some official resolution, even if that was a free coach service taking people to Preston and back for the duration.

It shouldn't, but it did happen. No, there was nothing like a free coach service but even if there had been, there was no communication so people had no way of knowing when and where - the only contact we had was a local radio station for those with battery powered radios! It happened on Saturday and it wasn't even until the Tuesday that a handful of hot food vans appeared in strategic locations, but by then, there'd been some diesel lorry generators parked around the area providing intermittent power. It makes you realise how impotent the "authorities" are when dealing with emergency situations involving huge numbers of people and how much we now rely on electricity and internet!

 

[Killingworth]

Well, you can, switch to a bank whose business model is branch banking - Metro Bank. Because the demand for this is limited, however, you may find you have to travel a bit to reach one of their premises.

If there is substantial demand for branch banking they will do well and spread. However, I suspect you are in a tiny minority. Personally, I am better served by as much of my banking as possible requiring no intervention at all. And even when things go wrong, am I better off having to go into a branch to discuss fraud having seen a stack of it on my monthly statement, or that I block my Monzo card within seconds of the first dodgy transaction popping up?

Metro Bank is hardly convenient for those residing outside it's core area. Peterborough and Northampton are as far north as it seems to get. Nothing else in the Midlands, North, Wales, Scotland or the South-West, see; https://www.metrobankonline.co.uk/store-locator/

Offering a 7 day service is fine, but making it profitable for any bank in 2019 must be very hard to achieve - which helps explain the restricted area of operations. Metro must be subject to similar cost/revenue pressures as Santander, Lloyds, HSBC and the rest. A new starter avoids historic baggage but has other pressures to challenge it. Without a strong critical mass of active customers for the right services it may struggle. Historically banks that expand their loan book rapidly tend to fall into difficulty after 5-10 years as bad debts and risky ventures come to light. That happens to big and old established banks and former building societies too, mentioning no names. See this Financial Times report on Metro last week is interesting; https://www.ft.com/content/798c6c8c-1ee3-11e9-b126-46fc3ad87c65

 

[Bletchleyite]

The great difficulty for the likes of Metro Bank is that almost nobody actually wants that service - most people actually prefer doing day to day current account type banking online without the need to ever visit a branch, while the culture has changed such that if you want a financial product that you would prefer to talk about your current account bank is probably the last place you want to go for it (not least because of how FSCS works[1]), hence IFAs and other such services such as mortgage sales via estate agents.

In essence current account banking just needs to be an easily understood, fixed system, while other products are more "woolly" and benefit more from seeking proper advice (beyond just looking at moneysavingexpert.com etc).

[1] FSCS will pay out on the *balance* of all accounts you hold with a given financial services company. This being the case, it is very ill-advised to have mortgage/personal loan (or current account with a whacking overdraft if you have one on terms that make it worth that) and savings in the same place, least of all those offset type accounts, as the outcome of a failure would be your savings being used to pay your mortgage down prior to it being moved to another provider. Almost nobody actually wants this, as otherwise they would already have done it.

 

[krus_aragon]

Metro Bank is hardly convenient for those residing outside it's core area. Peterborough and Northampton are as far north as it seems to get. Nothing else in the Midlands, North, Wales, Scotland or the South-West, see; https://www.metrobankonline.co.uk/store-locator/

Why does a bank have a store finder? (I suppose it's better than a trendy-wine-bar finder...

 

[cjp]

Why would one even consider queueing to use a post office to withdraw a round sum of cash? It is a pointless waste of time with no benefit at all[1]. Use an ATM, or increasingly pay by card.

As I said much earlier in the thread ATMs generally do not dispense either £5 or £50 notes not the coins I and others use at parking meters.

FWIW, I've noticed a bit of a shift over the last year or so in that near enough everywhere other than the likes of the local chippy (which is still cash only) now look at you funny if you don't pay by card - increasingly they will put it through to the card machine by default.

Hmm I wonder about the shops you use - my local corner shops seem to have many small sales and love cash .
And what about the card-less young?

Yes society is changing but, from my perspective, and perhaps that of many others who still use and want to use cash, not necessarily for the better.
Please just accept that all do not choose to handle their finances as you do.
Some changes inconvenience some peoples lives even if you are untroubled which is what all your post have amounted to.

 

[radamfi]

Why does a bank have a store finder? (I suppose it's better than a trendy-wine-bar finder...

Because Metrobank call their branches "stores".

 

[Bletchleyite]

As I said much earlier in the thread ATMs generally do not dispense either £5 or £50 notes not the coins I and others use at parking meters.

What on earth do you need a £50 note for that you can't use 2 x £20 and 1 x £10 for?

£5s can be obtained quite easily by, you know, spending the cash in a shop and getting change, as if you're a "cash person" you inevitably do quite often. Myself, I use RingGo or similar.

Hmm I wonder about the shops you use - my local corner shops seem to have many small sales and love cash .

I hate to think why. Draw your own conclusions.

Or let's say I doubt all the money goes through the books. Just like with tradesmen, who seem fond of cash for precisely that reason.

And what about the card-less young?

What card-less young? You can have an online authorisation debit card from 13. Under that there is GoHenry and the likes.

 

[Starmill]

Hmm I wonder about the shops you use - my local corner shops seem to have many small sales and love cash .

My local shop forces people to pay with cash through underhand methods, a minimum value recently replaced a fee which they've been illegally charging for months. What am I going to do? Stop using the local shop? Why would I feel the need to change the way I've paid there for 20 years. I try to avoid them where possible but when I do have to visit my local Chinese or Pizza takeaways there is no chance they'd accept cards either. In the past month I've been in a bar that was cash only, used a taxi that asked for cash only and an independent station caff that was firmly cash only. The majority of stalls in the market at Manchester City Centre over Christmas and on Market days are local producers, and they're cash only.

 

[Bletchleyite]

My local shop forces people to pay with cash through underhand methods, a minimum value recently replaced a fee which they've been illegally charging for months. What am I going to do? Stop using the local shop? Why would I feel the need to change the way I've paid there for 20 years. I try to avoid them where possible but when I do have to visit my local Chinese or Pizza takeaways there is no chance they'd accept cards either.

My local Chinese takes cards and has for years.

FWIW I'd far rather a fee than a minimum provided that the fee reflected the cost plus no more than 10% profit margin. (Often such fees are in fact a profit centre).

 

[Starmill]

The insistence on the use of cheques also bemuses me. In the last 6 months or so I've been sent cheques for delay repay claims or refund cases in more than half of such transactions, including ones where I'd asked for e-vouchers or RTVs. Northern customer relations can issue cheques but not authorise bank transfers. They hand write the cheques out.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The insistence on the use of cheques also bemuses me. In the last 6 months or so I've been sent cheques for delay repay claims or refund cases in more than half of such transactions, including ones where I'd asked for e-vouchers or RTVs. Northern customer relations can issue cheques but not authorise bank transfers. They hand write the cheques out.

Good lord. Mind you, an awful lot of the rest of Northern (as a TOC) is stuck in the early 1990s, too.

 

[Starmill]

Good lord. Mind you, an awful lot of the rest of Northern (as a TOC) is stuck in the early 1990s, too.

Approved Delay Repay applications are put through their BACS run, and usually appear as pending on my account 3 days in advance of the money's arrival. Unfortunately, many of my claims are declined or paid out at the wrong level, and when they're escalated through customer relations they can only post out vouchers or cheques. May timetable chaos, strike days and Sunday cancellations and other reliability issues, coupled with my propensity to book online some time in advance, has resulted in me posting an immense number of valid claims in the past year.

I wonder if part of the thinking is that some customers will forget to take a low-value cheque to the bank.

 

[Killingworth]

My local greengrocers are happy to offer cashback on debit cards. It saves them having to take it to the bank. A local restaurant is very happy to take cards to save having to count so much cash, then have to drive to the city centre to pay it in. They'd even prefer to accept American Express than cash - card users tend to spend more.

 

[ainsworth74]

My local greengrocers are happy

Your what now?! What's one of them then?

 

[Howardh]

The problem with banks is that from time to time you DO need a physical place and person to sit down with - for example when dealing with death and probate, when there are an awful lot of forms that need handing over and copying/sending to the right places.

When I dealt with dad's probate it was a really good service from my bank, and no doubt I will have to go through it all again for mum (unless she outlives me....which is looking 50/50 right now!!) and if my local-ish branch closed, there's a big one in town and then if that closes, well, Manchester.

 

[Clip]

You, and others, keep on about wasting time or saving time but tell me what do you do with the extra 30 seconds, or 30 minutes you have saved? How does the saved time enhance your life, your living standards?
Probably the same way that those who drive at 30mph in a 20mph limit are smug about their having saved a minute to spend at the next delay where I catch them up. My apologies if that is not you and you spend the minutes gained making the world a better place - I am just too cynical/realistic this morning

For me - every minute I dont spend doing something like this is time I get to spend with me lass/friends which is precious to me as I now work away a lot.

 

[Killingworth]

Your what now?! What's one of them then?

That's what they say, clinging on by their finger tips!

 

[underbank]

The problem with banks is that from time to time you DO need a physical place and person to sit down with - for example when dealing with death and probate, when there are an awful lot of forms that need handing over and copying/sending to the right places.

But you don't "need" to at all. You can get extra copies of death certificates and probate, and certified copies of wills from solicitors, so you can just post the documents to their bereavement department and still keep the "originals" in your possession. That's no less reliable than handing them over to a counter clerk who just copies and forwards them on to their bereavement department using internal post anyway.

Loads of people don't bank locally or bank with entirely online banks yet manage perfectly well. Likewise, the deceased may have investments or life insurance with firms that don't have local offices, so likewise, it has to be done by post.

 

[Starmill]

Loads of people don't bank locally or bank with entirely online banks yet manage perfectly well. Likewise, the deceased may have investments or life insurance with firms that don't have local offices, so likewise, it has to be done by post.

This is something I've never considered. I have an account with a high street bank and an online only account. I have never thought about how my relatives might get the money out of my Monzo account (I certainly don't have a Will) if I were to die tragically in the near future (hopefully very unlikely, but...).

 

[Bletchleyite]

This is something I've never considered. I have an account with a high street bank and an online only account. I have never thought about how my relatives might get the money out of my Monzo account (I certainly don't have a Will) if I were to die tragically in the near future (hopefully very unlikely, but...).

I don't keep substantial savings in my Monzo account, so depending on where in the month the tragedy occurred it is going to be somewhere between a month's wages and £0.

 

[underbank]

This is something I've never considered. I have an account with a high street bank and an online only account. I have never thought about how my relatives might get the money out of my Monzo account (I certainly don't have a Will) if I were to die tragically in the near future (hopefully very unlikely, but...).

Simple - they apply for probate (or letters of administration if you don't leave a will) and your executors/personal representatives send certified copies of the death certificate and probate/LofA to everyone, including banks, life insurance companies, stock brokers, etc., who then release funds to your executors/PR.

The main thing to make sure is that you leave details of ALL your accounts/insurances/investments so that your executor/PR knows where your assets are. In the old days, there'd be correspondence, statements, annual summaries, etc somewhere in your house so your next of kin would be able to search your drawers to see what accounts/assets you had. Now, in this online world, there may be nothing "physical" in your house to tell your next of kin that you have a Monzo account, so they may never know, and your beneficiaries may never get that money - eventually the bank would close the account and put the funds into a "frozen"/suspense account which would languish potentially for decades. Yes, you may have a Monzo card in your wallet, but your wallet may also be lost or damaged in a tragic event that sadly ends your life. That's not unique to a bank that doesn't have local branches - it may apply to any bank or other financial institution which is paperless - even if you did have an online account with a local bank branch, again, if no paperwork in the house and you've not left a note for your next of kin, they may never know about it.

Best thing to do is make sure you write a will and with it, keep a full list of your assets - obviously not security-related issues like account numbers or passwords, but at least a list of bank accounts, insurance policies etc giving name of the financial institution - they can trace your details but your next of kin need to be able to tell them that you have funds with them. Your next of kin or executor can't be contacting every potential financial institution - there are hundreds of them!