John Bishop
Member
I would ignore him as he’s clearly no idea what he's taking about!
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Scotrail HSTs - 4-5 years in
- Thread starter BRX
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RailUK Forums
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I rather think it’s ScotRail staff who have no idea! That much is evident.
cf111
Established Member
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Even if there wasn't a report highlighting improvements required following an incident resulting in multiple fatalities, then it would be prudent for the Scottish Government to be looking into replacing the HSTs because they are knackered, expensive to run and seemingly difficult to maintain. I really don't think that drivers would refuse to operate a train unless they had genuine safety concerns.
fgwrich
Established Member
If the ScotGov could have a pound for every time we’ve had anti HST rants, or hyperbolic words such as “old, knackered, never used to run this line before’ etc they’d probably be able to afford a new fleet by now. Or the buses some people would rather have to replace them with!
John Bishop
Member
Blimey, interesting take on your definitions there.
No hyperbole, it’s fact! Would you not class a train approaching 50 years service as old?
I will let you into a little secret- they are knackered and they are old! Sorry to burst your nostalgic bubble.
northernbelle
Member
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Careful John, you mustn't allow the reality of past-it trains to get in the way of nostalgia.
Many of us thought the idea of reusing them in Scotland was daft from the outset.
John Bishop
Member
Indeed!
Having had a request from @BRX and a discussion between ourselves behind the scenes we’ve decided to reopen this to discuss what is currently happening, as in the day to day workings of the fleet…
It is not to discuss whether they should have been acquired by Scotrail in the first place and any of that type of thing will I’m afraid be deleted.
As well as the above, any thoughts on what should replace them is being covered in this speculative thread.
Ok, so hopefully this will work…
Over to you.
It is not to discuss whether they should have been acquired by Scotrail in the first place and any of that type of thing will I’m afraid be deleted.
As well as the above, any thoughts on what should replace them is being covered in this speculative thread.
Ok, so hopefully this will work…
Over to you.
BRX
Established Member
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Thanks!
No current official word from ASLEF yet.
Coming through Edinburgh earlier we had a couple working to Aberdeen and Inverness. So currently still in use. Options yesterday were pairs of 158e and 170s. With an odd HST. So no real changes yet. Still a good number of coaches at Slateford to update 4 car into 5 car sets. With no rush to make the change.
hexagon789
Veteran Member
There will be no more 5-car sets made up until platform extensions at Inverness.
That's the 'official' line.
Given the signalling changes required to get this into play I'd say don't hold your breath either.
hexagon789
Veteran Member
Exactly
chuff chuff
Member
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Saw some mention of the new life guards that are to fitted to the power cars.
hexagon789
Veteran Member
My information is that two PCs were trialled already, and now it's for fleet-wide implementation
chuff chuff
Member
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Yeah it's been run past the unions and apparently the new ones were deemed okay.
fgwrich
Established Member
Not just fleet wide, but to be rolled out across all mainline HST operators over the next year or so.
BRX
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How is the number of sets out in action per day looking just now, @hexagon789 ?
John Bishop
Member
Ergo, there will be no more 5 car sets period.
Not great last few days. Single 158s on some HML services causing carnage and crush loading.
tricky18jan
Member
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Apologies if this is mentioned
Elsewhere but does anyone know exactly what coaches are parked at Slateford ?
Thanks
Rich
Elsewhere but does anyone know exactly what coaches are parked at Slateford ?
Thanks
Rich
hexagon789
Veteran Member
Thanks
Poor. Only 11 out yesterday for instance.
1H11 was a 170+158, with its 1T88 return just the 170.
1H17/1T92 were a double 158.
Scot-rail should have a list on the HST fleet page.
A quick check on yesterday gives 3 of the 5, 5 car sets out on Aberdeen trips and aroubd 7, 4 car sets out.
Over the weekend double 158s and 170s being used to replace HSTs. Yesterday it was single sets replacing thrm.
So still poor availability problems. Quite a number of power cars at Haymarket detached from coaches.
Thread now reopened.
The discussion around ASLEF is a separate issue to what this thread was set up for and we’ve had that discussion elsewhere. This is what was said in June:
The same thing applies still.
Thanks.
The discussion around ASLEF is a separate issue to what this thread was set up for and we’ve had that discussion elsewhere. This is what was said in June:
Having had a request from @BRX and a discussion between ourselves behind the scenes we’ve decided to reopen this to discuss what is currently happening, as in the day to day workings of the fleet…
It is not to discuss whether they should have been acquired by Scotrail in the first place and any of that type of thing will I’m afraid be deleted.
As well as the above, any thoughts on what should replace them is being covered in this speculative thread.
Ok, so hopefully this will work…
Over to you.
The same thing applies still.
Thanks.
chuff chuff
Member
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- 464
The place is polluted with power cars including one that has been tucked in one of the shed roads with headlights etc missing from the front for months now,god knows what else is missing.
There is also a rake of coaches lying for months,must be a pain for the depot staff to work round all that.
Railperf
Established Member
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What are the latest issues with these?
How many HST diagrams are there currently - and how many serviceable sets to fill them?
How many HST diagrams are there currently - and how many serviceable sets to fill them?
hexagon789
Veteran Member
Stathern Jc
Member
I was on 1B84, the 1356 Aberdeen - Edinburgh, yesterday and the guard said that the set would have to be withdrawn on reaching Edinburgh because some of the toilets were unusable because their retention tanks were full.
This is probably isn't a rare event on the higher mileage diagrams, and I assume that it will be classed as an in service failure even though after a brief visit to the depot the set will be ready to go again.
It did make me wonder how much irratating shortcomings like this, which aren't really faults, have reduced the overall availability of the HSTs or the percentage of completed daily diagrams.
On longer distance diagrams is this problem unique to HSTs where space available in which to fit a tank had obviously governed its capacity?
For example, does a 156 going from Glasgow to Mallaig and back in the tourist season need a "toilet break"?
This is probably isn't a rare event on the higher mileage diagrams, and I assume that it will be classed as an in service failure even though after a brief visit to the depot the set will be ready to go again.
It did make me wonder how much irratating shortcomings like this, which aren't really faults, have reduced the overall availability of the HSTs or the percentage of completed daily diagrams.
On longer distance diagrams is this problem unique to HSTs where space available in which to fit a tank had obviously governed its capacity?
For example, does a 156 going from Glasgow to Mallaig and back in the tourist season need a "toilet break"?
hexagon789
Veteran Member
Strange. HA24 worked up on 1A33, went to Clayhills, then to form 1B84, replacing a different set on that diagram. (1A33 usually continues onto 1H61)
It also went on to form 1H25 (as booked in the diagram including 1B84) after arrival at Edinburgh.
Killingworth
Established Member
On retention tanks, no it's probably not unusual. I've heard of TPE 6 coach 185s on Sourh Pennine being terminated at Piccadilly for that reason when one unit had no servicable toilets. Some heritage trains get a bit iffy towards the end of their all day journeys.
Presumably there's not enough room for both larger retention tanks and tanks for fresh water to supply them.
Presumably there's not enough room for both larger retention tanks and tanks for fresh water to supply them.