Shoreham Airshow Crash

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by crispy1978, 22 Aug 2015.

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  1. crispy1978

    crispy1978 Member

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    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-34027260

    Sounds a tragic incident. Condolences to the family and friends of the deceased, and thoughts with everyone connected with the emergency services, the Airshow and those who witnessed it.

    PS - there's more on the BBC feed but my mobile copy and paste isn't playing ball.
     
    Last edited: 22 Aug 2015
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  3. Strathclyder

    Strathclyder Established Member

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    Was just gonna post a topic on this myself.

    My thoughts go out to the families and friends of the victims, the emergency services/airshow organizers dealing with the aftermath and everyone who saw it all unfold.
     
  4. crispy1978

    crispy1978 Member

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    According to the news, the pilot is in a critical condition and "fighting for his life" - I don't know if he was able to eject from the plane, but if not it's a miracle he wasn't killed instantly.
     
  5. ainsworth74

    ainsworth74 Forum Staff Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Reports I've heard suggest he was pulled from the wreckage and I'm lead to believe, unless a modern version was installed, the Martin-Baker ejection seat fitted to the Hunter would most likely have been outside of its usage envelope once it was clear he was going to crash. Whether or not he could have ejected it appears he did not.

    So the fact he is still alive (and hopefully will recover from his injuries) is a testament to the Hawker designers sixtyish years ago.
     
  6. Antman

    Antman Established Member

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    Horrendous incident, I've got family in the area and I was concerned for a while that they may have been involved.

    There will inevitably be questions asked about the safety of these events.

    My thoughts go out to those involved.
     
  7. Tracky

    Tracky Member

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    A very nasty and tragic accident. An unfortunate combination of factors which led to the deaths of members of the public who were not connected to the event itself (spectators etc). Thoughts are with all those affected.

    Air shows in the UK bring a huge amount of pleasure and excitement to many thousands of visitors. They are very tightly regulated and risk assessed with emergency plans in place.

    Air shows give the military from home and overseas the chance to show off their equipment and the skill of the pilots offering a valued PR role to our armed forces. They also allow civilian and enthusiasts the chance to display their own aircraft. They are a big part of local tourist economy's supporting many service providers and also charities.

    There are inevitably people asking questions about the safety of these events but the safety record in terms of those killed or injured excluding pilots (up to Shoreham) speaks for itself. Once again, a tragically unfortunate accident where a number of factors made the situation an almost 'worst case' scenario.
     
    Last edited: 23 Aug 2015
  8. meridian2

    meridian2 Established Member

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    A tragic accident or an entirely avoidable event?

    If, as the media claims, the pilot had all that experience, surely he would've realised his mistake and aborted the manoeuvre before committing to it, knowing he was below profile? Questions have been rightly raised about this incident.
     
  9. beeza1

    beeza1 Member

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    How do you know the pilot made a mistake? there are many factors which could have caused this tragic accident, not least a mechanical failure.
    So please don't speculate without being in possession of the facts.
     
  10. Haydn1971

    Haydn1971 Established Member

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    It's a natural reaction of pilots to do two things, first, self preservation, second avoidance of collateral human death - it's difficult to speculate on these things, but given the above, had something broken mid-manoeuvre, the pilot would have naturally reacted by guiding the aircraft to the nearest empty space on the ground - however it would seem that the pilot just didn't quite make it to the field just beyond the A27 - there's 1000's of variables that come into play, whilst we can speculate, it's unlikely that we will get to know the full detail sequence of events that led to this crash.
     
  11. ainsworth74

    ainsworth74 Forum Staff Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Well I would guess we're in the position of waiting for the AAIB report to find out what happened. Much like when something happens on the railway we have to wait for RAIB report.
     
  12. ushawk

    ushawk Established Member

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    Its being reported (I stress, reported) that the engine may well have stalled mid-manoeuvre. In the pretty shocking video of the crash, you can see the plane twitching around almost as if the pilot is trying to avoid crashing onto the A27, but was unable too. It is already a miracle that he wasnt killed and that more people havent.

    If you look at pictures, a Stagecoach bus running between Shoreham and Worthing was incredibly close and also coaches running to the Amex Stadium for the Brighton game use that route, but miraculously passed through shortly before. The road itself is constantly busy, especially at that junction with traffic lights, which werent in operation at the time. Had they of been, the plane may well have crashed into solid stationary traffic.

    Unfortunately, things go wrong and this seems to be one of them. Inevitably this will lead to questions about the Shoreham Airshow, as this is the 3rd crash in 8 years. Is an airshow over a built up area and a main road appropriate ?
     
  13. meridian2

    meridian2 Established Member

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    The location isn't an issue; RIAT happens both over a village,a main road (A417) and a small town (Lechlade). The issue appears, at this stage, to be either pilot error or a mechanical fault on one of Britain's most reliable planes.
    Either way, the search for a whipping person, something which I totally deplore by our media,appears to be justified in this case.
     
  14. Haydn1971

    Haydn1971 Established Member

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    There's a number of really horrific photos on the Guardian website now, one at the moment of impact looks like a dashcam image and shows the extent of the fireball and construction workers running from the fireball
     
  15. Antman

    Antman Established Member

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    Your last question is the main issue and some locals feel that this was an accident waiting to happen.

    Surely mid air stunts should be performed over the sea or at least over farmland? I've enjoyed airshows myself before and whilst I wouldn't want to see them banned clearly this is not a price worth paying and some serious questions have to be asked.
     
  16. crispy1978

    crispy1978 Member

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    Assuming the engine stalling, etc is correct - could it have been the plane was supposed to be over farmland and the stalling meant it accidentally fell short and came down on the road?
     
  17. Tracky

    Tracky Member

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    The report will, I'm sure, offer some answers.

    A tragic set of circumstances came together to lead to a relatively high loss of life.

    'If' is a big word.



    If the plane had crashed 20 yards further on we could be talking of the miraculous survival of the pilot and no fatalities.

    If the HST at Wooton Bassett had been a shade later we would have been looking at quite a different story there.
     
  18. Peter Mugridge

    Peter Mugridge Established Member

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    Are not ejector seats de-activated when aircraft leave military service for private ownership?
     
  19. crispy1978

    crispy1978 Member

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    Now saying 11 "highly likely died", the pilot still critically injured and the death toll could rise further.
     
  20. ainsworth74

    ainsworth74 Forum Staff Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Yes that thought did cross my mind but have hadn't chance to research it yet.
     
  21. Altfish

    Altfish Member

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    It appears that two are footballers from Worthing Unted
     
  22. Antman

    Antman Established Member

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    That has been confirmed elsewhere, RIP
     
  23. fowler9

    fowler9 Established Member

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    From what I have read (And don't take this as fact) there is no hard and fast rule on it. However, some aircraft are actually designed for no other bail out method. The awkward thing is that apparently ejector seats bring up their own specific safety concerns.
     
  24. beeza1

    beeza1 Member

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    According to an aviation expert on BBC News this morning, ejector seats are not allowed on privately owned ex military aircraft due to the complex nature of maintaining them, they do after all contain explosives.
     
  25. 507021

    507021 Established Member

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    Very sad news indeed. My deepest condolences go out to those who have been affected
     
  26. Xenophon PCDGS

    Xenophon PCDGS Veteran Member

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    The A27 always carries quite an amount of traffic.
     
  27. 455driver

    455driver Veteran Member

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    So do airbags in cars!
    Your point is what exactly?
    Is this a proper expert or a Christian Wolmar type exspurt?
     
  28. Antman

    Antman Established Member

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    Something like this always brings out the best in people and a local cab firm have offered to pick people up for free locally and take them to the airport to retrieve their vehicles, restores ones faith in humanity.
     
  29. bignosemac

    bignosemac Established Member

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    G-BXFI had an airworthiness notice issued by the CAA that stated its bang seat was operational and maintained.

    No variation to that notice has been made since the aircraft was given a permit to fly.
     
  30. crispy1978

    crispy1978 Member

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    BBC talking a death toll of 20 is possible now.
     
  31. Antman

    Antman Established Member

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    The CAA have announced that vintage aircraft will be restricted to fly pasts and will not be allowed to perform aerobatic manoeuvres over land
     
    Last edited: 24 Aug 2015
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