ticket gates to be installed at Coventry again

[OwlMan]

Ticket gates are going to be installed at Coventry gain.
see http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/wh-smith-store-make-way-9443406

The WH Smith store inside Coventry train station is to be demolished to make way for automatic ticket gates for passengers.
Plans to get rid of the shop and open out the access to the platforms at the city station were this week approved by Coventry City Council.
The station’s previous tickets gates were removed in 2008 due to lack of footfall, but an increase in passengers through the station has led to West Coast Trains Ltd and Virgin Trains taking the decision to bring them back.
The demolition of WH Smith will open out the access to the platforms from just under six metres wide to over 18 metres.
Council chiefs last year revealed ambitious plans to transform Coventry train station which have since had to be scaled back due to a £10.5million shortfall in funding.
Some work is still expected to start on the station this year, including an extension of the footbridge and canopy between station platforms, a new entrance to the station from Warwick Road, a new passenger drop off point and additional car parking.
However, the scaled-back plans means a proposed new bus interchange will be put on hold, and there will be fewer facilities in the station entrance and less car parking than originally planned.

Full details of the planning application are at

http://planning.coventry.gov.uk/portal/servlets/ApplicationSearchServlet?PKID=767396

 

[Mojo]

West Coast Trains Ltd are Virgin Trains

lt's good news in any case but only if the staffing is adequate and there are sufficient gates for the flow of customers. Fare evasion must be incredibly high on all three Tocs that run services between New St Birmingham and Coventry given the train lengths, the number of longer-distance customers meaning it's not always practical to carry out a full ticket examination, and the time between stops.

 

[gordonthemoron]

is this the only VT managed station to have ticket gates?

 

[Ash Bridge]

is this the only VT managed station to have ticket gates?

I've read they are also to be installed shortly at Stockport & Rugby, with others to follow, Crewe Etc.?

 

[rebmcr]

IIRC, DfT have required VTWC to begin rolling out barriers at all their stations. Manchester Piccadilly is also in the works despite being Network Rail managed.

 

[Aldaniti]

I'd like to see them try to put barriers in at Wigan and Warrington.

 

[Elecman]

Wigan and Warrington are easy just at the enters fe to the subways

 

[cool110]

I remember reading that it was x number of barriers to be installed with a focus on stations from Manchester.

EDIT: Just checked and it's 200 by the 1st April 2016 with priority on the London-Birmingham and London-Manchester routes.

 

[D6975]

Wigan and Warrington are easy just at the enters fe to the subways

It's not the where it's the width. Both above locations don't have room for anything like the number of barriers needed at busy times.

 

[Bletchleyite]

IIRC, DfT have required VTWC to begin rolling out barriers at all their stations. Manchester Piccadilly is also in the works despite being Network Rail managed.

As is Euston at some point.

 

[Tetchytyke]

It's not the where it's the width. Both above locations don't have room for anything like the number of barriers needed at busy times.

That didn't stop DafT insisting on them at Grantham, Darlington and Durham. The queues to get off the platform are always good for a laugh.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

In terms of Coventry - ticket gates should make an absolute fortune .....

 

[MidnightFlyer]

That didn't stop DafT insisting on them at Grantham...

Lincoln and Hereford also have similar: three or four gates jutting out onto the platform from the booking office, in Hereford's case facing one side only. Dread to think how bad it must get at Lincoln when the Markets are on.

In Wigan North Western's case there's probably enough room to get three or four gates in with reasonable ease (it helps that the booking hall is rather basic and the subway entrance is behind it), at Warrington Bank Quay though they'll probably have to build them out into the concourse, which despite only being a few years old, from my experience is pretty crowded.

 

[HLE]

In terms of Coventry - ticket gates should make an absolute fortune .....

Oh yes indeed they will.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Lincoln and Hereford also have similar: three or four gates jutting out onto the platform from the booking office, in Hereford's case facing one side only. Dread to think how bad it must get at Lincoln when the Markets are on.

Slough is terrible for similar reasons.

 

[plastictaffy]

Euston is supposed to be imminent - although as we all know, on the railway imminent means anything within the next 10-15 years.

Rugby is also supposed to be having barriers put in in the near future.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Oh yes indeed they will.

If they are manned when they should be. MKC, WFJ, BHI and others are rarely manned properly........

 

[bussnapperwm]

Euston is supposed to be imminent - although as we all know, on the railway imminent means anything within the next 10-15 years.

Rugby is also supposed to be having barriers put in in the near future.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


If they are manned when they should be. MKC, WFJ, BHI and others are rarely manned properly........

MKC and WFJ however are LM stations so they would be uselessly manned

 

[Bletchleyite]

Euston is supposed to be imminent - although as we all know, on the railway imminent means anything within the next 10-15 years.

The work being done on the food court area would seem to be going towards this - for example the entrance/exit on the corridor side has been closed. Does anyone know where the barriers will go? Across under the departure board seems most likely.

 

[Taunton]

Slough is terrible for similar reasons.

Slough is an absolute disgrace and the "Risk Assessment" must have been fudged to get away with what is there.

The main entrance is on the none too wide Down Main platform, there wasn't enough room to put the barriers inside the building so they are stuck out on the platform itself. Few services stop on the main, but trains pass at full 125 mph every few minutes, just feet from the crowd trying to get off, whose numbers regularly spill over the yellow line. Some drivers feel the need to sound a warning on approach. Worst in the morning peak, especially if an arrival on the Down Relief and one into the Windsor bay coincide.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The main entrance is on the none too wide Down Main platform, there wasn't enough room to put the barriers inside the building.

I think they actually could have fitted inside without too much difficulty if they moved either the doors or ticket office and put them across rather than along. But I guess this is typical fGW - on the cheap. The state of the Thames Valley local stations is a disgrace generally - peeling paint, fading signage etc.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Across under the departure board seems most likely.

So everyone standing to look at the boards will be blocking the approach to the barriers? That figures...:roll:

 

[chris89]

At least not enough space really to have them at Wolves :P

 

[Bletchleyite]

So everyoe standing to look at the boards will be blocking the approach to the barriers? That figures...:roll:

Works at Waterloo and indeed most other stations. If they went all the way across, it would have little difference to the situation now.

 

[Taunton]

I think they actually could have fitted inside without too much difficulty if they moved either the doors or ticket office and put them across rather than along. But I guess this is typical fGW - on the cheap.

It's a Listed Building, one of Brunel's originals, so no big alterations.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It's a Listed Building, one of Brunel's originals, so no big alterations.

I must admit I despair when listing of buildings takes precedence over making it an effective public transport facility. I'm sure major alterations could have been done sympathetically rather than leaving it as the dilapidated dump it is. St Pancras and Kings Cross are two fine recent examples.

 

[adrock1976]

I must admit I despair when listing of buildings takes precedence over making it an effective public transport facility. I'm sure major alterations could have been done sympathetically rather than leaving it as the dilapidated dump it is. St Pancras and Kings Cross are two fine recent examples.

Being hypothetical and using the above logic, would you be happy to demolish or disregard blending in with the existing architecture in Barcelona?

Would you also be happy to have an automatic gateline installed at Denton, Reddish South, Pilning, or Golf Street Halt to name some lightly used stations?

I do not mind automatic gates for appropriate high frequency routes of trains every 2 - 5 minutes through a core section, such as Thameslink or London Crossrail. However, for regional and Intercity stations, there is already existing technology that has worked well for a good number of years, does not crash, and does not have problems viewing origin and destination on tickets. It's called human eyesight.

On a final point, I remember Birmingham New Street had the terracotta fibreglass booths underneath the mechanical flapperboard, where on passing by, there was a human being inside the booth who clipped the ticket, and allowed you to proceed. With the ongoing renovation of Birmingham NS, both the booths on the barrier line and the mechanical flapperboard should be brought back into use.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Being hypothetical and using the above logic, would you be happy to demolish or disregard blending in with the existing architecture in Barcelona?

Who said anything about demolition?

A good way to solve the problem at Slough might be to extend the ticket hall out using a modern-style glass awning - basically a smaller version of Kings Cross.

Would you also be happy to have an automatic gateline installed at Denton, Reddish South, Pilning, or Golf Street Halt to name some lightly used stations?

The railway is quite within its rights to install a gateline wherever it happens to wish to, and as a fare paying passenger who gets rightly fed up of those who feel paying is optional I'm quite happy for them to do so wherever it is felt commercially sensible to do so.

However, for regional and Intercity stations, there is already existing technology that has worked well for a good number of years, does not crash, and does not have problems viewing origin and destination on tickets. It's called human eyesight.

That would be fine if we could solve the overcrowding issue on trains.

On a final point, I remember Birmingham New Street had the terracotta fibreglass booths underneath the mechanical flapperboard, where on passing by, there was a human being inside the booth who clipped the ticket, and allowed you to proceed. With the ongoing renovation of Birmingham NS, both the booths on the barrier line and the mechanical flapperboard should be brought back into use.

I disagree. If modern technology can deal with most tickets and you have a manual gate (or equivalent) to catch the odd few it doesn't, why reduce capacity on the gateline and waste staff on it?

As for the flapboard, it's gone - the new atrium will be a completely new building. But why not use LED? It's vastly superior.

 

[CC 72100]

However, for regional and Intercity stations, there is already existing technology that has worked well for a good number of years, does not crash, and does not have problems viewing origin and destination on tickets. It's called human eyesight.

On a final point, I remember Birmingham New Street had the terracotta fibreglass booths underneath the mechanical flapperboard, where on passing by, there was a human being inside the booth who clipped the ticket, and allowed you to proceed. With the ongoing renovation of Birmingham NS, both the booths on the barrier line and the mechanical flapperboard should be brought back into use.

Hang on, weren't the human barriers at New Street often slated on here for letting everything and everybody through?

I've passed through New Street 5 times this year. On all occasions the 'podiums' where I presume the human barriers should/would be are empty.

I wonder how long it will take for the Coventry barriers to repay the investment in them. My prediction is 'not as long as expected'

 

[MidnightFlyer]

With the ongoing renovation of Birmingham NS, both the booths on the barrier line and the mechanical flapperboard should be brought back into use.

Well, one of the three sets of temporary booths at New St have already been decommissioned, with gates in the process of being installed, so I doubt that's going to happen. Out of interest why would you like the see flapperboards brought back into use, when they've been out of fashion for several decades and LED and dot matrix screens are regarded by practically everyone as the way forward?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Hang on, weren't the human barriers at New Street often slated on here for letting everything and everybody through?

I've passed through New Street 5 times this year. On all occasions the 'podiums' where I presume the human barriers should/would be are empty.

Yep, just so long as it has some form of yellow or orange on it you can flash anything ticket-shaped and get through, though to be fair in the interim New St concourse they seem a bit tighter than in the old one.

Indeed, I would say less than 50% of the time I pass through New St are the barriers now manned. A flatmate of mine frequents it a lot and always mentions how he never gets checked.

 

[adrock1976]

Perhaps I was not quite clear in my earlier posting.

What I was referring to regarding the barrier line at Birmingham NS was the 1980s - mid 1990s, not the present day oval shape things that human beings stand in. These worked perfectly well with one way direction to and from the platforms too.

Regarding the flapperboard, it was rare to see one at any railway station in the UK, let alone a major Intercity station. It is a part of the station's history - similar how the Doric Arch was a part of London Euston's history before being controversially demolished in the mid 1960s. I do appreciate that parts may be tricky to get for the flapperboard as years have passed by since it was installed, but as a compromise, it could just solely be used for either Intercity departures, or all stations local services, with the other types of services being displayed on either CRT or LED screens.

To address a couple of Neil's points, the automatic gates at Leeds City have had problems according to previous threads. I can verify that Leeds City seems to reject origins or destinations that do not start or end in the WYPTE area, as one time my Highbury & Islington - Springburn return portion of a Saver Return got rejected at Leeds City. That portion of the ticket had not been through any other gate before. In other words, with the amount of rejections at Leeds City, it is human eyesight that does the task far better and is no substitute for doing so.

Also, is it not you that has previously mentioned something about roving ticket inspectors doing random checks, so as to bust the professional fare dodgers?