Train despatchers

[PR1Berske]

Justify them being used in the 21st century, because I'm pretty stumped.

 

[ralphchadkirk]

Ensure the safe and punctual arrival and departure of trains. (emphasis on the safety). They can prevent things like the Huntingdon incident. They also usually have a customer service role as well.

There we are, justified.

 

[seagull]

As in platform train dispatch?

Several reasons, the most important being 'to watch the train while it departs to make sure no-one is being pulled underneath or otherwise endangered' which is something guards and drivers cannot really do, especially with a long train.

Some recent cases involving fatalities have highlighted how important correct and vigilant platform dispatch is.

 

[313103]

Justify them being used in the 21st century, because I'm pretty stumped.

Are you asking for someone to justify in having them? If so unless someone is a MD or a Safety Director of a company, No one can really answer.

They have been introduced on the NLL recently at Willesden Junction. From my point of view they assist me in safe dispatch of the train. If you would like to visit Willesden Junction platform 5 during the rush hour you will see why we have them.

Better still why not go to your nearest station that has them and find out why they are there. You yourself could then make a judgement about whether they are needed or not!

BTW it is Dispatcher.

 

[Matt Taylor]

I wouldn't want to be without them, I cannot safely close my doors etc at some stations without the help of platform staff. Think particularly of stations with sharp curves, no matter where I stand I cannot see the whole of the train.

 

[Hampshire Unit]

There Job may seem pointless to some in the public eye but at some locations they are worth there weight in gold !!!

Its a shame that some toc's can't see just how important they remain especially in a situation like say a child trying to run along next to the train to race a friend.

In the days of power operated doors once the train has started to move the guard has little or no vision to what is happening outside of his train.

 

[adamcoppard]

OK then, with the examples provided, what would / could the dispatcher do in an emergency situation that has occurred on the train just dispatched.

 

[Urban Gateline]

OK then, with the examples provided, what would / could the dispatcher do in an emergency situation that has occurred on the train just dispatched.

Well the point is that the train wouldnt be dispatched if the situation was unsafe...if something happened as the train started to leave then the dispatcher could try to alert the driver/guard who can emergency stop the train.

I think another justification for having them is customer service, as mentioned above, would you really want all the jobs of these people taken away, to then have to speak to a help-point machine to get information. You have to remember that dispatchers do many other things too such as keep the platform tidy, help with luggage, help with queries and make announcements as well as dispatching trains.

 

[Mojo]

BTW it is Dispatcher.

The spelling varies between companies and even locations within the same company. FGW use ''dispatch'' whereas East Coast use ''despatch,'' for example.

I do feel that with automatic train doors the provision of train dispatch staff at certain locations won't last for much longer, but take for example London Underground which all but abolished dispatch staff many years back. Dispatch staff are only used now when the OPO equipment fails but busy stations at busy times of the day now have Sats (Station Assistant Train Services) duties who use radio public address and batons to ensure dwell time is kept to a minimum.

 

[Hampshire Unit]

Shout a warning to people as and when required ? Im sure that most travellers have heard someonr being told to "Stand Away" whilst a train is starting to move.
Use the different available ways to warn the traincrew to stop there train if required?
Remember prevention is better then cure and having someone trained to help the crew look out for that drunken or child who might have fallen between the platform and train is always a good start ???

 

[The Barlow Boy]

OK then, with the examples provided, what would / could the dispatcher do in an emergency situation that has occurred on the train just dispatched.

The short answer is nothing. By the time the dispatcher has clawed his way to a telephone to ask the signalman - who's dealing with a train stopped by a signal failure - to put out an emergency call or replace the signal the dispatched train is doing 40 and accelerating. London Bridge, an FCC heading to-wards Bedford. The CD has been given, half way through the doors closing a person falls out/in the train. How does the dispatcher tell the Driver to stop closing the doors? It's no good keeping up the Huntingdon chant. I could name you dozens of incidents where people have been dragged at manned platforms with trains conveying a Guard. You don't need dispatchers at the majority of stations. There are exceptions and I'd agree with Willesden Junction being one. L.U.L. seem to manage quite well at Victoria.

 

[185]

Definition - A third pair of eyes, not occupied with mechanical or passenger duties related to the train. Not working on the train, they are able to be stood in view of the signal whilst the depatch process commences.

At Liverpool Lime Street for example, First Transpennine Express wanted to introduce self despatch. The signals at the end of the s-shaped curvy platforms are hard to see as they are staggered from line of sight. It is easy there to think you have a green, when you don't. Members of staff came forward and intervened, preventing job losses, but moreover, preventing deaths from a potential crash. The same was true for Manchester Airport Railway Station.

I didn't throw any spanners, I pwomise.

 

[Urban Gateline]

Are there any staff who are ONLY dispatchers then?

I thought most of the dispatchers are Station Assistants (or whatever other TOC's call them!) and they do not only dispatch trains but also do all the customer service bits, isn't it reassuring to have a member of staff there as eyes and ears and to represent the TOC? If people say no to the above, then I would question why we need staff on the shopfloor in a store?

 

[Welshman]

Leading on a little....
When a station is served by more than one TOC, do the "visiting" TOCs contribute towards despatching costs of the "host" TOC?

I ask this because I noticed when using Grantham station that the GNER/NatEx staff only despatched their trains but not Central's.

I don't know if that situation still exists now with EC and EMT.

 

[strange6]

Leading on a little....
When a station is served by more than one TOC, do the "visiting" TOCs contribute towards despatching costs of the "host" TOC?

I ask this because I noticed when using Grantham station that the GNER/NatEx staff only despatched their trains but not Central's.

I don't know if that situation still exists now with EC and EMT.

I can only speak of Bolton, which is served by Northern and FTPE: The Northern dispatchers do see off FTPE trains as well as their own. I'm sure the Virgin staff at Wigan NW dispatch the through services of Northern's as well (driver9000 could tell you this since he drives through Wigan NW on his way to Lime Street). They don't, however, dispatch Northern's services that begin at Wigan NW (to Liverpool Lime Street)

 

[Anvil1984]

Leading on a little....
When a station is served by more than one TOC, do the "visiting" TOCs contribute towards despatching costs of the "host" TOC?

I ask this because I noticed when using Grantham station that the GNER/NatEx staff only despatched their trains but not Central's.

I don't know if that situation still exists now with EC and EMT.

Its probably either included in Station Access agreements or in the case of Leeds (Network Rail station) contracted out, hence XC switching from using ECs dispatchers to Northerns a couple of years back.

At York Northern and TPE (alongside GC) are train crew dispatch and XC amd EC use EC dispatchers

 

[BestWestern]

A train dispatcher firstly provides an additional safeguard against a train being involved in a SPAD against a platform starting signal, and secondly provides a pair of eyes to observe the train safely out of the platform. They also are able to provide information to both customers and traincrew. At many busy locations the dispatcher will have radio communication with the controlling signaller, local operations manager and other colleagues around the station, and is involved in co-ordinating movements within the station and managing the platforms. If you take a busy location such as Bristol TM, there is a lot of communication which takes place between platform staff and those running the trains from out of sight, without which things would run far less smoothly. Even in this modern age, not everything happens automatically!

The question "what could they do once a train has started to leave" also ties in with another practise which is sometimes questioned; the Guard remaining at the door position until clear of the platform. Where this is in operation, a dispatcher will generally be positioned further forward than the Guard, and so is able if needed to give the Guard an emergency stop signal as the train moves along the platform. Of course, this is not relevant in lots of places, but it makes good sense where it does happen.

Unfortunately there are some places where the dispatchers do little to help justify their jobs (not generally with FGW I would add, where they are usually to a good standard), taking a very 'laid back' approach and sometimes being selective in which trains they see away, or how long they remain on the platform as the train departs. This is a shame, as it can give the impression that they are superfluous. But, when things are done properly, they are vital to a safe and smooth-running station!

 

[attics26]

Leading on a little....
When a station is served by more than one TOC, do the "visiting" TOCs contribute towards despatching costs of the "host" TOC?

I ask this because I noticed when using Grantham station that the GNER/NatEx staff only despatched their trains but not Central's.

I don't know if that situation still exists now with EC and EMT.

at Darlington XC pay towards EC dispatch for their trains - TPE and Northern towards assisting their passgrs. The abuse and occasional violence no-one pays towards.

 

[313103]

Leading on a little....
When a station is served by more than one TOC, do the "visiting" TOCs contribute towards despatching costs of the "host" TOC?

I ask this because I noticed when using Grantham station that the GNER/NatEx staff only despatched their trains but not Central's.

I don't know if that situation still exists now with EC and EMT.

London Overground have there own staff at Willesden Junction and dispatch there own trains, no other tocs services stop at the station. It is a little different at Clapham Junction if the trains leave from Platform 2 it is traincrew dispatch. If the train services leave from platform 17 we have Southern Railway dispatchers and during the peaks you will get at least two of them such that it is so crowded. I cannot speak for the ELL as that is DOO opearted and i never go over thta line or have any need to travel over that line.

 

[Tom B]

Irrespective of the need for someone to dispatch the train or not, certainly at major stations I feel there is an important information role provided. Recently I've witnessed some impressive work by the platform staff at Waverley - for example, walking down the platform and speaking to every waiting passenger, making sure they know where to be for their coach, offering help with luggage etc. Very good for infrequent or new travellers and certainly an example of customer service (something the railways, as a whole, are abysmal at). I feel that if the requirement for staff to dispatch the trains were removed, this service aspect would diminish.

As for different dispatchers for different TOCs, you again have a completely idiotic situation at Waverley where Scotrail, East Coast, Virgin and Network Rail staff are often seen milling around the departure boards - why? You soon find out once you try asking (say) a Virgin member of staff about an East Coast service - even if it's something ridiculously trivial that they ought to know, they'll say "not my company, find an East Coast attendant".

 

[Aictos]

As a dispatcher, part of my job role is the safe dispatch of services but that is not all I am expected to do as I am also meant to perform customer assistance which could range from using the tools at my disposal to deliver train running information both in normal service and in disruption to journey enquries to luggage assists etc...

I also am responsible while on duty for ensuring posters are kept up to date, ensuring security checks are done as well as liase with other staff all the more so as platform staff at my home station are also responsible for the yard, not forgetting co-ordinating replacement buses and taxis when needed.

I also do cleaning to keep the station in a clean and welcoming state.

As well as checking terminating services which then come out of service to ensure no one gets overcarried as well as ensuring all doors are closed on the train prior to any shunting.

 

[The Barlow Boy]

Definition - A third pair of eyes, not occupied with mechanical or passenger duties related to the train. Not working on the train, they are able to be stood in view of the signal whilst the depatch process commences.

At Liverpool Lime Street for example, First Transpennine Express wanted to introduce self despatch. The signals at the end of the s-shaped curvy platforms are hard to see as they are staggered from line of sight. It is easy there to think you have a green, when you don't. Members of staff came forward and intervened, preventing job losses, but moreover, preventing deaths from a potential crash. The same was true for Manchester Airport Railway Station.

I didn't throw any spanners, I pwomise.

Then there is a safety case to be made for OFF indicaters and banner repeaters - but I suspect that they're already provided.

 

[175001]

I can only speak of Bolton, which is served by Northern and FTPE: The Northern dispatchers do see off FTPE trains as well as their own. I'm sure the Virgin staff at Wigan NW dispatch the through services of Northern's as well (driver9000 could tell you this since he drives through Wigan NW on his way to Lime Street). They don't, however, dispatch Northern's services that begin at Wigan NW (to Liverpool Lime Street)

Yes, VT staff dispatch us at Wigan, and at Preston too

Dispatchers are very important. Like the other night we had a problem that we didn't know of, where one of the circuit breakers had popped which meant no tail lights(we had 2 units and only the front one was open) cue the dispatcher to the rescue, where he rang the box and the box informed the driver, who informed me!

They are very important, long may they see me off!

 

[blacknight]

Justify them being used in the 21st century, because I'm pretty stumped.

For the following reasons
First: Safety 2 man principle if both guard & dispatcher have to check signal reduces chance of SPAD.
Second: Passenger assistance who is going to get disabled onboard are you suugesting booking clerk closes ticket office to get disabled passenger safely on to platform ready to board.
Third: Intervention stopping drunk from falling over platform edge, ejecting ticketless travelling public from station-would that be subcontracted to G4S in your plan.
Forth: Source of information for public & general presence in a bad world someone as to play sherriff & enforce railway byelaws.

 

[PR1Berske]

"in your plan"



What plan? I just posed the question....

 

[driver9000]

They don't, however, dispatch Northern's services that begin at Wigan NW (to Liverpool Lime Street)

Yes they do.

 

[First class]

Can anyone suggest stations they THINK should have Train Dispatch, but don't?

 

[ukrob]

Can anyone suggest stations they THINK should have Train Dispatch, but don't?

In our neck of the woods, Liverpool Central Northern Line platforms. If only to tell people to move the f**k away from the bottom of the escalators and down the platform. Idiots.

 

[strange6]

Yes they do.

Only goes to show you how often I use those services!