Train Frontage

[JB25]

As a driver maybe I should know this, but why are the front (and rear) of trains yellow? I keep forgetting to ask.

 

[Boothby97]

Safety standards I believe

 

[JB25]

Any idea why yellow rather than white, orange or flourecent pink?

I'm just interested to be honest.

 

[gazthomas]

Back in the day they tried various options. It goes back to the early 60'sand attempts to improve lineside safety as diesels were less obvious than steam. This extended to headlights in the 70's/80's.

 

[jopsuk]

although I think some countries do mandate white, it wouldn't be so visible in fog, snow etc.

As to exactly why yellow, when they were developing the idea of a warning panel they probably only had a tin of yellow to hand, no pink...

 

[BestWestern]

I believe there is an argument that yellow is supposedly the colour most easily picked out by the human eye. Perhaps I'm not the only one to recall that, or perhaps I imagined it!?

 

[rebmcr]

I know that the Manchester Metrolink was exempt on launch due to its continuous use of head- and tail-lights, but I've never been able to find the exact rule it is exempt from.

 

[telstarbox]

It makes the train easier to spot, and it's one of the only colours that doesn't appear in the railway surroundings - yellow stands out against all of:

- red or brown brickwork
- green trees/fields
- blue skies
- the dark blue or grey bodies of locomotives
- grey ironwork/steelwork or overcast skies
- black - ie when it's dark
- white - fog or snow.

 

[barrykas]

The relevant Railway Group Standard is GM/RT2483 (Issue 1) dated June 2004: "Visibility Requirements for Trains".

The basic requirement for most vehicles (except snowploughs and shunting locos) is for a minimum area of 1m^2, with a minimum dimension of 60cm, when viewed head on; or 2 * 0.4m^2 with a minimum dimension of 60cm where an end gangway is provided.

Relevant colours are RAL 1003, 1004, 1018, 1021 or 1023; BS 4800 (Schedule of paint colours for building purposes) Item 08E51; British Rail Specification 81 (Specification of Paint for Rolling Stock) Item 202 (also used as the base colour on BR road vehicles); NCS (Natural Colour System) 1080-Y10R or 1475-Y11R; or Eurocolour 222.69.79.

 

[Vicpaul]

Also yellow is the colour we
a)pick out first
b)the last colour to leave our range

 

[JB25]

Also yellow is the colour we
a)pick out first
b)the last colour to leave our range

You should have replied in the Mess Room the other day then!

 

[pendolino]

I believe there is an argument that yellow is supposedly the colour most easily picked out by the human eye. Perhaps I'm not the only one to recall that, or perhaps I imagined it!?

Assuming that's true why do we have orange hi-viz rather than yellow? Maybe we are more expendable than rolling stock.

 

[rebmcr]

Assuming that's true why do we have orange hi-viz rather than yellow? Maybe we are more expendable than rolling stock.

Because orange is still by far 'visible enough', and it's important to be able to tell them apart.

 

[transportphoto]

Assuming that's true why do we have orange hi-viz rather than yellow? Maybe we are more expendable than rolling stock.

Possibly because not many other industries wear yellow HiVis, it helps distinguish between builders, for example, travelling passenger and rail workers.

TP

 

[Vicpaul]

Autumn and the line side you would simply blend in

 

[transportphoto]

Autumn and the line side you would simply blend in

In bright orange? I'd beg to differ having been in the situation seeing people in HiVis orange, even being there myself, the bright orange the railway uses does not blend into an autumn scene.

TP

 

[Vicpaul]

Reference to yellow hi vis

 

[transportphoto]

Reference to yellow hi vis

Ahh right, I'd still argue that they'd stand out a little bit.

TP

 

[John Webb]

Yellow at the trackside could be mistaken for some form of 'Caution' signal, hence the use of Orange for trackworkers' Hi-viz wear to ensure that there is no misunderstanding.

 

[BestWestern]

Assuming that's true why do we have orange hi-viz rather than yellow? Maybe we are more expendable than rolling stock.

That's a good point. I would hazard a guess it may simply be that having the front end of trains painted in day-glow orange may be considered a little garish!? It's a lot easier to make a fabric garment that bright than it is to make the metal/fibreglass front end of a train. Also, I would suggest that the brightness properties of the colour would be dulled substantially by dirt and grime, possibly to the point where it would become darker and thus less visible than the lighter shade of yellow?

 

[TDK]

I can spot a track worker from over a mile away in orange but not in yellow, it is by far the best colour to spot for HIVis PPE. Yellow will blend into the surroundings and to be honest there are not many natual Orange colours in the general backdrop.

To add yellow is not the best colour for the front of a train because headlights had to be introduced but it has to be better than a darker colour like blue, green or brown.

 

[W230]

I can spot a track worker from over a mile away in orange but not in yellow, it is by far the best colour to spot for HIVis PPE. Yellow will blend into the surroundings and to be honest there are not many natual Orange colours in the general backdrop.

I'd agree with this - I think orange is very easy to see on the trackside and think yellow would not be as clear.

Somewhere abroad (Taiwan possibly) I saw locos painted with yellow & black stripes. These are supposed to be the most contrasting colours to the human eye and stand out the best but I still think orange is better suited for a high vis vest.

 

[Photohunter71]

Shame the locomotives and multiple units don't have full fascia yellow at either end allowing for cabside to cabside in corporate livery the way it used to be in the old BR blue days!

 

[PFX]

That's a good point. I would hazard a guess it may simply be that having the front end of trains painted in day-glow orange may be considered a little garish!? It's a lot easier to make a fabric garment that bright than it is to make the metal/fibreglass front end of a train. Also, I would suggest that the brightness properties of the colour would be dulled substantially by dirt and grime, possibly to the point where it would become darker and thus less visible than the lighter shade of yellow?

Iarnród Éireann used hi-viz orange warning panels on its locos during the 90s and 00s and while they were fairly visible when first applied, they very rapidly faded to a pinkish off-white colour. IÉ now use yellow cab ends which is a marked improvement on the orange and would support the case that yellow warning panels are best for visibility.

Hi viz warning panel
Freshly applied
http://www.geograph.ie/photo/353623

Weathered.
http://www.geograph.ie/photo/2442555

Current warning panel.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/39896705@N05/4548054926/

 

[Wyvern]

I take the point that Hi Vis colours dont weather very well, but the rule about yellow ends also came into force before Hi VIz (what were then called Day Glow) came into existence.

 

[umontu]

Possibly because not many other industries wear yellow HiVis, it helps distinguish between builders, for example, travelling passenger and rail workers.

TP

The reasoning I heard was drivers were asked to say what colour they saw best. I heard it was tested in Scotland in the BR era.

I do happen to know that the Glasgow subway does not use orange hi vis. They use yellow; their reasoning being that the loco's take the orange colour so the workers have the yellow.

 

[Goldfish62]

Is HS1 exempt? Ie, will DB have to paint the front of their ICEs yellow if they EVER come to St Pancras?

 

[D365]

Is HS1 exempt? Ie, will DB have to paint the front of their ICEs yellow if they EVER come to St Pancras?

Not sure, don't think so but I assume regulations will extend to HS2 - classic-compatibles will obviously need the yellow paint unless the NR situation changes. Applies to the e320s too but according to impressions they'll have yellow anyhow.

 

[rebmcr]

Surely in-cab signalling would render anything visible moot, at least for captive units.

 

[MCR247]

Is HS1 exempt? Ie, will DB have to paint the front of their ICEs yellow if they EVER come to St Pancras?

I don't think they will unless they were to venture on to classic lines, which they won't