TransPennine Express Nova 1 (Class 802) Diagrams

Discussion in 'Allocations, Diagrams & Timetables' started by SWTrainspottin, 29 Sep 2019.

  1. Purple Orange

    Purple Orange Member

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    Thanks very much. Very useful to know about the 185 diagram too. I know it shouldn't really make a difference, but once the new trains are in service I would prefer to avoid using the 185s between Manchester and Leeds/York and Newcastle where I can. Similarly with travelling to Scotland, I have preferred Virgin over TPE simply due to space. Simply put, a commuter style train on a relatively long distance is not as comfortable, and if I am not alone in my preferences, TPE should probably see a lot of people move move to using them more frequently.
     
  2. SHerr

    SHerr Member

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    I’m wondering if there’s a bit of an issue here with all/most of the fleets that’s not quite come out yet due to partial introduction. Both here and the class 68/mk5 discussions are now inferring a 185 diagram still remaining after full fleet introduction.

    All of TPEs new trains were ordered before the hopelessly optimistic May 18 debacle with tight turnaround times at both ends of lots of diagrams. We are also seeing comments about being unable to get 802’s maintained.

    I can’t help but wonder if every fleet is 1 or even 2 units short and was very optimistic about diagrams and utilisation? Obviously when ordering new fleets they are not cheap and you don’t want loads of spares but maybe a bit too tight?

    Only a thought, no inside gen and not a dig!
     
  3. Jamesrob637

    Jamesrob637 Member

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    One more of each maybe, that's what you're implying? That would be good, then TPE could utilize the whole fleet at times such as Manchester Parklife (bit old for that now!) and Leeds Festival (still would like to go soon!)
     
  4. SWTrainspottin

    SWTrainspottin Member

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    Do you happen to know which of those are booked to be Nova 1's? Thanks
     
  5. SWTrainspottin

    SWTrainspottin Member

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    Original post updated with what should be the current booked weekday diagrams.
     
  6. Jamesrob637

    Jamesrob637 Member

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    Deleted
     
  7. railways45021

    railways45021 Member

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    how many Class 802s does TPE have in service now?
     
  8. JonathanH

    JonathanH Established Member

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    All 19 of them except 802205 have operated in passenger service. That doesn't mean the other 18 are all available.
     
  9. Yorkshireman16

    Yorkshireman16 Member

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    802205 is on the tpe depot York
     
  10. SWTrainspottin

    SWTrainspottin Member

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    Nova 1 - 6 January 2019

    802214
    1P13, 9M08, 9S13, 9M18

    802219
    9M06, 9S11, 9M16, 9E21

    802207
    9S06, 9M11, 9S16

    802213
    1P08, 1P15, 1P22, 1P29, 1P36, 1P93, 5P93

    802217
    1P10, 1P17, 1P24, 1P31, 1P38

    802206
    1P14, 1P21, 1P28, 1P35,
     
  11. Jamesrob637

    Jamesrob637 Member

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    That looks good - I did predict six or seven diagrams come Monday, which is what today is. No wonder nothing on TPE has been cancelled today apart from what is semi-permanently cancelled until the end of the month - 185s can cover some Anglo-Scottish workings for now.
     
  12. Spartacus

    Spartacus Established Member

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    1P10 was worked by 802213.
     
  13. DannyMich2018

    DannyMich2018 Member

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    Great progress then, out of the three new TPE fleets Hitatchi seems to be the winner-802's are way ahead of the Class 397 And MK5 stock regarding entry into service and the how many been accepted-/in use-only one or two 397s are in daily service with several MK5 sets still in store/not in use yet.
     
  14. CHAPS2034

    CHAPS2034 Member

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    Presumably this because the rail industry has more experience of the 802s and some of the teething problems have been sorted before TPE introduced them.

    397s and Mk5a are new with no experience elsewhere.
     
  15. JonathanH

    JonathanH Established Member

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    Once you allow for planned cancellations, there are hardly any journeys on the Liverpool to Edinburgh left to cancel 'on the day'. It is just the three 802 diagrams (out of a theoretical ten) which are running on this route - the 9S / 9M workings - ie no Liverpool to Newcastle short workings using 185s.

    The three other 802 diagrams (1Pxx workings) are Manchester Airport to Newcastle ones running alongside 185s on the other three diagrams for 802s and the booked 185 diagram.

    A number of 802s are running about in plain grey livery and will need a trip to Eastleigh in the near future.

    Mark 5 stock introduction seems to be getting there with eight sets now available. That means there are only five left to accept. Eight sets would appear sufficient to operate all Scarborough diagrams.

    Only as cover for 350 / 397 on the west side - not on the east side.
     
  16. paddyb6

    paddyb6 Member

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    Anyone know the Saturday diagrams for the 802s

    Much appreciated!
     
  17. 31160

    31160 Member

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    Could the current Mon-Fri diagrams be moved over to the FAQ section please
     
  18. SWTrainspottin

    SWTrainspottin Member

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    Some of the Saturday diagrams are in the original post now.

    You mean this?
     
  19. Chris125

    Chris125 Established Member

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    I may be wrong, but I'd assumed it was to help traincrew on these routes retain their competency on 185s?
     
  20. 31160

    31160 Member

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    Yes please that would be lovely easy to find when needed etc.
     
  21. route101

    route101 Established Member

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    A 185 covered a 802 to Edinburgh recently.
     
  22. gimmea50anyday

    gimmea50anyday Established Member

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    185s were supposedly barrred from the Edinburgh workings as they are based on timings running above 100mph, however it has been shown that a 185 keeps to time better than a 802 on diesel, apparently!

    Bear in mind 802s need to run on diesel north of Morpeth and (on sundays only) south of Durham due to OHLE power limitations, the 185 barring north of Newcastle seemingly been relaxed as a result.
     
  23. SWTrainspottin

    SWTrainspottin Member

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    I can't add to that thread.
     
  24. transmanche

    transmanche Established Member

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    I noticed that RTT reports the journeys are 'pathed as an 80x on electric' as far north as Chathill, switching to diesel there and then back to electric at Longniddry.

    If the switchover is (for the time being) taking place at Morpeth, does that explain why the 802 is struggling to keep time? And is the changeover taking place at Morpeth because the Automatic Power Change Over balises have not been sorted?
     
  25. gimmea50anyday

    gimmea50anyday Established Member

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    TPE don't yet allow changeover on the move. Whether this is down to ropey ECML OHLE or TPE management nerves I cannot say. As the nearest station stops to the changeover points are Man Vicc, York, Durham and Morpeth that is where the changeover takes place. Currently due to power limitations at Tweedmouth and with LNER now switched over from HST to 800 the current draw has increased to the point where the OHLE cannot support potentially 3-4 LNER and 2 TPE electrics in the area at a time, think it was only ever powered enough for 2x mk4 plus 1 freight (86/87/90/92) when BR strung the wires up - this being not long after Serpell suggested shutting the ECML.While LNER were running HSTs and TPE were only running training trains on an ad hoc basis at most you had 2x mk4/800 plus the one TPE drawing power, even this however saw the voltage drop to 22kv and close to the point the 80x would complain and shut down, but the additional trains mean now TPE have to run on diesel until the power supply is upgraded in 2022. Just as well they have the larger 940hp engines fitted although that still doesn't give the train enough power compared to running off the wires. Theres only 1800ish HP available on diesel compared to nearer 3000 on OHLE. Less power for top end speed and acceleration shows in the performance, they cant attain 125mph on diesel.
     
  26. Bletchleyite

    Bletchleyite Veteran Member

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    I hope they are able to get changeovers on the move sorted - Manchester Victoria would be improved no end by reducing the amount of diesel fumes in what is quite a confined space, and fumes are at their worst when starting engines up.
     
  27. gimmea50anyday

    gimmea50anyday Established Member

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    No wires up miles plating bank tho...
     
  28. ajdunlop

    ajdunlop Member

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    What length of wiring would be needed for changeover just after a Station (I assume it would depend on line speed)?
     
  29. gimmea50anyday

    gimmea50anyday Established Member

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    The bit east of Vicc is just for station stunts and has no use for departing. With the close proximity of the bank you'd lose speed and probably grind to a halt before the changeover kicked in.
    The changeover is surprisingly quick to be fair tho.
     
  30. HSP 2

    HSP 2 On Moderation

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    So what sort of stunts do they do at the east end of MCV?

    Sorry.
     

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