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TrawsCambria / TrawsCymru

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Penrallt

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I would guess that either:
  • The 50 will run hourly Aberystwyth - Cardigan via New Quay, serving Aberporth on alternate trips, and the X50 will be scrapped or
  • The 50 will run hourly Aberystwyth - Synod Inn via New Quay, continuing to Cardigan via Aberporth on alternate trips, and the X50 will remain but only between Aberaeron and Cardigan, probably attempting to connect with the 40/TC1 (because if it connects with the 50 the intervals are less even at the Cardigan end (they aren't ever going to be perfectly even though I think))

Whose to say it would be another service north of Aberaeron. My suggestion would be for the X50 and 50 (Cardigan and New Quay) to alternate north of Aberaeron, so both Cardigan and New Quay get a bus every two hours to Aberystwyth. A hourly service from New Quay would be maintained by running a service to Llanarth or Aberaeron to connect with the X50. The 550 would run Cardigan - Aberporth - New Quay - Aberaeron, connecting with the TC1 at Aberaeron. Therefore, New Quay actually gets a better-than-hourly service (alternating between a gap of arround an hour and one of arround half an hour) to make up for the reduction in through services to Aberystwth. I tried to work out a timetable which would give New Quay a half-hourly service, including one every two hours to Cardigan and one every two hours to Aberystwyth, but couldn't do it without exceeding the current requirement (which I think is four buses for 50 and 550).

The question in my opinion is how to attract more passengers, to reduce car mileage and the subisdy needed to operate the bus service. Therefore if a service is more attractive it is better use of public money. And don't forget that Cribyn lost most scheduled services to speed up the TC1/40.

It'll be interesting to see which one we get. I'd always assumed that it would be your second option but who knows.

Always good to look at new ways to increase numbers and not just do what's been done before. But, the bottom line is that the 50 makes money (or almost?) but the X50 doesn't.

NQ/Cross Inn etc has a population more than 10x Cribyn, even more in the summer (whereas the direct Synod Inn - Llanarth route has zero population) so cutting NQ-Aber services doesn't make sense.
 
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Rhydgaled

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NQ/Cross Inn etc has a population more than 10x Cribyn
Correct, but it doesn't have 10x the population of Cardigan, and unlike Cribyn I suggest keeping a fixed service (but with the addition of a change of bus for some trips). Counting Cross Inn, Gilfachreda etc. they are probably about the same. So why does one get an hourly service to Aberystwth and the other next to nothing? Giving each of them a 2-hourly service would seem fairer.

Always good to look at new ways to increase numbers and not just do what's been done before. But, the bottom line is that the 50 makes money (or almost?) but the X50 doesn't.
That's true, but I think it is mainly the Aberaeron - Aberystwyth section that is profitable (or almost). Back when Arriva's buses were still the 550, the only commertial section of TrawsCambria in Ceredigion was between Aberaeron and Aberystwyth.
 
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Penrallt

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I guess it's just a matter of demand? Despite smaller population there are more NQ to Aberaeron/Aberystwyth journeys than Cardigan to Aber as that's the pattern of commuting. Cardigan people can live and work and shop in Cardigan but maybe New Quay people don't have that luxury? Plus, the holiday season swells the population of the Synod-NQ-Llanarth loop to the size of 2 Cardigans.
If Cardigan was closer to Aberystwyth then you'd definitely be right but I think it's distance that limits the demand - there just aren't that many people that do an 80 mile round trip on a daily basis.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Sorry Rhydgaled, I didn't mean this to become a competition between NQ and cardigan services. I think my point was that with limited demand and limited funding you have to take the services to where the people are if you stand a chance of making it sustainable. The problem with the current X50 and 550 is that very few people get on or off the bus between Aberporth and Llanarth. In an ideal world we'd have direct services from both Cardigan and NQ to Aber, and by the most direct route. But, given the financial constraints, etc, wouldn't a good compromise be direct cardigan to Aber services via NQ? I know it adds 10 mins or so to the time but, compared with the current arrangements, you save half that by not having to change bus at Aberaeron. Anyway, I'm going to shut up now until we know what the new services are.
 

Rhydgaled

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If my guesses about how the new timetable will look are correct, it looks as if improvments have been made to address the worst aspects of the current service but at the cost of some of the best aspects of the current service.

I guess it's just a matter of demand? Despite smaller population there are more NQ to Aberaeron/Aberystwyth journeys than Cardigan to Aber as that's the pattern of commuting. Cardigan people can live and work and shop in Cardigan but maybe New Quay people don't have that luxury? Plus, the holiday season swells the population of the Synod-NQ-Llanarth loop to the size of 2 Cardigans.
I know that area's touristy, but doubling of the population seems a bit unlikely to me. If that really is the case maybe there should be an extra hourly service in summer.

If Cardigan was closer to Aberystwyth then you'd definitely be right but I think it's distance that limits the demand - there just aren't that many people that do an 80 mile round trip on a daily basis.
I can't argue with that. However, see the following:
wouldn't a good compromise be direct cardigan to Aber services via NQ?
In terms of local services I think you're right, but remember the title of this topic. TrawsCambria/Cymru is/was supposed to be a long-distance bus network. It has to play at being the local bus service as well, but I think that routes which are purely local services should be kept out of the Traws network. You probably don't get loads of passengers doing Carmarthen - Aberystwyth on a daily basis either, yes they are bigger but that's why there's an hourly service between them, rather than 2-hourly.

I do think New Quay should have a more frequent northbound service than Cardigan, partly because of the tourist population, but I consider New Quay's to be a 'local bus service' not a 'TrawsCambria/TrawsCymru service'. Therefore, does it really need alot of long-distance services or would more-frequent short-distance feeders into long-distance direct services do the job?

I know it adds 10 mins or so to the time
31 minutes actually... I think a 550 service via Penparc Estate, Aberporth and New Quay would take about 1hr 53mins, direct X50 services take 1hr 22mins.

compared with the current arrangements, you save half that by not having to change bus at Aberaeron.
I consider that connections at Aberaeron should be 7 minutes. 31-7 = 24 minutes addition to journey time if you get rid of the change and instead go via New Quay and Aberporth.

Anyway, I'm going to shut up now until we know what the new services are.
That sounds wise. I should probably do the same but can't promise that I will. I am just a bit shocked to discover that the long-standing 6:15pm express from Aberystwyth, which I used last night, looks like being no more in future, and concerned that the TrawsCyrmu brand will become tainted by including a slow indirect route from Aberystwyth.

However, I have been speculating further, for example adding 31mins to the 7:37pm arrival in Cardigan gives 8:08. Subtract 5 from that (given the five minutes earlier start time) and you're pretty close to on the hour. Assuming that runs all day, it would be close to the 412 departure times. Perhaps 412, 50, X50 and 550 are about to disapear and become T5. That would be one hell of a slow route to get from Haverfordwest to Aberystwyth.
 

Penrallt

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Agree - the current 50 and 550 services are a local bus service rather than a long distance TC type service.

I didn't mean via Penparc estate and Aberporth, just NQ. Aberporth is served by the 554 so no need for X5o via Aberporth. The Penparc diversion is just daft - no other town or village has such a diversion and I've never seen anyone get on or off a bus there. All services through Penparc should stick to the main road.

And yes, there are so many large caravan parks, holiday homes etc, the population does more than double in the summer months. It's actually more like 4 times the winter population.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
If you combine the X50 with the 50 every 2 hours then you kill 2 birds with one stone - you get your through journeys from Cardigan to Aber, without changing bus, and the net effect is that you only lose about 5 minutes by going via New Quay. This avoids duplication of services and you can target limited funding where it does most good. Admittedly a compromise rather than the ideal solution but might be necessary given the circumstances.
 
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adey2011

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Tenders for this service were due in yesterday, has anyone heard yet who is to operate the service?
 

Rhydgaled

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Tenders for this service were due in yesterday, has anyone heard yet who is to operate the service?
As mentioned earlier in the topic: Richards Bros, Lewis Coaches and First Cymru. No Sunday service (left to the 701).
 

Bwsbro

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Just been on the Megabus webiste to book a seat on their new Holyhead - London Coach Service via Manchester.

On the website i saw a choice for departures from Aberystwyth calling at Lampeter, Carmarthen, Swansea, Cardiff and London. Although there was no information about departure times.

Does anyone have any information regarding this service?
 

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anthony263

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This is news, there hasnt been any mention of it over on the welsh bus news group nor on the south wales bus group on facebook.

I know National express run a daily coach from Aberystwyth which runs via Birmingham and depending on timings and how cheap the advance fares are I can see this being a challenge to both National express and Bryans coaches.

I do think Stagecoach will be looking at a parking area in Aberytsywth so there may be a potential for Stagecoach to launch some local services
 
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TheGrandWazoo

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This is news, there hasnt been any mention of it over on the welsh bus news group nor on the south wales bus group on facebook.

I know National express run a daily coach from Aberystwyth which runs via Birmingham and depending on timings and how cheap the advance fares are I can see this being a challenge to both National express and Bryans coaches.

I do think Stagecoach will be looking at a parking area in Aberytsywth so there may be a potential for Stagecoach to launch some local services

Hmmm, tried booking but it won't let you so clearly not taking punters just yet. I'd be guessing that they might be thinking of a once a day projection of a London - Swansea Megabus to/from Aber. I wouldn't get taken by the idea of Stagecoach launching local services though.
 

Bwsbro

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The New timetable for the 40/40C has been uploaded

Buses to Depart Aberystywth hourly between 05:40 and 18:40
Buses to Depart Carmarthen hourly between 06:07 and 19:07

Carmarthen Bus Station to be served in both directions

No timetable yet for Service 50

Changes to the 701

NEWS RELEASE
From 24th January we will be operating a Saturday service departing Aberystwyth at 12.30pm and from Cardiff at 6pm. This will also run on a Friday & Sunday during University term time. On the first 3 Sundays in January we will also operate a duplicate to our service departing Cardiff at 4pm
 

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WelshBuses93

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On VOSA today:

PG1103020/1 - ERNEST GEORGE BRYAN T/A BRYANS COACHES, 23 FIFTH AVENUE, PENPARCAU, ABERYSTWYTH, SY23 1RE
Variation Accepted: Operating between Aberystwyth Bus Station and Cardiff Bay given service number 701 effective from 24-Jan-2014. To amend Timetable.

There will be a 12:40 departure from Aberystwyth with a return servicefrom Cardiff at 18:00 :)
 

Rhydgaled

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The New timetable for the 40/40C has been uploaded

Buses to Depart Aberystywth hourly between 05:40 and 18:40
Buses to Depart Carmarthen hourly between 06:07 and 19:07

Carmarthen Bus Station to be served in both directions

No timetable yet for Service 50
What? No renumbering from Arriva's tag for the route to TC1/T1/X40? Looks like quite a good timetable, although the first bus southbound is a little earlier than I had expected, possibly due to the strict adherance to clockface times meaning they couldn't have a bus from Aberystwyth at a compromise time between the 5:40 and 6:40 departures. The worst point is the evening service, which still isn't quite the 6am to 8pm orriginally promised for the TC1 (assuming they ment the last departure from either end would be arround that time).

I wonder what the motivations were for this selecting these particular points of the hour. xx:40 from Aberystwyth looks like being designed for rail connections, but this means the Aberystwyth -NewQuay/Cardigan services will be at xx:10 (as suggested by Richards Bros' Christmas and New Year poster), which gives anyone finishing a university lecture the choice of a 10 minute sprint to the bus or a 1hr 10min wait. Also, if rail connections were the motivation the new 40's xx:26 arrival in Aberystwyth is way too tight. If we assume a 30min interval between Aberystwyth and Aberaeron, that puts the Cardigan/New Quay service arriving in Aberystwyth and xx:56.
 

WelshBuses93

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The new X94 timetable is now available on the Gwynedd website. It will be operated by GHA Coaches. Not sure if it will be numbered T3, but we'll see.
 

trawscymru27

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Bwsbro

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It is confirmed that GHA Coaches will be the sole operator for the X94 between Barmouth and Wrexham

Still no announcement regarding the commercial service between Dolgellau and Barmouth
 

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Rhydgaled

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http://www.carmarthenshire.gov.uk/English/transport/Buses/TravelTimes/Pages/goodnewsfor40and40c.aspx

All of the new timetables are available at the link above. I am pleased to see that through tickets with Bwcabus will be available. The X50 (oddly, the same route number is used for both the services via Aberporth and those via Blaenannerch) provides basically an hourly through service between Aberystwyth and Cardigan, something I think is to be welcomed.
I'm interested to see if it will actually be all services number X50, or whether somebody has got confused. The article mentions all three route numbers, 50, X50 and 550. Given that the current Richards timetable has everything north of Aberaeron as X50 (a similar split to 40 and 40c) we might see several route numbers when Richards publish the timetable. Also, there appears to be one diagram which starts and finishes the day in Aberaeron, are Richards planning to open an outstation?

While the removal of the changes is a huge plus, there's now only one Aberystwyth-Cardigan service each way with a 42/43min journey time between Aberaeron and Cardigan, the rest have gone up to arround the 1hour mark. Even counting the saving on connection time, going via New Quay costs more than 10 minutes.

It is confirmed that GHA Coaches will be the sole operator for the X94 between Barmouth and Wrexham
Interesting, are we to assume they'll take over the Dolgellau outstation?
 

Polarbear

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It is a possibility yes. :)

The new X94 timetable appears to be geared to running buses to/from GHA's other depot's (note the very late eastbound departure on weekdays). However, they may need a base of some sort in the Dolgellau area as if a bus encounters a problem that far out, sourcing a replacement will take a while...!!

On an aside, GHA must be one of the larger independents operating in the UK these days, over a rather larger geographical area stretching between Barmouth & Macclesfield. I'm sure there used to be a bus company that operated in a similar area in the past...??;)
 

Rhydgaled

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Just been on the Megabus webiste to book a seat on their new Holyhead - London Coach Service via Manchester.

On the website i saw a choice for departures from Aberystwyth calling at Lampeter, Carmarthen, Swansea, Cardiff and London. Although there was no information about departure times.

Does anyone have any information regarding this service?
I saw a poster up at the bus station in Aberystwyth regarding this the other day. Service departing Aberystwyth university at 6:15am, bus station at 6:20 if I remember correctly. The return service arrives well after midnight. Not all days of the week are served, I think it was Friday, Saturday and Sunday and running in one direction only on Mondays and Thurdays. Service to commence in January I think.
 

Teflon Lettuce

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There will be a 12:40 departure from Aberystwyth with a return servicefrom Cardiff at 18:00 :)

was on the 701 today more info on this registration

there will be a new journey running 1240 from aber return from cardiff at 1800 only on certain days... saturdays and also fri/suns during uni term times...I think the notice said starting 24th jan...

however the notice also says that if the fri/ sun journeys prove popular enough with non-students then they will become year round journeys...

the notice also says that until the new services begin the 1600 from cardiff will be duplicated for the 1st 3 sundays in jan.

Certainly now that arriva are leaving we will have the best service aber- cardiff ever... let's just hope the public really get behind their local independant operator
 

Rhydgaled

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Anyone know if the last 50 service (18:15 from Aberystwyth) actually ran on Saturday night? I was on the last southbound pm X50 service (also timed to depart AYW at 18:15) to Aberaeron and didn't notice the 50 if it ran.
 

anthony263

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Heard today in the local press that professor Stuart Cole is carrying out a review on Trawscymru/Airport Express service T9 just 5 months after it was launched.

Surprise, Surprise (not) the route is not performing a great as it could do however I do feel this service is a complete waste of money when there was a pefectly good service

X91 Cardiff - Cardiff Airport - Llantwit Major which could have bee improved to run a clockface hourly service throughout teh day with early departures at 5am with teh last buses around midnight. Another option I would suggest is to look at extending Newport Bus service X30 Newport - Cardiff through to the Airport.

Still I have my doubts about whether this service will survive the X91 carried a fair number of passengers although far less than before the railink was reopened. The WG has not learned the lessons of history which show a direct service to just the Airport doesnt work SWT/Brewers tried with their service X50 and Cardiff bus tried with their X90 before than merged with the X91 and became what it was before service T9 was introduced.
 

Rhydgaled

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Heard today in the local press that professor Stuart Cole is carrying out a review on Trawscymru/Airport Express service T9 just 5 months after it was launched.
Another review? What happened to the review of the entire network by Victoria Winckler, director of the Bevan Foundation?

I e-mailed the Bevan Foundation some time ago and had the following reply from them on 12/09/2013:
Thank you very much indeed for your very interesting comments which I have passed on to our Director. Unfortunately the report has now been finalized and submitted to the Minister so I regret it is too late to include your suggestions, however others made similar points to yourself so I can assure you a range of opinions were taken into account.
Has WAG still not published the report's findings? It's been very quite on the TrawsCymru front from WAG since stealing the remaining 3 TC1 Tempos for the T9.

Surprise, Surprise (not) the route is not performing a great as it could do however I do feel this service is a complete waste of money when there was a pefectly good service

X91 Cardiff - Cardiff Airport - Llantwit Major which could have bee improved to run a clockface hourly service throughout teh day with early departures at 5am with teh last buses around midnight. Another option I would suggest is to look at extending Newport Bus service X30 Newport - Cardiff through to the Airport.
What was wrong with the shuttle bus between the airport and Rhoose station?

Even if the T9 is not scrapped, I hope it is removed from TrawsCymru and the X1260 Tempos diverted to First's share of the Aberystwyth-Carmarthen 40/40c service (which might then become TC1 at last). The shorter Tempos on the T9 should go to the T2 (Bangor-Machynlleth/Aberystwyth) or X94 (Wrexham-Barmouth).
 
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