Trial of of paper receipts for tickets issued on board the train

[CyrusWuff]

Like you were (wrongly) accusing someone else of doing?

That's it...I'm out.

 

[Starmill]

Interesting that they refer to the National Conditions of Travel, which don't exist

They do seem almost ATB sized, which is quite good as it allows for details to be printed more clearly.

Ironic, then, that my only problem with them will be that they're so huge they won't go into my existing ticket wallets. My Oyster card, Southern Key and other ITSO cards, Railcard, pink photocard and current stack of tickets already all live in the same place. Alas one of these will not fit. Knowing me, that means I'll probably lose one too.

For what it's worth, I initially wondered why Huddersfield gateline had issued a Shipley to Leeds ticket, but then I realised £7.20 is too high a price for that, and remembered little unstaffed Shepley, which of course is not too far from Huddersfield.
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I'm heading down south in a few weeks and was thinking I might buy my tickets from somebody who is using the new machines then see what response I get all over the place.

It'd be hilarious if you were to buy a ticket to somewhere like Chalfont & Latimer and use the Metropolitan line

Or will the machines issue Travelcards and tickets to London Zones?

 

[HMS Ark Royal]

Interesting that they refer to the National Conditions of Travel, which don't exist

Would that make the ticket invalid?

 

[Clip]

Would that make the ticket invalid?

No. Why would you think that?

 

[Haywain]

Or will the machines issue Travelcards and tickets to London Zones?

Not in a format that TfL deem to be acceptable, no.

 

[Starmill]

I see. That is amusing. So perhaps if you requested a ticket to Chalfont & Latimer, the correct response would be to let the customer out of the gates and ask them to join the ticket office queue.

 

[Solent&Wessex]

Not in a format that TfL deem to be acceptable, no.

Tickets to or via LU destinations, including cross London transfers are - apparently - not allowed to be issued by these machines as LU won't recognise the ticket stock.

For this reason GWR and also Greater Anglia are, I believe, using a mixture of printers - printers which issue CCST on mag stripe cards as now on the mainline services, with paper roll stock on those further away which won't sell London tickets.

What would happen when you get to the LU gates if you did have a perfectly valid cross London ticket on paper stock remains to be seen.

 

[jon0844]

They look quite good, I think. Interesting that they are using the BR Rail Alphabet font - maybe that's an anti-forgery feature.

I've got that font on my Mac and don't think it's hard to get hold of. But, it's nice to use it anyway.

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

Ironic, then, that my only problem with them will be that they're so huge they won't go into my existing ticket wallets. My Oyster card, Southern Key and other ITSO cards, Railcard, pink photocard and current stack of tickets already all live in the same place. Alas one of these will not fit. Knowing me, that means I'll probably lose one too.

I suspect the reason the rail industry has persisted in using credit card sized tickets for so long has much to do with exactly this point. In spite of the fact that it has restricted the ability to put very much useful information on the ticket.

On the other hand how often do you lose a £5 note?

I see. That is amusing. So perhaps if you requested a ticket to Chalfont & Latimer, the correct response would be to let the customer out of the gates and ask them to join the ticket office queue.

Tickets to or via LU destinations, including cross London transfers are - apparently - not allowed to be issued by these machines as LU won't recognise the ticket stock.

For this reason GWR and also Greater Anglia are, I believe, using a mixture of printers - printers which issue CCST on mag stripe cards as now on the mainline services, with paper roll stock on those further away which won't sell London tickets.

What would happen when you get to the LU gates if you did have a perfectly valid cross London ticket on paper stock remains to be seen.

The "correct" solution would be to issue a part fare with an instruction to obtain an excess from someone with a suitable machine. And I'm sure the TOCs will make sure to refresh their staff in excess procedures.....:roll:

 

[yorksrob]

I suspect the reason the rail industry has persisted in using credit card sized tickets for so long has much to do with exactly this point. In spite of the fact that it has restricted the ability to put very much useful information on the ticket.

Well, they did used to have those airline style tickets which never used to fit anywhere (except for Ladies' handbags).

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

Well, they did used to have those airline style tickets which never used to fit anywhere (except for Ladies' handbags).

Strangely enough many European railways use such tickets for their own domestic journeys allowing reservations and other useful information to be in one place. Are we less capable than them of dealing with such articles? Or is it a case of "they're incompatible with standard gate equipment (specification largely dictated by London Underground) so we can't have them".

 

[yorksrob]

Strangely enough many European railways use such tickets for their own domestic journeys allowing reservations and other useful information to be in one place. Are we less capable than them of dealing with such articles? Or is it a case of "they're incompatible with standard gate equipment (specification largely dictated by London Underground) so we can't have them".

Well, they've always been incompatible with the gates. But then again they could easily fit the reservation data on the back of a magna ticket above the stripe so the ticket fits into the gates and your wallet (afterall, that's pretty much the only necessary information that couldn't be fitted in the traditional ticket layout).

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

Well, they've always been incompatible with the gates. But then again they could easily fit the reservation data on the back of a magna ticket above the stripe so the ticket fits into the gates and your wallet (afterall, that's pretty much the only necessary information that couldn't be fitted in the traditional ticket layout).

Perhaps it's our gates that have it wrong. How do Eurostar or airport gates cope? As for using the reverse of the current tickets you'll be lucky to fit more than 2 lines reliably. Plenty of journeys need more than that. If we can manage to carry our smartphones without leaving them behind all the time I'm sure that taking suitable care of larger tickets is within the capabilities of the cast majority of people. In fact larger tickets might even be more difficult to forget.

 

[island]

Perhaps it's our gates that have it wrong. How do Eurostar or airport gates cope?

Eurostar gates use 2D barcodes and previously had slots into which ATB tickets can be inserted.

Airports have people to check passengers' boarding passes and IDs when boarding. Where automated gates are in place, they also use 2D barcodes.

 

[yorksrob]

Perhaps it's our gates that have it wrong. How do Eurostar or airport gates cope? As for using the reverse of the current tickets you'll be lucky to fit more than 2 lines reliably. Plenty of journeys need more than that. If we can manage to carry our smartphones without leaving them behind all the time I'm sure that taking suitable care of larger tickets is within the capabilities of the cast majority of people. In fact larger tickets might even be more difficult to forget.

I want something that fits in my pocket.

There can be few journeys (those of some of our more intrepid members excepted) that justify more than three reservations. Even going from St Ives to Kyle of Lochalsh, a normal traveller would probably only require a reservation for St Erth - London, London - Edinburgh, Edinburgh - Glasgow for example.

Perhaps the fact that we 'need' so many reservations may be because too many journey legs are now reservable.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I'd rather the ticket showed all legs, then I don't need to carry any other copy of my itinerary.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

....The "correct" solution would be to issue a part fare with an instruction to obtain an excess from someone with a suitable machine....

A sort of paper "Travelcard Exchange" ticket? That really does sound vaguely familiar, but I can't quite place it.....

....And I'm sure the TOCs will make sure to refresh their staff in excess procedures.....:roll:

 

[Wallsendmag]

Why not give them a receipt on the train with a reference to pick up normal tickets at a TVM?

 

[Dent]

They do seem almost ATB sized, which is quite good as it allows for details to be printed more clearly.

Would be useful if they were used for Advance tickets, but since they will only be used for walk-up tickets there isn't really any more detail needed.
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Ironic, then, that my only problem with them will be that they're so huge they won't go into my existing ticket wallets. My Oyster card, Southern Key and other ITSO cards, Railcard, pink photocard and current stack of tickets already all live in the same place. Alas one of these will not fit. Knowing me, that means I'll probably lose one too.

You could fold them.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Would be useful if they were used for Advance tickets, but since they will only be used for walk-up tickets there isn't really any more detail needed.

The space could be used to give more information on Permitted Routes and restrictions for a walk-up ticket e.g. the abridged version of the restriction text.

 

[Starmill]

They're even bigger than they look!!!

Who was it said about the £5 note?

 

[Bletchleyite]

ATB size?

 

[Starmill]

Possibly?

 

[Starmill]

They've managed to get the odd wording on the back too. The paper is a touch thin. It's not as bad as it could have been and better than Sportis. However you are going to need at least 4 creases per ticket really.

Also I've really got to wonder why 'railcard' needed to be all caps.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

I wonder how well the guard's scanner will read the 2D barcode where the ticket has been folded and the fold goes through the barcode

 

[ainsworth74]

I wonder how well the guard's scanner will read the 2D barcode where the ticket has been folded and the fold goes through the barcode

Why would the guard need to scan the ticket?

 

[Starmill]

I don't know. But guards and RPIs equipped with scanners do scan tickets with the codes.

 

[Wallsendmag]

Why would the guard need to scan the ticket?

Instead of stamping it

 

[Solent&Wessex]

They're even bigger than they look!!!

Who was it said about the £5 note?

They've managed to get the odd wording on the back too. The paper is a touch thin. It's not as bad as it could have been and better than Sportis. However you are going to need at least 4 creases per ticket really.

Also I've really got to wonder why 'railcard' needed to be all caps.

Ah. Good to see they have corrected something which wasn't working - it says what Railcard discount is applied. On test they weren't showing the text apparently, just the dot at the top, and apparently the only way to find the type of discount was to scan the code. I believe it was made fairly clear this needed to be corrected, which thankfully I see it has.

Why would the guard need to scan the ticket?

Apparently in the future scanning will be encouraged rather than stamping.

 

[crehld]

They've managed to get the odd wording on the back too. The paper is a touch thin. It's not as bad as it could have been and better than Sportis. However you are going to need at least 4 creases per ticket really.

Also I've really got to wonder why 'railcard' needed to be all caps.

With ll that space on the back it does beg the Question of why the endorsements box has been kept so small!