Trivia: What is the shortest heritage railway by length?

[Shimbleshanks]

There's an approx 3ft length of track in Rotary Fields, our local park in Purley, to commemorate the Surrey Iron Railway. And before anyone writes to say that the SIR was 3'6", not standard, the gauge has been set in error at 4' 8 1/2"...

 

[duffield]

What is the difference between a tramway and a railway. They both run on rails and potentially a tramcar could run on a normal railway. I see a tramway as a specialized railway with stock designed for street running

Well, you've got your railway (say, ECML), you've got your tramway (say, Blackpool), and you've got your Tramway Railway (say, defunct Weymouth Harbour branch, standard mainline trains but running along the road), and you've got your railway style tramway (say, Nottingham Express Transit trams running alongside the NR Robin Hood line on an ex-rail formation on railway-like lines but with tram signals).

Then you've got your Tram-trains...

Summary: It's complicated, you have to take it on a case-by-case basis, but there are a few things you can say:

Trams don't have toilets (not all trains have toilets, but if it has a toilet it's almost certainly not a tram).
Tramways can typically have much tighter curves than trains can handle.
Modern tramways are always electric (overhead, safe conductor rail, battery).
Tramways mostly have stops closer together than railways.
Trams don't have catering.
Tramways always have at least *some* street running - trains *may* rarely have some limited street running (this is a reason why the Newcastle Metro system is not a tram system, it's a local light rail network).

I'm sure someone will come up with counter-examples to these!

Summary: It's difficult to define the difference exactly but that doesn't mean there isn't one!

 

[Harvey B]

you've got your Tramway Railway (say, defunct Weymouth Harbour branch, standard mainline trains but running along the road),

Could the steam railway at preston be used as an example too (albeit it's not all on the road)

 

[A0wen]

Northampton & Lamport? Well, technically one station for now, they recently built a new stop near Boughton signalling. Also may not be the shortest, but this is my local, so a bit of patriotism.

Nice try - but the NLR is a bit long at 1.5 miles.

A better shot from Northampton would be the Northampton Ironstone railway on Hunsbury Hill with only 0.25 miles currently operational - though it did have 1.5 miles at one time.

Slightly bizarrely - and a bit OT - the Ironstone Railway has somehow ended up with an eclectic selection of ex Southern EMUs including 3 x CEP cars, 3 x EPB, 1 x BIG car and rarest of all, one of the surviving 4DD cars which is quietly returning to nature.

 

[Chrisgr31]

I was going to suggest the Lavender Line however it appears to have been extended whilst I wasnt paying attention. It also wouldnt have qualified as it didnt go from statio to station however it now goes from Isfield to Worth Halt. Wikipedia suggests its a mile 1.6km long, measuring it on google maps suggests its 1.45km

 

[MotCO]

I was going to suggest the Waterloo and City line - it did run old stock not so long ago so 'could' be called heritage, but it's too long at around 1.5 miles.

 

[Harvey B]

I was going to suggest the Waterloo and City line - it did run old stock not so long ago so 'could' be called heritage, but it's too long at around 1.5 miles.

Not run by steam and underground lines aren't really heritage railways unless its the old epping to ongar branch (which is a steam railway)

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Both are museums so they don't count

All preserved railways are museums in a sense... just outdoor ones that are long (or not, as this thread shows) and thin!

 

[Edders23]

The Colne Valley Railway is under a mile.

Yes a few hundred yards in each direction from the station but I don't think it is the shortest even though it feels like it when you go up and down in the bubble car

 

[Karl]

Could the steam railway at preston be used as an example too (albeit it's not all on the road)

How long exactly is the Ribble Steam Railway? Being a Prestonian I ought to know really.

 

[Harvey B]

All preserved railways are museums in a sense... just outdoor ones that are long (or not, as this thread shows) and thin!

Does that "all heritage railways are museums" thing extend to the longer railways such as severn valley and NYMR

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Does that "all heritage railways are museums" thing extend to the longer railways such as severn valley and NMR

In a sense yes. My post was tongue-in-cheek but heritage railways are essentially living, working museums. They are railways operating with historic equipment that you don't often see on the national network.

 

[Journeyman]

How long is the track at the Waverley Heritage Centre in Whitrope? Possibly just about the most remote heritage railway you'll find anywhere.

 

[Simon Flack]

The Lavendar Line in Sussex is 0.9 miles (although they claim its 1 mile) using google earth Measurement. It has 2 stations Isfield & Worth Halt. Plenty of rolling stock so is a genuine preservation line.

 

[alexl92]

How long is the Helston railway?

 

[DarloRich]

Royal Deeside Railway? must be less than a mile.

 

[The Ham]

How long is the Helston railway?

1.25 miles:

I initially thought of Helston Railway, but that is far too long at 1.25 miles!

Although it is definitely the most southerly railway in England.

 

[paul1609]

Rother Valley Railway, Robertsbridge East Sussex mainline is just under 0.5 miles and serves 2 stations Robertsbridge Junction (RVR) and Robertsbridge (NR) possibly the shortest heritage line with a mainline connection?

 

[Alanko]

How long is the track at the Waverley Heritage Centre in Whitrope? Possibly just about the most remote heritage railway you'll find anywhere.

Good contender! There is the track running up to the tunnel, but it is so waywardly installed that I'm not sure you could call it 'railway' as such.

Track going the other way fizzles out quickly as well. Some of the sleepers looked like former third rail electric stuff, complete with insulators etc? I'm not sure how much of that stuff can be traversed.

 

[O8yityityit]

I need that bit of track. What days do you open?

12'' long and a foot crossing.......

 

[Journeyman]

Good contender! There is the track running up to the tunnel, but it is so waywardly installed that I'm not sure you could call it 'railway' as such.

Track going the other way fizzles out quickly as well. Some of the sleepers looked like former third rail electric stuff, complete with insulators etc? I'm not sure how much of that stuff can be traversed.

Yeah, I'm in that area fairly often as I help look after the bothy near the site of Riccarton Junction station, but I've never been at the heritage centre when it's open. They've just acquired two Pacers, one and a half of which are now on site, but I think the whole project there exudes a tad more optimism than is realistic. While it's undoubtedly a beautiful area, it's incredibly isolated and will never attract many people. I think they want to extend to Riccarton Junction, but that's an even more isolated place, and restoring the station to any sort of usable state will be an enormous challenge.

 

[GlitterUnicorn]

Yeah, I'm in that area fairly often as I help look after the bothy near the site of Riccarton Junction station, but I've never been at the heritage centre when it's open. They've just acquired two Pacers, one and a half of which are now on site, but I think the whole project there exudes a tad more optimism than is realistic. While it's undoubtedly a beautiful area, it's incredibly isolated and will never attract many people. I think they want to extend to Riccarton Junction, but that's an even more isolated place, and restoring the station to any sort of usable state will be an enormous challenge.

Slightly off topic but what's the relationship between the WRHA and Riccarton Junction? There seems to have been a preservation effort there that collapsed but I can't find any more details.

 

[Journeyman]

Slightly off topic but what's the relationship between the WRHA and Riccarton Junction? There seems to have been a preservation effort there that collapsed but I can't find any more details.

Some of the WHRA people were originally involved at Riccarton, I think, but it's an entirely separate organisation. The Friends of Riccarton Junction broke up incredibly acrimoniously, amid all sorts of corruption and bullying. All the work they did at Riccarton Junction has vanished, besides a reproduction sign on the platform.

 

[Alanko]

Some of the WHRA people were originally involved at Riccarton, I think, but it's an entirely separate organisation. The Friends of Riccarton Junction broke up incredibly acrimoniously, amid all sorts of corruption and bullying. All the work they did at Riccarton Junction has vanished, besides a reproduction sign on the platform.

I was down there with friends at the end of last year and found an information board was still on site, but the place was very overgrown. We tried to get up to the stationmaster's house but it was an impossible task.

I saw the graffiti scratched into the windows, as you described. From memory somebody is both corpulent and illegitimate!

 

[the sniper]

While novel to have a look around if you're a proper rail enthusiast, just for how odd it is, the Waverley Heritage Centre is pretty much a blot on the beautiful landscape it occupies. Particularly its collection of rolling stock just makes the place look a mess. Luckily for them there aren't too many locals around to kick up a fuss.

 

[Journeyman]

While novel to have a look around if you're a proper rail enthusiast, just for how odd it is, the Waverley Heritage Centre is pretty much a blot on the beautiful landscape it occupies. Particularly its collection of rolling stock just makes the place look a mess. Luckily for them there aren't too many locals around to kick up a fuss.

Agreed. To me it's a classic example of the railway preservation movement spreading itself far too thinly, and attempting to do something of questionable value, simply because the route had a big reputation in the past. There's not really any realistic chance of it growing to a sustainable railway of any length, and it's far too far away from anywhere to attract a decent trade. The random collection of crumbling rolling stock is hardly going to attract normals either.

 

[Cowley]

Agreed. To me it's a classic example of the railway preservation movement spreading itself far too thinly, and attempting to do something of questionable value, simply because the route had a big reputation in the past. There's not really any realistic chance of it growing to a sustainable railway of any length, and it's far too far away from anywhere to attract a decent trade. The random collection of crumbling rolling stock is hardly going to attract normals either.

Amen to that Journeyman. A classic story (that we’ve heard so many times unfortunately) of a small group all falling out with each other rather than being able to find a way of working together.

 

[Journeyman]

Amen to that Journeyman. A classic story (that we’ve heard so many times unfortunately) of a small group all falling out with each other rather than being able to find a way of working together.

Yeah. From my involvement with a much bigger and longer established railway, I can tell you that the movement faces very challenging days ahead, and in pretty much every case right now the future of railway preservation would be much better served by people helping out at existing railways, rather than trying to start new ones in hopeless places.

 

[Cowley]

Yeah. From my involvement with a much bigger and longer established railway, I can tell you that the movement faces very challenging days ahead, and in pretty much every case right now the future of railway preservation would be much better served by people helping out at existing railways, rather than trying to start new ones in hopeless places.

Yes I’ve felt that for a long time.
I’ve often thought that it might be interesting to start a thread on the subject of which preserved lines might be left in 25/30 years time? But there’s actually no telling.
It depends on who’s involved, how well it’s run as a business, and so many other factors...
I don’t think any of us could have predicted how well the industry is doing now 25 years ago?

 

[reddragon]

Well, you've got your railway (say, ECML), you've got your tramway (say, Blackpool), and you've got your Tramway Railway (say, defunct Weymouth Harbour branch, standard mainline trains but running along the road), and you've got your railway style tramway (say, Nottingham Express Transit trams running alongside the NR Robin Hood line on an ex-rail formation on railway-like lines but with tram signals).

Then you've got your Tram-trains...

Summary: It's complicated, you have to take it on a case-by-case basis, but there are a few things you can say:

Trams don't have toilets (not all trains have toilets, but if it has a toilet it's almost certainly not a tram).
Tramways can typically have much tighter curves than trains can handle.
Modern tramways are always electric (overhead, safe conductor rail, battery).
Tramways mostly have stops closer together than railways.
Trams don't have catering.
Tramways always have at least *some* street running - trains *may* rarely have some limited street running (this is a reason why the Newcastle Metro system is not a tram system, it's a local light rail network).

I'm sure someone will come up with counter-examples to these!

Summary: It's difficult to define the difference exactly but that doesn't mean there isn't one!

These German trams have toilets

https://www.railjournal.com/passenger/light-rail/karlsruhe-orders-more-bombardier-tram-trains/

The 37m-long three-section tram-trains are 2.65m wide and can accommodate 244 passengers. The vehicles are designed for step-free access and are equipped with air-conditioning and toilets. They will also be prepared for the installation of WiFi.