Virgin Trains East Coast plan 'customer zones' + RMT strike action SUSPENDED

[Drogba11CFC]

Interesting how the RMT are targeting one of the planned routes of my June ALR. Coincidence? I'm starting to doubt it.

 

[gavin]

Northern strike announced for the 28th along with VTEC

 

[gavin]

VTEC now have a message up

Virgin Trains promises near normal timetable during RMT strike action on the east coast
13/04/17

Virgin Trains is reassuring customers that it will run a near normal timetable during the industrial action announced today by the RMT. The union says its members will walk-out for 48 hours on 28th and 29th April on Virgin Trains east coast route.

However, Virgin Trains’ detailed contingency plans mean a near normal timetable will run.

Virgin Trains has made changes to customer-facing roles on board which see a single person take responsibility for the customer experience on our trains, supported by a team. This will mean a better experience for customers. It also has zero impact on safety. We have repeatedly assured the RMT that the safety critical role of the guard will remain on board, with the new Train Manager role taking responsibility.

Virgin Trains has given assurances on each point raised by the union at the start of the dispute in May 2016 – such as ruling out any compulsory redundancies as a result of the changes. The RMT has already held a futile 24hr walkout on this issue on 3rd October 2016 – during which Virgin Trains ran a full timetable.

David Horne, Managing Director for Virgin Trains on the east coast said, “We have worked hard to ensure there are comprehensive contingency plans in place and I want to reassure our customers that our timetable will be almost completely unaffected during this walk-out, as well as during any subsequent strikes by the RMT. Passengers can book and plan their journeys as normal and with confidence.

“The changes we have made are part of the customer-centric revolution that’s underway on the east coast. We’ve already completely refreshed our entire fleet of trains with all new interiors, and next year we will have our ground-breaking Azuma trains coming into service. Alongside more modern trains, we want a modern customer service proposition – one that focuses firmly on the customer.

“The on-board changes came into force on March 31st 2017. Last week – the first full week since the changes – saw us achieve our second highest customer satisfaction score since taking over the franchise, so we are confident the changes are benefitting customers.

“With our guarantees that there will be no compulsory redundancies, no impact on safety and a near normal timetable in place during the walk-outs, this pointless strike will cost RMT members pay for no reason, and we urge the union to rejoin us for further discussions.”

There is no industrial action planned for Virgin Trains on the west coast.

https://www.virgintrainseastcoast.com/news/rmt-strike-announcement/?id=9292

 

[4973]

I've just had an email from VTEC.

So have I - and its a dilly -- claiming I'm booked to travel with them on 28th/29th.

Actually while I booked through them I'm actually travelling with Chiltern + FGW !!

 

[BestWestern]

This would seem to have echoes of an earlier dispute at another future IEP operating TOC. I presume VTEC want DCO?

 

[BML247]

Thoguht this was about the customer zones?

 

[TUC]

Thoguht this was about the customer zones?

At least partly about the role of guards

Virgin Trains East Coast staff to stage 48-hour strike - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-39586686

Workers on Virgin Trains East Coast and Arriva's Northern service plan to strike on 28 April in a row about the role of on-board staff.

The Virgin stoppage will continue on 29 April but the firm said it planned a "near-normal" timetable.

The RMT wanted "explicit clarification" on the future role of guards, it said.

 

[Bertie the bus]

Thoguht this was about the customer zones?

Who knows with the RMT? It could be about changing their coffee from Nescafe to Kenco.

 

[Greenback]

Please see http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=133111

 

[AlterEgo]

At least partly about the role of guards

Virgin Trains East Coast staff to stage 48-hour strike - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-39586686

Basically they want train managers to manage the onboard staff, too.

 

[godfreycomplex]

Its ok. Stagecoach had SWT, EMT and VTEC managers trained to be 'contingency' Guards so that the core route from London to Leeds/Edinburgh can run a near normal service.

It's not OK.

 

[43096]

It's not OK.

Why is it not OK? From the passenger's point of view it means trains still run, which is good.

Maybe if you're one of the class warrior Bolsheviks in the union it's an issue, as all it does is cost members a days pay for next to no impact. Bet union leaders aren't forgoing a days pay in solidarity with the brothers!?

 

[godfreycomplex]

Why is it not OK? From the passenger's point of view it means trains still run, which is good.

Maybe if you're one of the class warrior Bolsheviks in the union it's an issue, as all it does is cost members a days pay for next to no impact. Bet union leaders aren't forgoing a days pay in solidarity with the brothers!?

I am getting a badge made saying "class warrior Bolshevik and proud" as we speak

 

[Bletchleyite]

This would seem to have echoes of an earlier dispute at another future IEP operating TOC. I presume VTEC want DCO?

This should surely not be as contentious as commuter DCO? As there would still be a second member of staff, and it should fairly easily be possible to ensure they are safety trained and required.

I can't see an issue with a more airline-style model of a more flexible (but still fully safety-trained) on-board staff concept, and the driver doing the doors.

Why, for instance, can't the same person check tickets as they serve coffees in 1st? Why, if you board without a ticket in Standard, can't you go to the buffet car to purchase one? (That would be quite a good concept - if you don't, you're a fare dodger and deserve the book throwing at you).

 

[Andyh82]

Due to bad reporting, lumping it in with the Northern/Merseyrail dispute, and the RMT not doing anything to stop that, there is now a section of the public who think VTEC are wanting to go to driver only operation.

I'm guessing the RMT are aiming for a national strike, as presumably all 4 (the ones mentioned plus Southern) will now all strike on the same day.

I'm not sure they are really having much impact, as because most are up north, and the southern ones are now seen as boring to the press, the story only gets mentioned in brief half way down the bulletin or half way though a newspaper.

 

[Geezertronic]

Is this making VTEC more inline with the VTWC operation?

 

[Chester1]

Due to bad reporting, lumping it in with the Northern/Merseyrail dispute, and the RMT not doing anything to stop that, there is now a section of the public who think VTEC are wanting to go to driver only operation.

I'm guessing the RMT are aiming for a national strike, as presumably all 4 (the ones mentioned plus Southern) will now all strike on the same day.

I'm not sure they are really having much impact, as because most are up north, and the southern ones are now seen as boring to the press, the story only gets mentioned in brief half way down the bulletin or half way though a newspaper.

I think they would be disappointed by the results of a national strike. There are plenty of guards who work on trains too old for DOO, many of them will be expecting to retire before the stock is replaced or don't mind a few years of DOO and only some not affected will strike in solidarity. ASLEF seem to be more measured in their approach to DOO and its not guarented that the members would support a national strike or if they did that it would be a large majority striking Thinking about my own area (North West England and North Wales), Id expect VTWC to run a good service during a national strike, cuting London-Chester/Holyhead in order to limit other service cancellations. Arriva running could probably run Holyhead-Crewe and Chester-Cardiff. Merseyrail and Northern could run a very basic service. I am not too sure about TPE. EMT and CrossCountry could probably run a decent service. Manchester Metrolink would keep the city running.

 

[43096]

I am getting a badge made saying "class warrior Bolshevik and proud" as we speak

Noticeable that you haven't answered the question....

 

[Starmill]

Is this making VTEC more inline with the VTWC operation?

I don't see how...

Also, if the other person is still required to be on the train, that doesn't seem to fit the definition of DCO I have heard. Presumably this is where the dispute comes from. If VTEC were not planning to run the train in any circumstances without a second person, then I don't see why they would not just tell RMT that and remove their grounds for going on strike.

 

[godfreycomplex]

Noticeable that you haven't answered the question....

When you use rhetoric like that why bother?

 

[LowLevel]

This should surely not be as contentious as commuter DCO? As there would still be a second member of staff, and it should fairly easily be possible to ensure they are safety trained and required.

I can't see an issue with a more airline-style model of a more flexible (but still fully safety-trained) on-board staff concept, and the driver doing the doors.

Why, for instance, can't the same person check tickets as they serve coffees in 1st? Why, if you board without a ticket in Standard, can't you go to the buffet car to purchase one? (That would be quite a good concept - if you don't, you're a fare dodger and deserve the book throwing at you).

EMT already have a system whereby the train manager is meant to prioritise 1st class service and that's meant they're almost an endangered species in standard class - not good when visibility through the train is being pushed for various reasons.

There is no reason for the guard not to do the doors on Intercity services. They can get a look at people boarding, spot any issues with luggage pile up, and move around more freely on the platform to spot any potential issues.

Leaving behind your safety critical employee becomes much easier causing train running problems. Abandoning the train manager on a long distance express could cause a multitude of issues on board even down to something as daft as them having left something in the oven.

In addition any deal that would remove the right of the guard to make decisions on the train's operation would be an automatic deal breaker for me - if I say it stops for police attention or medical assistance then it should happen without having to seek the 'permission' of the driver.

The performance or customer service benefits are just not there - it's next to impossible to move through a busy Intercity service when people are getting on and off with luggage etc.

 

[NorthernSpirit]

Disgusting. I already pay for my account so I expect service from a teller. As for Virgin East Coast, listen up SOUTER AND BRANSON, I want service from one person who knows their job. I do not want to have to deal with some spotty child from an agency who wants to sell me the wrong ticket.

To the kid its just a part time job that beats working in KFC. I can see where your coming from though as it is likely that the recruits will have some element og retail experience even if its on the lines of not giving a rats arse about customer service as they're employed by an agency and to me agency means disposable staffing.

 

[43096]

When you use rhetoric like that why bother?

You are Mick Cash and I claim my tenner.

 

[TUC]

Its ok. Stagecoach had SWT, EMT and VTEC managers trained to be 'contingency' Guards so that the core route from London to Leeds/Edinburgh can run a near normal service.

It's not OK.

Why not? From a customer's point of view (I am due to travel with VTEC on 28 April), the only issue that matters is being able to travel as planned. It's very OK.

 

[AlterEgo]

To the kid its just a part time job that beats working in KFC. I can see where your coming from though as it is likely that the recruits will have some element og retail experience even if its on the lines of not giving a rats arse about customer service as they're employed by an agency and to me agency means disposable staffing.

The post you quoted is over nine months old...

 

[ainsworth74]

This would seem to have echoes of an earlier dispute at another future IEP operating TOC. I presume VTEC want DCO?

As far as I'm aware VTEC are keeping traditional driver/guard operation for dispatch and doors. This dispute seems to be focused around predominately changes to the way that the catering crew is run and, in terms of guards, the role becoming more of a Train Manager role with them being responsible for supervising and managing the catering crew rather than just focusing on safety critical tasks and revenue.

Things may have moved on since but certainly, as far as I'm aware, that was what the first round of strike action boiled down to.

 

[BestWestern]

This should surely not be as contentious as commuter DCO? As there would still be a second member of staff, and it should fairly easily be possible to ensure they are safety trained and required.

I can't see an issue with a more airline-style model of a more flexible (but still fully safety-trained) on-board staff concept, and the driver doing the doors.

Because the RSSB themselves have identified that the 'Platform-Train Interface' brings significant safety issues and DOO neglects to adequately address those issues, for a start. Secondly, because the DfT have pound signs in their eyes and the management at other TOCs have been shown in the recent past to be dishonest, evasive and at times downright liars and bullies, and there is such a thing as a slippery slope.

As a (pedantic!) side note, the airline model doesn't involve pilots 'doing the doors', either! They get the thing from A to B, the people in charge of the safety of the passengers get them on and off. Works for me!

 

[BestWestern]

As far as I'm aware VTEC are keeping traditional driver/guard operation for dispatch and doors. This dispute seems to be focused around predominately changes to the way that the catering crew is run and, in terms of guards, the role becoming more of a Train Manager role with them being responsible for supervising and managing the catering crew rather than just focusing on safety critical tasks and revenue.

Things may have moved on since but certainly, as far as I'm aware, that was what the first round of strike action boiled down to.

If that is indeed the case, then the dispute seems rather daft. But that's a big statement without evidence!

 

[LowLevel]

The question regarding the guard is that only a very woolly sentence about retaining the safety critical role of the guard 'on the train' seems to have been issued with further comment on the platform not being forthcoming.

 

[BestWestern]

The question regarding the guard is that only a very woolly sentence about retaining the safety critical role of the guard 'on the train' seems to have been issued with further comment on the platform not being forthcoming.

Ah, there we are then. Again, similarities with events elsewhere. In that case I wish our Brothers and Sisters all the very best on the picket lines.