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Which Union?
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BravoGolfMike
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Threads like this usually produce fireworks. I am in ASLEF but there is a lot they do which I fundamentally disagree with, however I would not want to be represented by anyone else should I be unfortunate enough to have an incident. Some depots are majority RMT though so that may be better. You don't have to join right away so wait till you get to your depot, discuss it with your minder and others and then decide. If you join at your depot you can have the subs taken out of your wages direct too, save messing about with a direct debit.
AlterEgo
Veteran Member
I'm not a driver, but my father was in ASLEF and they looked after him very well.
Cherry_Picker
Established Member
Generally speaking:
Drivers - ASLEF
Operational staff (inc guards, signallers, dispatchers, shunters etc) - RMT
Clerical/White Collar staff - TSSA.
I think a sizeable portion of ticket office staff choose RMT over TSSA though. I guess that is down to who is the dominant union at your location. If you know a union rep personally and trust them, then it is a good idea to go with that union. As a guard, I'd go RMT.
RPM
Established Member
I've been very well looked after by ASLEF. Worth every penny.
RMT for you, although uncle Bob can be a bit gobby it is by far the best union for operational staff (except drivers who should join ASLEF).
ASLEF - It's an old fashioned craft specific union, for what is a very specific job. If you mess up, you will be represented by people who have done the job themselves, and the management know that.
Legal service first class too. Had cause to make use of it after a workplace accident. Also good for routine legal stuff too, conveyancing, etc.
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As stated above, RMT for other oprtational grades. Your reps will have done your job.
For those who have not worked on the railway, the unions are "embeded". In many ways, they perform many of the functions of a HR department in a regular company. For my money, they do it better.
The railway is not a closed shop so there is no requirement to join a union but it would be unusual not to do so and I also think it would be unwise (due to the benefits of being in a union). But as far as I'm aware there are staff that aren't a member of any union.
No you do not have to join any union at all but it is best to be in a union "just in case" they are needed.
There are drivers at my depot in ASLEF, RMT, ATCU and two not in any union at all, you pays your money and takes your choice.
Depends on which toc tbh
Cherry_Picker
Established Member
Once upon a time (70s mostly) people wouldnt even talk to drivers who werent in the union at certain depots, and while that is certainly not the case any more you will probably be asked to join and questioned for your reasons on not joining if you decided against it.
For what it's worth ASLEF has been a very good thing for the drivers grade, they deal with day to day stuff that almost everybody takes for granted but almost certainly wouldnt exist in it's current state if it wasnt for ASLEF (I'm talking salary, holiday and sick pay entitlements, stopping things like split shifts being introduced, keeping PNBs off trains and so on) and they are there to fight your corner if an incident does happen and you need legal representation. You definitely should sign up if you are a driver.
You may find that you become a slight outcast in some ways if you don't but as people have said its not essential.
The issue others will have if you don't is that the union, funded by those who are a member, are largely responsible for the salary and T&CS that you will be be benefiting from and it may be viewed as unfair for you not to contribute whilst still reaping the rewards.
There is also the issue if you don't take part in any industrial action voted on. I know people who have refused to take part in the past mainly due to a desire not to loose a days wages and they very quickly become ex communicated.
Also, the management will know if you are not in a union and it makes it far easier for them to get rid of you if you have an incident etc.
The union will only help you keep your job if you are a fully paid up member at the time if the incident, not if you join afterwards.
Your choice but if you do not it could come back and bite you. Here is a scenario, your depot is in disripute with your company and they decide to take strike action. You cannot strike and if you do not attend work you will be charged of gross misconduct (sackable offence), you have to pass the picket line and will be known as a scab. I was with a driver who I thought was liked by all a few years back and he attended work during a strike and was blackballed for 22 years and was still unliked by people even after all the time and was known as the depot scab.
It's your decision but when I took on trainees and was asked this question I gave them the answer I have just given you. The unions will also protect you in a situation where you have been accused of doing wrong, if you haven't the unions will take on the case and believe me they are worth every penny.
View your union sub as job protection insurance. Also remember, that mistakes as a driver can land you in court. They will represent you in that situation as well.
You can opt out of paying the political levy to the Labour party.
BravoGolfMike
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Whilst this is true to a point, it is 2013 now and calling someone a scab is a sackable offence. Management take a dim view of bullying and rightly so. If you choose not to join a union you can join them in the event of a strike so it's not the end of the world.
Are you in a union???
BravoGolfMike
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On page one I said I was in ASLEF.
Depends how its done. Generally people arnt called a scab to their face-they are just made social outcasts, no one will talk to them, do fiddles, swap jobs, sit with them in mess rooms etc.
And that's not bullying-at least not in a way management can prove!
BravoGolfMike
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Yes that is also very true. I don't agree with it however and won't participate in blackballing someone just because they worked through a strike.
Doesn't always happen like that though. Some moron called someone a scab on facebook during a strike a few years ago....
Doesn't always happen like that though. Some moron called someone a scab on facebook during a strike a few years ago....
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Silv1983
Member
Every one has told me to join ASLEF. It's considered a "no-brainer" amongst the drivers'.
My only gripe is I'd prefer the option to do rest day working occasionally to help with the bills etc - and ASLEFs website leaves a lot to be desired for updates, facts and figures with pay etc. They don't seem bothered about keeping it up to date.
My only gripe is I'd prefer the option to do rest day working occasionally to help with the bills etc - and ASLEFs website leaves a lot to be desired for updates, facts and figures with pay etc. They don't seem bothered about keeping it up to date.
You will still be able to do rest day work-if you company has any going it will most likely be agreed with aslef anyway.
As for the website-I wouldn't let that put you off. Just because they don't always update the website it dosnt mean they arnt any good!
When you start at the company the union guys will be all over you to get you to join anyway so see what they have to say and what other drivers think there.
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