Will you be eating out to help out?

[bramling]

Many people have, but a significant number have not.

Attendance at our forum events (including informal evening meals) is well down compared to normal.

There is a huge pressure from the "stay home" brigade which caused many people to delay going out, but as more and more people see their friends going out, slowly but surely people are being persuaded.

Time will tell I guess. It does seem extremely fickle that £10 off a meal can apparently persuade people to take down the barricades and emerge. If only getting them back to work was that simple.

 

[MontyMinerWA]

Something worth considering is that if people are worried about losing their jobs the last thing they'll spend their money on is eating out. You only have to look at the number of people losing their jobs to realise that consumer confidence will be low for some considerable time.

 

[Scrotnig]

I wonder how many people are put off by the sheer hassle of it all? Silly procedures to 'keep everyone safe', one way systens, collecting details. I appreciate not all places are going too far, but I just can't be bothered to trawl round and see who is doing what.

Exactly. Plus the risk of an arbitrary 14 day prison sentence.

I won’t be going out (by which I mean, for meals, entertainment etc) until all such nonsense goes away. I fear, however, that this will be....never.

 

[johnnychips]

Exactly. Plus the risk of an arbitrary 14 day prison sentence.

I won’t be going out (by which I mean, for meals, entertainment etc) until all such nonsense goes away. I fear, however, that this will be....never.

What ‘arbitrary prison sentence’ are you talking about? You must realise you come across as Fraser in ‘Dad’s Army’ all the time - Google it if you are under 40. I agree with a lot of what you say, but try and get out. You are doing your own head in. If you ‘won’t be going out’ then if you do go out and subsequently get quarantined (the chances of which are minimal), then it’s no difference.

I really recommend you give it a go

 

[Butts]

Went to The Beefeater in Dundee last night with my Daughter and her friend.

Excellent experience - no masks (staff use voluntary) , no plastic dividers, just well spaced out tables.

Hardly upmarket cuisine but with 50% off the whole bill (including non-alcoholic drinks) who cares?

3 Courses for 3 people (2 Main Steaks) drinks for under £50 !!

Only complaint they don't have a cheeseboard or the bill would have been a little higher.

 

[Djgr]

Exactly. Plus the risk of an arbitrary 14 day prison sentence.

I won’t be going out (by which I mean, for meals, entertainment etc) until all such nonsense goes away. I fear, however, that this will be....never.

In my experience the "hassle" is negligible and you can see from the reviews on here that the vast majority of people have had a good experience

 

[Djgr]

Apply for the scheme. Train the staff to answer questions. Train the staff up to figure out the correct discount (or get the till reprogrammed assuming that the oppo that handles that isn't furloughed), give the staff permissions to hand out those kinds of discounts, pay their book-keeper to get an accurate figure, submit the figure to HMRC, and then sit on their hands watching their existing cashflow issues worste while they wait for half the cost of the meal to get paid a few weeks later, whilst hoping that nobody decides to delay the payment in some kind of audit.

It's a potentially very useful scheme, but it's not without its costs and risks, and the smaller the company you are, the harder those costs and risks are to manage.

Gosh. A little bit of admin in return for trying to help your business. Life is hard.

 

[Jamiescott1]

In my experience the "hassle" is negligible and you can see from the reviews on here that the vast majority of people have had a good experience

Agreed. In hospitality you don't notice the difference and you dont need to give real details for track and trace.
Completely different experience to shops who seem to make it as difficult as possible to actually shop

 

[DB]

Gosh. A little bit of admin in return for trying to help your business. Life is hard.

It's not really clear to what extent it does actually help - has it just resulted in most of the same people going out who would anyway, but earlier in the week instead of Friday/Saturday?

 

[takno]

Gosh. A little bit of admin in return for trying to help your business. Life is hard.

It's a little bit of admin and cashflow delay when you don't have access to the admin support you normally have, everybody's trying to learn a whole new set of inane rules on masks and one way systems, and your cashflow is already shot. And if you are a pub that doesn't normally do a lot of food then it's potentially a massive expansion in your kitchen so you can take advantage at all.

It's not a bad thing, but it could have been done a lot better, and as a benefit to hard-hit businesses it's a bit of a waste. The ones that will end up hoovering up most of the benefit are the already reasonably well-funded groups who could afford to have people back off furlough to prepare, and in particular including places who were or could have been operating profitable takeaways throughout.

 

[AdamWW]

Apply for the scheme. Train the staff to answer questions. Train the staff up to figure out the correct discount (or get the till reprogrammed assuming that the oppo that handles that isn't furloughed), give the staff permissions to hand out those kinds of discounts, pay their book-keeper to get an accurate figure, submit the figure to HMRC, and then sit on their hands watching their existing cashflow issues worste while they wait for half the cost of the meal to get paid a few weeks later, whilst hoping that nobody decides to delay the payment in some kind of audit.

It's a potentially very useful scheme, but it's not without its costs and risks, and the smaller the company you are, the harder those costs and risks are to manage.

Thanks for a very clear explanation of why - like so many things - this isn't as simple as it seems.

Particularly the cash-flow aspect which is something that people unfamiliar with business accounting often aren't aware of.

 

[takno]

Thanks for a very clear explanation of why - like so many things - this isn't as simple as it seems.

Particularly the cash-flow aspect which is something that people unfamiliar with business accounting often aren't aware of.

It's mostly just guesswork tbh. If the HMRC end up being as light touch as they are promising then it could prove to be a bit easier than that. Those reasons though, combined with the worry that you're bringing people off furlough and getting your supply chain and kitchen up to higher capacity to meet an unpredictable higher demand make things difficult. And at the end of the day you could be doing it all to cover what could be a 12 day long busy season.

In practice it will be interesting to see what types of companies and what locations pick up the benefits, and we can only hope that it has helped perk demand up a bit

 

[AM9]

We went to a locally run and owned Italian in French Row , St Albans. Outstanding on a warm evening and as good as being in Italy.

The area is part pedestrian and appeared as a good replica of abroad. Very normal and busy and friendly - and we upped our game from Pizza Express to a more expensive but outstanding menu. £60 for 4 with the discount.

May I ask which one, L'Italiana or Bellaccino's? I've not been in the latter. I'd dearly love visit my favorite local medium priced joint, Little Marrakech but it is so small that it might be a little uncomfortable, - especially in the current heatwave.
I'd be quite happy to forgo the government bribe and eat when it is quieter. Last week we had lunch at Wilkins cafe at their factory in Tiptree, Essex. We gave the discount as a tip ontop of our normal one.

 

[AdamWW]

It's mostly just guesswork tbh.

Yes but based on a much better understanding of business accounting than most people have.

 

[AM9]

Time will tell I guess. It does seem extremely fickle that £10 off a meal can apparently persuade people to take down the barricades and emerge. If only getting them back to work was that simple.

It is really, - so many of the general public have only one dimension in their lives and it boils down to price. To me, either a restaurant is worth the prices on its menu or it isn't. Subsidising all eateries from public funds just keeps the not so good ones in business longer.

 

[ABB125]

I was out yesterday evening at a local pub, the bill for four came to £39.10 with the maximum £40 discount applied. Given that some alcoholic beverages were purchased (which I don't believe are included in the scheme?), I'm not quite sure how that discount was worked out (surely the bill should be more than the discount?), but I'm not complaining!

 

[AdamWW]

I was out yesterday evening at a local pub, the bill for four came to £39.10 with the maximum £40 discount applied. Given that some alcoholic beverages were purchased (which I don't believe are included in the scheme?), I'm not quite sure how that discount was worked out (surely the bill should be more than the discount?), but I'm not complaining!

That suggests a misinterpretation of the rules.

Not your problem...but it might be the pub's....

 

[ABB125]

That suggests a misinterpretation of the rules.

Not your problem...but it might be the pub's....

I don't suppose it'll make much difference in the grand scheme of things.

 

[AdamWW]

I don't suppose it'll make much difference in the grand scheme of things.

If they are trying to claim a fixed £10 per person rather than it being limited to half the food costs, HMRC might ensure it makes a difference to the pub....

 

[ChiefPlanner]

May I ask which one, L'Italiana or Bellaccino's? I've not been in the latter. I'd dearly love visit my favorite local medium priced joint, Little Marrakech but it is so small that it might be a little uncomfortable, - especially in the current heatwave.
I'd me quite happy to forgo the government bribe and eat when it is quieter. Last week we had lunch at Wilkins cafe at their factory in Tiptree, Essex. We gave the discount as a tip ontop of our normal one.

Bellacino's - truly excellent , quality food - and a good range of specials. (which we tried) , - it was OK as a baker / cafe - but has stepped up to the plate literally.

 

[ABB125]

If they are trying to claim a fixed £10 per person rather than it being limited to half the food costs, HMRC might ensure it makes a difference to the pub....

Yes, it could! (Although this was a "chain" pub that, under the previous management before they ran out of money and closed, they were always only a few weeks away from going out of business due to the... "interesting" pricing model for beer used by the chain, from whom they were obliged to buy beer. So it wouldn't be much if a surprise if the pub closed again!)
I suppose the thing to do would be to go in and order less, perhaps £15 per head or so, and see what discount is applied, but unfortunately I won't be going out again for a bit to try.

 

[yorkie]

I was out yesterday evening at a local pub, the bill for four came to £39.10 with the maximum £40 discount applied. Given that some alcoholic beverages were purchased (which I don't believe are included in the scheme?), I'm not quite sure how that discount was worked out (surely the bill should be more than the discount?), but I'm not complaining!

That suggests a misinterpretation of the rules.

Not your problem...but it might be the pub's....

I went for a curry in Crewe with other forum members (@All Line Rover @323235 @district @Jamesrob637 @Mag_seven ) and we had the opposite problem: none of the drinks were discounted, not even the non-alcoholic ones. We had to leave in a rush to get our trains, so didn't realise this at the time.

 

[AM9]

Bellacino's - truly excellent , quality food - and a good range of specials. (which we tried) , - it was OK as a baker / cafe - but has stepped up to the plate literally.

Thanks, I'll bear that in mind.

 

[Scrotnig]

What ‘arbitrary prison sentence’ are you talking about?

Hand over your details and if anyone goes into the pub at the same time as me, who later tests positive, there's a high chance I'll be sentenced to 14 days' house arrest. I have caring responsibilities, that cannot happen.

If you ‘won’t be going out’ then if you do go out and subsequently get quarantined (the chances of which are minimal), then it’s no difference.

I do go out of the house, I'm not a 'terrified to go out' sort.

 

[Scrotnig]

you dont need to give real details for track and trace.

I would find it incredibly anxiety-inducing to provide false details. I'd be lying, in effect. It may seem trivial to many but it would spoil things completely for me. I'd feel like some sort of ugitive from the law or something.

 

[AM9]

Hand over your details and if anyone goes into the pub at the same time as me, who later tests positive, there's a high chance I'll be sentenced to 14 days' house arrest. I have caring responsibilities, that cannot happen.

I do go out of the house, I'm not a 'terrified to go out' sort.

But you think that there is a more than negligible chance that you will be in the proximity of somebody who could infect you.

 

[joncombe]

Exactly. Plus the risk of an arbitrary 14 day prison sentence.

I won’t be going out (by which I mean, for meals, entertainment etc) until all such nonsense goes away. I fear, however, that this will be....never.

Well I certainly include myself in that. I was out for a walk at the at the weekend and passed a pub. There was an outside seating area with lots of empty tables, so I decided it might be nice to stop there for lunch. I was told that if you wanted to eat, you must make a reservation online. The pub in question was in an area with no mobile signal (at least on Vodafone, mine was showing "Emergency use only").

So how on earth are you supposed to make a reservation unless you plan in advance? The suggestion was you should do it from home before coming to the pub!

So I asked if it was possible to use their Wifi to make a reservation for now, but I was told that they were "fully booked". I pointed to the large number of empty tables outside and asked "even these tables outside". Then I was told that it was because they were "short staffed". I gave up. I can't understand how a pub can hope to stay in business insisting on online only booking in an area with no/poor mobile signal and I guess it explains why almost all of the outside tables were empty at 1pm on a Saturday lunch time.

 

[AM9]

Agreed. In hospitality you don't notice the difference and you dont need to give real details for track and trace.

It's that kind of attitude that will delay the progress to less restrictions.

 

[Scrotnig]

But you think that there is a more than negligible chance that you will be in the proximity of somebody who could infect you.

No I don't, but that doesn't mean I won't get told to isolate "out of an abundance of caution".

To be honest I could put up with most of the other stuff, it's the requirement to hand over my details so I can be arbitarily placed under house arrest that puts me off. I doubt I'll go near a pub until that requirement goes. A few quid off a meal won't make any difference.

 

[Bletchleyite]

you dont need to give real details for track and trace.

Track and trace is the most important thing we have to allow removal of restrictions. Please don't give false details. If you don't want to give details and the establishment you are using is collecting them, choose one that isn't, or if you're unhappy with the method (e.g. just a sign-up sheet where details are visible) tell them so and walk out. Personally I'd rather they were, and I suspect if people don't play along we will see legislation on the matter as Scotland have.