"Your ticket has expired, sir"

[wintonian]

We have heard of many instances wher ebarrier staff, on SWT and elsewhere have displaced a lamentable lack of basic knowledge of the ticket and routeing system.

Either the TOC's are deliberately employing people who lack the intelligence to undertand even the most rudimentary points, or the training for such roles is hopelessly inadequate at many of the TOC's.

I must admit I think the lkatte ris more likely than the former. Given the cost and difficulty in dismising unsuitable staff once they have begun employment, it is a bit foolish to employ people without chekcing they have the skills and wit for the role in the first place.

It's easier to inform (staff and passengers) that off-peak tickets are only valid on trains arriving into London after 10:00 than it is to then explain the system of restrictions and the network area easement, also it means that more passengers end up buying anytime tickets when an off peak would have been valid making the TOC money.

 

[All Line Rover]

Virgin again! I doubt it prevents anyone from a making a mistake though.

I know it's Virgin again, but I believe they are setting a good example!

I remember a multiple choice question on one application being...

For how many day/s is an Anytime Single ticket valid?

• 1 day
• 5 days
• 30 days

Now, yes, I know it's not the specific ticket type this thread is discussing. But if SWT used questions like this, the guy mentioned at the outset would probably have been filtered out. Of course it doesn't prevent people from making mistakes, but it helps a bit...

 

[AlterEgo]

If your job is to let people with valid tickets through a barrier, and you don't do this, you have failed at the most miserable level to do it properly. What other job is there that when you are not able to do it you are kept on?

I think it is a little unfair to suggest that all the staff member does it "let people through a barrier". There is more to revenue duties than meets the eye.

 

[4SRKT]

I think it is a little unfair to suggest that all the staff member does it "let people through a barrier". There is more to revenue duties than meets the eye.

You missed a bit out.........

 

[Greenback]

This would possibly explain it if it wasn't for the fact that the 2 digit year also appears on the ticket, so I remain at a loss in relation to how they thought a ticket with a valid until date of 10-NOV-11 has 'expired'?

It's difficult to explain that, I admit. Unless, in some bizarre way, the person concerned thought it could be used on any day until then, but once it had been used it was only valid on that day? They may have said 'journey' but meant day?

I agree, but I would have thought that the validity of a straightforward return ticket is something covered off pretty early in any training course, and if this is the case then the guy is simply not capable of being trained or taking information. I appreciate that it may seem harsh but the railway is a service and members of the public, not all of whom are as familiar with ticketing as some posters on here, should never have to run the risk of being inconvenienced, embarrassed, or even mildly irritated, by incompentence.

It's certainly a possibility that the staff member is incapable of learning about tickets. they may have got through the recruitment without tht becoming obvious. I can't rule it out. But it would become apparent through their day to day work - SWT would have to decide whether to go down the dismissal route or maybe redeployment to a different role, if there is one available.

You also assume that ther eis a training course - my point was that such a course may not exist!

That is why I agreed with making SWT aware of the incident. If there ar emany such incidents then clearly the person is unsuitable. On the other hand, it may just be a one off occurence, perhaps caused or exacerbated by something otuside work.

 

[island]

For how many day/s is an Anytime Single ticket valid?

• 1 day
• 5 days
• 30 days

I hope they've amended the choices

 

[wintonian]

I hope they've amended the choices

Unless there is a printing error in the question leaving out some very important information.

 

[All Line Rover]

I hope they've amended the choices

They've always - as far as I'm aware - been valid for 1 day only. The question is not as easy as it looks - it must have caught many people out!

 

[AlterEgo]

They've always - as far as I'm aware - been valid for 1 day only. The question is not as easy as it looks - it must have caught many people out!

*Cough*

Anytime Singles are now valid for two days.

 

[sonic2009]

There's No Need to Ask the Employee of SWT to be sacked, a simple re train should be simple enough.

Personally i think G4S staff are worse than this guy LOL

 

[Greenback]

Well, I would have failed the Great Virgin Recruitment Test!

 

[sonic2009]

I wonder if their should be an Industry Wide NVQ in Fares etc

this would do wonders

i.e Joe Bloggs works for SWT does his NVQ in Fares ETC. Moves to TPE. Has this on His CV. Refresh with New Employer etc.

 

[AlterEgo]

I wonder if their should be an Industry Wide NVQ in Fares etc

this would do wonders

i.e Joe Bloggs works for SWT does his NVQ in Fares ETC. Moves to TPE. Has this on His CV. Refresh with New Employer etc.

The fares system is now so complex surely a degree would be necessary!

 

[All Line Rover]

*Cough*

Anytime Singles are now valid for two days.

Well National Rail Enquiries, "the definitive source of information for all passenger rail services on the National Rail network in England, Wales and Scotland," tells me that "Anytime Singles tickets are valid for travel on any train on the date shown on your ticket." (Implying one day only.)

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/about/ and http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/times_fares/anytime_conditions.html.

So I would have passed at the time of writing, and would still (arguably) have passed today! Where, as a matter of fact, is the two day rule mentioned? I'm struggling to find it in the NRCoC.

 

[wintonian]

*Cough*

Anytime Singles are now valid for two days.

Yes but this was a SWT test then that almost certainly would be the wrong answer for the test, whether or not an answer would normally be right is irrelevant unless it also the same answer the examiner or those conducting the test are looking for!

 

[Track Basher]

Well National Rail Enquiries, "the definitive source of information for all passenger rail services on the National Rail network in England, Wales and Scotland," tells me that "Anytime Day tickets are valid for travel on any train on the date shown on your ticket and until 0230 on the following day."

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/about/ and http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/times_fares/anytime_day_conditions.html.

So I would have passed at the time of writing, and would still (arguably) have passed today! Where, as a matter of fact, is the two day rule mentioned? I'm struggling to find it in the NRCoC.

Anytime Day Single is 0230 anytime single is midday for last break but allowed to complete journey

 

[All Line Rover]

Anytime Day Single is 0230 anytime single is midday for last break but allowed to complete journey

You are quite right - the link was incorrect - but the "Anytime Day" link still implies that Anytime Singles are valid for one day only.

Again, I ask, where can I find this information about a two day validity?

 

[Greenback]

You are quite right - the link was incorrect - but the "Anytime Day" link still implies that Anytime Singles are valid for one day only.

That's the trouble with the Virgin question - it's just wrong! It's a wonder they manage to employ any staff at all!

 

[AlterEgo]

Was that question from a real recruitment questionnaire?

 

[All Line Rover]

Was that question from a real recruitment questionnaire?

Yes, from a few months ago. Surely it was correct at the time?

If Anytime Singles are this confusing, I suggest that Virgin change the question to Anytime Returns for the benefit of future applicants!

 

[AlterEgo]

At the time yes it was.

From 5th October it would have been wrong.

 

[All Line Rover]

At the time yes it was.

From 5th October it would have been wrong.

Where is this two day validity thing mentioned in the NRCoC?? I can't find it!!! hock:

 

[wintonian]

Where is this two day validity thing mentioned in the NRCoC?? I can't find it!!! hock:

I belive it is mentiond in the manual, not that it helps Much unless you work on the railway.

Sent from my HTC Desire S

 

[All Line Rover]

I belive it is mentiond in the manual, not that it helps Much unless you work on the railway.

Sent from my HTC Desire S

Well if it's only mentioned in "The Manual," they definitely can't ask the question any more!

 

[AlterEgo]

Specific Ticket conditions aren't in the NRCoC, they're in The Manual. And supposedly on National Rail Enquiries - which is definitive!

 

[snail]

It's difficult to explain that, I admit. Unless, in some bizarre way, the person concerned thought it could be used on any day until then, but once it had been used it was only valid on that day? They may have said 'journey' but meant day?

From the outline in the OP my guess is that the gateline person has interpreted the reason for rejection at the barriers as it being a previously used or cancelled ticket. Is there a rejection code presented in these circumstances that could be interpreted that way?

 

[WelshBluebird]

To those saying we should not judge the staff member based on one mistake, I will just suggest one thing. Many people would not have the knowledge or confidence to argue with a member of staff like that. Many people would have just paid up. A staff member claiming an obviously in date ticket has expired is simply unacceptable and at the very least the person involved should be given a firm talking to.

 

[sheff1]

Well, thanks for all your replies ... far more than I expected !

I would like to make it clear that the person was not rude, he remained polite at all times, but seemed unable to understand/accept that the ticket was valid for one return journey within one month.

Someone said he may have interpreted the rejection by the barrier as meaning the ticket had already been used. Possibly he did, but I assume there are numerous other reasons why a ticket might be rejected ?

What I will do is email customer services as suggested. I don't know the person's name but I suspect there can't have been many of Chinese/Oriental appearance working at Southampton today.

 

[Greenback]

To those saying we should not judge the staff member based on one mistake, I will just suggest one thing. Many people would not have the knowledge or confidence to argue with a member of staff like that. Many people would have just paid up. A staff member claiming an obviously in date ticket has expired is simply unacceptable and at the very least the person involved should be given a firm talking to.

I don't agree. The mistake made was so ridiculous that I reckon the vast majority of people would have done exactly what the OP did.

There is no mention of any money being demanded, and the person did go and check with the ticket office and let the OP through in the end.

It's incredible that this happened, but all this talk of disciplining someone and even dismissing them base don what we know of just one incident is way over the top.

Trial by forum at it's very worst I'm afraid.

 

[SouthStand]

I don't agree. The mistake made was so ridiculous that I reckon the vast majority of people would have done exactly what the OP did.

There is no mention of any money being demanded, and the person did go and check with the ticket office and let the OP through in the end.

It's incredible that this happened, but all this talk of disciplining someone and even dismissing them base don what we know of just one incident is way over the top.

Trial by forum at it's very worst I'm afraid.

Thing is, this wasn't an error due to the complex ticketing conditions that unfortunately exist in this country, it was a basic lack of understanding!