London Midland train cancelled ,Virgin charged £65

[island]

And as you are well aware, such a 'policy' is not in compliance with the NRCOC.

Which section would it be that contradicts it, please?

 

[455driver]

so I went to Virgin Customer service desk ,and they said they accept LM ticket ,to Stafford,....

Seems quite clear to me.

and at Northern ticket office they told me to take a "any logical route"

What has this got to do with Northern?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Sounds like entrapment or coersion to me.

Oh puhlease, he was told to catch the VWC train to Stafford, he chose to stay on to Euston, how the hell is that entrapment?

You really love all this conspiracy stuff dont you!

 

[snail]

What has this got to do with Northern?

Northern operate the ticket office at Liverpool Lime Street.

 

[455driver]

He went to the Virmin CS desk, got their answer (to catch the Virmin train to Stafford) and then went to a Northern ticket office, I dont understand why (after getting the info from Virmin) he would then go to a Northern ticket office and ask them what to do, they would not be able to offer more than the Virmin CS desk already has, it just doesnt make sense.

That is what I am getting at.

 

[snail]

I dont understand why (after getting the info from Virmin) he would then go to a Northern ticket office and ask them what to do

Because he wanted a different answer?

I think you need a spell checker, you've got the TOC's name wrong.

 

[34D]

Which section would it be that contradicts it, please?

Well NRCOC clause 3, covering where the full range is unavailable
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

You really love all this conspiracy stuff dont you!

Absolutely! Watching NCIS as we speak!

 

[Ferret]

Well NRCOC clause 3, covering where the full range is unavailable!

Does that apply to this case?

 

[snail]

Well NRCOC clause 3, covering where the full range is unavailable

The OP had travelled from Euston to Liverpool. Are you really claiming that Euston or Liverpool Lime Street doesn't sell a full range of tickets?

 

[island]

Well NRCOC clause 3, covering where the full range is unavailable

But the full range of tickets was available at the station where he boarded. Try again.

 

[455driver]

I think you need a spell checker, you've got the TOC's name wrong.

Nope, spill chucker works fine tar!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

The OP had travelled from Euston to Liverpool.

I thought he was going from Liverpool to Newbury?

 

[34D]

The OP had travelled from Euston to Liverpool. Are you really claiming that Euston or Liverpool Lime Street doesn't sell a full range of tickets?

But the full range of tickets was available at the station where he boarded. Try again.

Re-read my post. I was commenting on the general comment that "virgin have an anytime only onboard policy". I was NOT suggesting it was relevant to the apecifics on this thread

 

[snail]

Re-read my post. I was commenting on the general comment that "virgin have an anytime only onboard policy". I was NOT suggesting it was relevant to the apecifics on this thread

But Virgin don't operate from any stations where a full range of tickets is not available. All their stations have booking offices or TVMs.

 

[Ferret]

Re-read my post. I was commenting on the general comment that "virgin have an anytime only onboard policy". I was NOT suggesting it was relevant to the apecifics on this thread

Similar to DaveNewcastle's thoughts - why put a general comment like that in a thread asking for advice?

 

[Tibbs]

Similar to DaveNewcastle's thoughts - why put a general comment like that in a thread asking for advice?

Are you new to this forum?

Show me a thread on the Disputes & Prosecutions forum that doesn't go off topic and sticks to relevant information for the OP.

If more than 1 in 20 stay even slightly on topic and specific to the OP's post I'd be amazed.

Feel free to go through the threads and count.

 

[Ferret]

LMAO at Tibbs - very true indeed! I suppose we've all been guilty of it as well. What I'm saying is that maybe we ought to stop doing it when there's an 'advice-based' thread.

 

[Clip]

Let's stick to the facts here,please.

Op had a toc specific ticket. Got on another tocs train, when told to-hard to verify-, had to pay top whack.

Advice on the situation please.

I'd say on a hiding to nothing because I often here similar stories BUT given there was disruption its highly plausible as that's what people tell them.

 

[ian959]

I think the OP has his advice - based upon what he asked the TM he was OK to travel to Stafford on VT but by remaining on the train beyond Stafford he was off route and therefore was correctly whacked for the Any Time single as he missed not one but two opportunities to buy an off peak fare: at his origin Liverpool and arguably at Stafford where he should have got off the train as advised by VT.

Basically the consensus seems to be there is not much the OP can do about the situation, which is what the original question was. The OP may however choose to approach LM for compensation for the cancellation of the original train.

I rather think this thread needs to be closed unless the OP has anything further to add to the situation.

 

[ramitamimi]

Thanks everyone for your advices,I wrote a letter to Virgin ,enclosing scans of tickets etc ,will see what they reply,and post it here ,also once I come back to UK I will ask LM for refund ,although,I doubt it worth it,as the ticket just costed me £6,5.

Just another question,can I apply for a refund of XC ticket,as I was late for the train ,due to LM train lateness?!

 

[island]

You could have been prosecuted for being on a train without a ticket. If I were you, I would let sleeping dogs lie.

 

[Flamingo]

You could have been prosecuted for being on a train without a ticket. If I were you, I would let sleeping dogs lie.

To be fair to the OP, I know of numerous cases where people were in breach of NRCoC / bylaws, and after complaining to the TOC that the nasty rude man charged them, the end result was that they got a refund and the member of staff got told to be more "flexible". :roll:

Complaints are usually dealt with in a "fluffy" manner.

 

[IanD]

You could have been prosecuted for being on a train without a ticket. If I were you, I would let sleeping dogs lie.

He wasnt. So there's no harm in asking for his money back. It will only cost time and a stamp and as it's Virgin experience suggests that he'll probably get at least £50 in vouchers because they can't be bothered to investigate/answer properly.

 

[bb21]

He wasnt. So there's no harm in asking for his money back. It will only cost time and a stamp and as it's Virgin experience suggests that he'll probably get at least £50 in vouchers because they can't be bothered to investigate/answer properly.

AFAIK they have stopped this practice.

 

[Spaceflower]

Call me ignorant, but what exactly are the rules when it comes to buying on the train? Obviously at unstaffed stations one must and therefore I assume the conductor must offer the full range of tickets/discounts available. But are there different rules for boarding at staffed stations (which there appear to be) and do these rules change geographically and between TOC?

I can recall changing trains at York having changed my journey plan. Instead of continuing to Newcastle, I changed to a TPE Scarborough train. It was ready to depart as I alighted the previous service so I jumped straight on with the intention of buying on the train. I managed to do that and was even offered my RC discount BUT the conductor definitely hesitated before issuing, asking for an explanation and it got me thinking.......

 

[island]

The rule should, in theory, be the same nationwide, that is to say if there was no opportunity to purchase a ticket before boarding, you are entitled to be sold the full range of tickets on board the train. If you fail to use available ticketing facilities, you are only entitled to purchase the most expensive tickets (Anytime fares) and cannot obtain a discount. You may also be liable to a Penalty Fare if applicable.

It seems to be accepted that you are not obliged to miss a short connection if you do not have time to purchase a ticket at the connecting station.

Custom and practice across TOCs will of course vary widely. Northern, which serves more unstaffed shacks than any other TOC, has tended to be more lax in enforcing this (but has ratcheted it up lately). FCC, on the other hand, has been known to go straight to threatening prosecution.

Passenger behaviour will also play a part. A customer who proactively seeks out the guard on the platform, or on board immediately after boarding, is likely to get more sympathetic treatment than one who says nothing until the guard gets there or until they get to a barrier at their destination.

 

[jb]

Passenger behaviour will also play a part. A customer who proactively seeks out the guard on the platform, or on board immediately after boarding, is likely to get more sympathetic treatment than one who says nothing until the guard gets there or until they get to a barrier at their destination.

... although this may be confused with the notion that it's required to seek out the guard and that any failure to do so is meaningful in terms of the rules.

 

[island]

Correct. But one can be right and still be inconvenienced, or to use the American saying, you can beat the rap but you can't beat the ride.

 

[Goatboy]

The rules about buying on trains are very ambiguous and it's not suprising people are often caught out in non PF zones. Penalty Fares seem pretty straightforward but outside of PF areas, before I frequented this forum despite being interested in rail travel for as long as I could remember I genuinelly beleived that if you wished to, you could buy on board even if there was a ticket office provided you were happy to pay the Anytime Single or Anytime Return price without discounts.

 

[MCW]

Hiding to Nowhere, reading through this baffling stuff beginning to end, I cannot see for the Life of me how the OP will get a refund, if they do then it's obviously a TOC decision.

As far as I am concerned, the rules were clear in this case, Virgin accepted the ticket as far as stafford, after that enquiries would have to be made in accordance to what other posters have said.

Also, OP, can you please try and proof read your posts first before submitting them, they are quite difficult for me to read and thus, try and provide help, if any is needed.

 

[ramitamimi]

So ,today I received a letter from London Midland ,with vouchers for the value of £22.15 ,which is what I ve paid for both tickets (Liverpool-Birmingam (LM) ,and Birmingam-Reading (XC) ,which was quiet nice ,as I did not expect LM to compensate for my XC ticket!!!

Still no reply from Virgin though....

 

[bb21]

They probably took pity that you had to pay out for another ticket, but nice of them nonetheless.

You never know, you might get the money refunded from Virgin too if you are lucky and have the trip for free.