ECML Disruption - Saturday 27th December

[21C101]

Umm no this is in no way actually possible because you've forgotten one very important factor which is route knowledge, GN drivers I doubt sign the route between Finsbury Park and Liverpool Street any more. They be fine to Canonbury Curve but would need a pilotman to pilot them into Liverpool Street then of course you have restrictions with the rolling stock as 365s in particular have certain restrictions. Then not forgetting any issues with engineering works that may have been ongoing on the proposed diversionary route.

The difference with First Hull Trains is 1. Their traincrew have the route knowledge required to use St Pancras International and 2. The 180s are cleared into St Pancras International.

But is it not the case that Hull Trains drivers have the route knowledge because Hull trains took the trouble to ensure that their traincrew had the route knowledge.?

As I said a few posts back:

"The logical thing to do would be to run one GN morning peak and one evening peak service MF from Peterborough to Liverpool Street, rostering the drivers to all do this turn periodically. The train would also I suspect be quite well used as it would give a direct service to the city."

--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

There's two things here:
a) preventing the overrun in the first place, and,
b) mitigating the effects of an overrun if it happens.

The Holloway work - and every other job on the network - went through a detailed schedule risk assessment (several times in fact) that considered every potential failure, potential resource absence, potential cause of slippage etc. Every big job like this at Christmas has to demonstrate at least a 95% chance of being handed back 4 hours before the first train service is due to operate. This is as per a process agreed with the ORR. Of course that means, in theory, 1 in 20 jobs don't make it. Actually it is a much lower rate than that, nearer 1:100. But when you are doing nearly 1000 jobs over Christmas - as this year - at that strike rate, some of them will overrun.


For mitigation, I can tell you that there was a contingency plan for an overrun on this job, as there was for every single piece of major work over the Christmas period. As an example, the work at London Bridge has about 10 different service contingency plans depending which stage might go wrong, when, and how badly wrong. Happily the first two of those haven't been needed and have gone in the bin unused. (And I have everything crossed that we won't need another 2 tomorrow morning). However, having a service contingency plan is one thing, resourcing it is quite another. It is, in theory, possible to provide fully resourced contingency plans with different rosters and stock diagrams. However it takes weeks of effort of the planners to produce each one for a big job like Kings Cross, and frankly there is not the resource available to do it on the basis that there is a 1% chance that it might be invoked. Besides, how would you tell drivers / conductors / station staff whether to come in for Plan A or Plan B (or C or D), given that the start times might be quite different? If that means they are required to be on call just in case, there becomes an issue with working hours, and again, it is a lot of potential extra cost for a 1% chance of being used.

My purely personal view is that I simply don't understand why there were 4 car units running around, nor why some services were cancelled when they weren't affected by the work. I suspect there were other factors at play unconnected to the overrun which got 'lost' within the big picture.

That is the best explanation of what happened I have seen anywhere - maybe you should move to the PR department

The question of whether extra train crew should have been on call is down to risk. I guess and whether that risk was correctly judged at 1% or whatever (and whether the combined risk of one of the half dozen worksites overrunning was correctly judged) is the million dollar question.

However I think the cost/logistics of having extra station staff on call so that lots of staff could have been deployed to places like Finsbury Park, if needed, would not have been excessive.

Looking at the track plan it seems that it is not possible to use the down and up fasts if you want to use the Canonbury spur as a turnback so when things got too overcrowded they must have used the up slow to terminate the intercities on when things got to crowded to have arrival and departure on the same platform. That would have obstructed up Moorgates. (if they had been cute they would have used platforms 5&6 on the downside, enabling cross platform transfer from the Moorgate line.

An extra island platform "0" and "-1" serving the down slow and down goods, and enabling Moorgate services to use the down Goods with intercities terminating on the down slow with cross platform connection to the Moorgates, would have made life a lot easier. Of course that island platform already exists but is closed. Doh!. It would be a good idea to put that platform back into service asap as they did with Platform 3 at Kentish Town a few years back. If this was done and at least six an hour run to Moorgate (via Highbury & Islington for cross platform connection to the Vic line) then I think the problem of what to do on the ECML when Fins Pk to KX is shut would largely go away.

Edit: it appears that they have already reopened platforms "0" and "-1" so I really cannot fathom why the operational practice outlined above was not put into effect straight away yesterday????

 

[Unixman]

For mitigation, I can tell you that there was a contingency plan for an overrun on this job, as there was for every single piece of major work over the Christmas period. As an example, the work at London Bridge has about 10 different service contingency plans depending which stage might go wrong, when, and how badly wrong. Happily the first two of those haven't been needed and have gone in the bin unused. (And I have everything crossed that we won't need another 2 tomorrow morning). However, having a service contingency plan is one thing, resourcing it is quite another. It is, in theory, possible to provide fully resourced contingency plans with different rosters and stock diagrams. However it takes weeks of effort of the planners to produce each one for a big job like Kings Cross, and frankly there is not the resource available to do it on the basis that there is a 1% chance that it might be invoked.

So what on earth is the point of having a contingency plan if you are unable to implement it?

The whole point of that contingency plan is that is it to be used if things go wrong. You must resource it otherwise it is pointless.

 

[Bald Rick]

So what on earth is the point of having a contingency plan if you are unable to implement it?

The whole point of that contingency plan is that is it to be used if things go wrong. You must resource it otherwise it is pointless.

Oh it's able to be implemented. It's just that the resources are, more often than not, juggled on the day to make it work. And, more often than not, it does work. It is very noticeable that contingencies implemented at weekends or on bank / public holidays don't go as well as those implemented in the week. In my view this is down to lower resource levels available on these days, and people less willing to come in to work at short notice.

 

[LAX54]

You wouldn't pay them to sit around doing nothing, you would pay them to be on call and available for duty within two hours of receiving a call, them pay them their hourly overtime rate plus bonus if they are called out (oh and make the on call contractual not voluntary)

How do you think S&T manage to find large numbers of staff when a big failure occurs in the middle of the night?

They do !! ??

 

[LAX54]

Oh it's able to be implemented. It's just that the resources are, more often than not, juggled on the day to make it work. And, more often than not, it does work. It is very noticeable that contingencies implemented at weekends or on bank / public holidays don't go as well as those implemented in the week. In my view this is down to lower resource levels available on these days, and people less willing to come in to work at short notice.

And at this time of year, they may not be able to come in after having a drink or two, which is not unreasonable! so we are back to on call, and as we know 'wages grade' staff do not do 'on call' the closest is 'AO', but then that would mean paying them the full going rate for the day, worked or not, but the Companies involved would not wish to pay all this out on a just in case basis !
When you look at the amount of Engineering work that takes place, it is just a very small minority that goes so wrong, events, then hours of duty conspired against them

 

[Stampy]

Main thing was, they were turfing passengers OFF trains at Platform 1 at WGC, and telling them to join the throng of passengers on Platform 2.

Problem being, the trains that WERE calling at P2 were full of passengers anyway - and people were being ordered into trains.

This would clear approximately 15-20 passengers, who would then be joined by another FULL 8-12 car set which would pull in to P1 - whilst the EMPTY set went and parked up further on down the line!!!

As I posted before, some woman with a Orange jacket was telling people to go from P2 to P4 to catch the Moorgate train - and once everybody had moved platforms and got onto the said train....... They'd take the bloody thing out of service, tell us all to get off and got back to P2, just as another train would come into P1 and empty MORE passengers..

This was repeated 3 times, until finally they decided to put a 6-car 313 set on from P4 and people were packed like sardines in there for 40 minutes until the driver (a hero again!!) finally got the signal to leave. Kudos to him for regular 5-minute updates, he was the only one who seemed to generally care about his passengers!!

 

[Tomnick]

But is it not the case that Hull Trains drivers have the route knowledge because Hull trains took the trouble to ensure that their traincrew had the route knowledge.?

As I said a few posts back:


Looking at the track plan it seems that it is not possible to use the down and up fasts if you want to use the Canonbury spur as a turnback so when things got too overcrowded they must have used the up slow to terminate the intercities on when things got to crowded to have arrival and departure on the same platform. That would have obstructed up Moorgates. (if they had been cute they would have used platforms 5&6 on the downside, enabling cross platform transfer from the Moorgate line.

East Coast's trains, as I understand it, were planned to terminate in the Up Fast platform and start back from there (the only platform which can turn back a train from the north), but it was later decided instead to shunt them, via the crossover north of the station) to the Down Fast to start in service there, to segregate the passenger flows. The GN outer suburbans were (all?) terminating in the other Up platforms - there's no direct access to anything on the Down side from the north - then shunting via Canonbury, which possibly caused some issues with route knowledge too (I seem to remember from a previous discussion that relatively few drivers sign it). I can certainly appreciate the difficulties in coming up with a workable contingency plan under those constraints.

As well as questioning whether the additional resources to guarantee being able to deliver one of many potential contingency plans could be justified, I'd also ask whether the train planning functions would have enough resources to prepare all these plans in the first place - and is that effort justified? Yes, the complete closure of Kings Cross is possibly a likely scenario generally, but was it a particularly high risk in this situation with a substantially reduced service planned to operate anyway? What about the other potentially disastrous scenarios - overrun at Welwyn, overrun at KX but able to hand just one line back, something else preventing access from Hornsey depot - how much would it cost to cover all potential scenarios with a detailed plan? Even if there was a plan ready to pull off the shelf - would it have been sufficient to cope with the passenger demand on the day?

 

[jon0844]

Plenty of staff at FPK today and very few passengers. Most staff wearing very warm First branded clothing as they must be freezing and didn't fancy waiting until April!!

Signalling problems at KGX now though but not having a major impact just yet. Some trains about 30 down but hardly anyone on them at all.

 

[ExRes]

When on call you are "sitting around" or asleep at home and you do not get paid wages for this. You get paid an on call allowance (say £25 a week) plus the monthly line rental of your telephone. If called in, then you get paid your hourly overtime rate for the hours you work. Agreeing to be "on call" is part of your terms and conditions of employment and you have no choice. Typically you will be on call one week in two, three or four and while on call you have to be at or reasonably near home, contactable and abstain from all alcohol.

Its standard practice throughout the engineering side of the railway, including both technicians and management (except the management are often expected to do it without extra renumeration). Its also standard practice in many other industries such as the NHS - almost certainly many of the engineering staff who spent yesterday trying to put the track out of Kings Cross back together would have been on call and called out and had no choice other than to give up their Christmas break and attend.

On call dosen't appear to be standard practice for train crews and station staff, nor for the bus drivers that they hire when it all goes wrong.

Of course it's not standard practice for train crews or platform staff and it stands very little chance of ever being so, also how do you intend to run a safety critical service and give staff their legally required breaks if you have them sitting around at home on call because no way, if on call was ever agreed, would it be outside the 12 hour agreement

 

[jon0844]

Okay, now it's getting a bit messy.

And as the screens mess up and people need info (and dispatcher is doing a fantastic job btw) we get automated announcements about Oyster!

 

[ExRes]

Okay, now it's getting a bit messy.

What ?, Finsbury Park platforms ?, not surprising with all those passengers .....

 

[jon0844]

Trains out of sequence on platform screens meant staff are working damn hard to stop people boarding the wrong train.

The delayed 1358 Cambridge was showing as the 1411 Cambridge and then a WGC stopper showing as the, now delayed, 1411. Even before I left when they did fix it manually, it showed the WGC as leaving before the train ON the platform.

Staff getting quite frustrated, which is rather understandable. Ironically, the passengers were all - for now - in good spirits and not moaning.

I'm now on the 1411, or at least I think I am. Never knew GTR had HSTs....

 

[21C101]

Of course it's not standard practice for train crews or platform staff and it stands very little chance of ever being so, also how do you intend to run a safety critical service and give staff their legally required breaks if you have them sitting around at home on call because no way, if on call was ever agreed, would it be outside the 12 hour agreement

Exactly the same way as you do it with safety critical S&T staff who are subject to the same 'Hidden' rules.

 

[causton]

Trains out of sequence on platform screens meant staff are working damn hard to stop people boarding the wrong train.

The delayed 1358 Cambridge was showing as the 1411 Cambridge and then a WGC stopper showing as the, now delayed, 1411. Even before I left when they did fix it manually, it showed the WGC as leaving before the train ON the platform.

Staff getting quite frustrated, which is rather understandable. Ironically, the passengers were all - for now - in good spirits and not moaning.

I'm now on the 1411, or at least I think I am. Never knew GTR had HSTs....

Glad I didn't go back to Finsbury Park or I would be there waiting with you! I was walking the dog and went to Harringay, and then caught the 1349. Going into FPK is a queue of mostly-empty trains. Think everyone was scared off from travelling!

 

[jon0844]

Wonder what it will be like when football fans arrive at FPK after the Spurs game?

They should be arriving about now. Not as bad as Arsenal playing at home obviously but still likely to be people a little less forgiving. And I doubt they decided to stay home!

 

[Class 170101]

Its incorrect though. Apart from being entirely the wrong side of the Street, c2c don't require movement of GA (bar the standby sometimes) to run 4tph, its 6tph that needs some platform work, mainly for performance reasons to make it more resilient.

Erm how about moving trains across platforms.

So train in 17 moves to 18, 16 to 17 etc until the space appears in the centre / west side of Liverpool Street?

As for four tph it still requires the same platform work as for 6tph.

 

[tsr]

Erm how about moving trains across platforms.

So train in 17 moves to 18, 16 to 17 etc until the space appears in the centre / west side of Liverpool Street?

As for four tph it still requires the same platform work as for 6tph.

Such things often depend on platform lengths, suitability of passenger flows for the space available, platform/train facilities (eg. any restrictions for emptying waste tanks and dealing with catering supplies) and obviously whether or not the junctions/track circuits/signal overlaps are in the right place to allow the modifications without restricting capacity. I don't know if this applies, or to what extent, at Liverpool Street - I am not intimately familiar with all the operational aspects of the station because I use it less frequently than quite a few other London termini, and don't work there - but it would at many other stations.

 

[LAX54]

Erm how about moving trains across platforms.

So train in 17 moves to 18, 16 to 17 etc until the space appears in the centre / west side of Liverpool Street?

As for four tph it still requires the same platform work as for 6tph.

Liverpool Street: Shunt 17 to 18 and 16 to 17 ? that would stop the job for a while, and unless double manned could only be a 4 car at most, no one would ever climb out of a train in the throat of Liverpool St !

 

[causton]

Not quite the same numbers involved, are there?

Indeed, there were two trains. They were also route conducted as far as I could see, as there were two people changing ends when I did it yesterday and neither of them were the guard!

 

[Aictos]

But is it not the case that Hull Trains drivers have the route knowledge because Hull trains took the trouble to ensure that their traincrew had the route knowledge.?

As I said a few posts back

Like I've also said First Hull Trains train crew have the route knowledge because they regularly use St Pancras International as a alternative London terminus when there's any form of engineering works much like Chiltern Trains can use Paddington instead of Marylebone, Your proposals will cost money and who will finance it? Remember GTR is run along the same lines as London Overground and is not a franchise so any improvements or suggestions like you are suggesting is at the beck and call of the DfT.

As Euston was pretty much shut, why not terminate East Coast at Euston instead using Wembley to reverse and only have GTR terminating Outers at Finsbury Park with Inners terminating at Moorgate with First Hull Trains running 10 cars out of St Pancras Int?

 

[WestRiding]

This wont happen with introduction of ROC's. Or so Network Rail Management think. Time for heads to roll in Ivory Towers? They would be in any other company.

 

[EM2]

As Euston was pretty much shut, why not terminate East Coast at Euston instead using Wembley to reverse and only have GTR terminating Outers at Finsbury Park with Inners terminating at Moorgate with First Hull Trains running 10 cars out of St Pancras Int?

Erm, isn't there a massive possession between Willesden and Wembley?

 

[30907]

Erm, isn't there a massive possession between Willesden and Wembley?

And was the curve from ECML to NLL accessible anyway?

 

[45107]

Exactly the same way as you do it with safety critical S&T staff who are subject to the same 'Hidden' rules.

And how is that done ?

Traincrew have rostered start/finish times in order to work trains & are subject to 12 hours rest. Having them on-call for any eventuality will lead to them sitting around doing nothing for most of the time (or gaps in the following days services when they are used and cannot get sufficient rest).

P-Way/S&T on-call are generally (but not always) office based staff who can adjust their workload after being called out - they do not have time sensitive duties (ie working a train at a specific time) to deal with

 

[ryan125hst]

From what I can see online, the organisation of yesterday was a complete shambles. Aside from the issues of communication on Boxing Day and the severe queues outside Finsbury Park station, it seems Great Northern did little to help the situation. I don’t know if they were physically unable to do much as a result of the engineering works, staffing problems, train issues etc, but from Realtime Trains, it appears they just cancelled most of their trains. Even the services to/from Moorgate were mostly cancelled, and very few services ran between Finsbury Park and Peterborough. What’s even more strange is that it appears there was little attempt to allow services to run at the opposite end of the route- looking at the Cambridge and Peterborough ends, most services were cancelled and there were large gaps between services that did run. I know capacity would have been an issue, but could they not at least have run an hourly stopper to Cambridge and an hourly stopper to Peterborough? Was there a major issue that prevented them from running anything?

As far as a contingency plan goes, I think for the future, they should use one of two options for departures:

Option 1

East Coast
• Hourly service from Finsbury Park to Edinburgh calling at York, Darlington, Newcastle, Berwick and Edinburgh
• Hourly service from Finsbury to Edinburgh calling at Peterborough, Doncaster, York, Darlington, Durham, Newcastle, Alnmouth and Edinburgh.
• Hourly service from Peterborough to Leeds calling at Grantham, Newark, Retford, Doncaster, Wakefield and Leeds

Have passengers who are intending on travelling to York and beyond queuing up at Moorgate (with one queue for the main destinations served by the fast train and another for the smaller stations served by the stopper) and then travelling into Finsbury Park on a frequent six car 313. Local passengers would also be able to be accommodated on this and would be in a separate queuing. Staff would allow passengers to board the services that would be timed to connect with the East Coast trains. Passengers can reach Moorgate from Kings Cross via the Circle, Metropolitan or Hammersmith and City lines.

Have passengers who are travelling to Stevenage, Peterborough Grantham, Newark, Retford, Doncaster, Wakefield and Leeds queuing up at Finsbury Park. Great Northern can then run an hourly service to Peterborough calling at Stevenage with a 12 car Class 365, connecting into the hourly service to Leeds. Passengers can reach Finsbury Park from Kings Cross by using the Victoria or Piccadilly Lines.

Local passengers would have a separate queue and would be directed onto the following services:

Great Northern
• Hourly fast to Peterborough as above (if there’s any space left after EC passengers)
• Two trains per hour to Peterborough (as timetabled usually)
• Two slow trains per hour to Cambridge (as timetabled usually)
• Six trains per hour (formed of 6 car 313’s) between Moorgate and Finsbury Park, with services continuing to Welwyn Garden City or to Hertford North as required.

Option 2

• Replace the East Coast services above with 12 Car Class 365’s running non-stop to Peterborough, where the East Coast trains will start from (the Finsbury Park to Peterborough service would be timed to connect into the Edinburgh services.
• Extend the Leeds service to start from Stevenage, allowing one of the three Class 365’s to terminate there (although it could continue to Peterborough if passenger numbers required.
• Other Great Northern services and queuing arrangements would be the same as Option 1.

A Hybrid option might have worked well yesterday: Option 1 at 11:00 when the crowds were busy as it would have enabled passengers to be taken out of London quickly and would have prevented the build-up of passengers due to trains being stuck outside Finsbury Park due to taking a long time to unload and shunt. Option 2 from about 1 or 2 in the afternoon when passenger numbers would have probably died down slightly.

Arrivals
Passengers could be directed onto a Moorgate service to Highbury and Islington to catch a Victoria Line train. If Highbury and Islington was to get too busy, passengers could be told to stay on to Moorgate and catch a Circle Line train to Kings Cross, or could be directed to the tube at Finsbury Park.
Coaches could also be put on standby to help displace the crowds if necessary.

I know some of this would have really been possible yesterday due to the short notice, but the queuing methods would have helped and I’m sure there were 365’s available given that Great Northern had cancelled all of their London to Cambridge Expresses.

Would this contingency plan work in the future?

 

[LAX54]

And how is that done ?

Traincrew have rostered start/finish times in order to work trains & are subject to 12 hours rest. Having them on-call for any eventuality will lead to them sitting around doing nothing for most of the time (or gaps in the following days services when they are used and cannot get sufficient rest).

P-Way/S&T on-call are generally (but not always) office based staff who can adjust their workload after being called out - they do not have time sensitive duties (ie working a train at a specific time) to deal with

None of our S&T (sharp end) guys are on call, if we have a fault and they are miles away, we just have to wait, or hope another area maybe free to come to our aid !

 

[45107]

None of our S&T (sharp end) guys are on call, if we have a fault and they are miles away, we just have to wait, or hope another area maybe free to come to our aid !

Thought that was the case.
Assume staff on-call are to offer a bit of technical advise and/or sorting priorities (Alternatively, they are told so that they are aware of what is happening from the comfort of home in order to get answers ready for the hindsight committee the following day).

 

[dcsprior]

When on call you are "sitting around" or asleep at home and you do not get paid wages for this. You get paid an on call allowance (say £25 a week) plus the monthly line rental of your telephone. If called in, then you get paid your hourly overtime rate for the hours you work. Agreeing to be "on call" is part of your terms and conditions of employment and you have no choice. Typically you will be on call one week in two, three or four and while on call you have to be at or reasonably near home, contactable and abstain from all alcohol.

£25 / week plus the cost of their phone line rental seems very little in return for giving up the freedom to do what they choose in their personal time

I work in IT, and provide on-call support. For this, we are paid:
* £25 per weeknight
* £40 per weekend night (if before and/or after midnight is at the weekend, so includes Fri, Sat and Sun nights)
* £40 per weekend day
* £80 per bank hol night (if before and/or after midnight is on a BH).
* £80 per BH day

This comes to £300 for a week without Bank Hols, and £610 for a week where Christmas Day falls on a Thursday.

I have compared the rates with other IT jobs, and ours are not over-generous; so if the railway industry expects people to be very restricted in what they do outside of working hours for £25 per week, then that is very harsh.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I didn't travel yesterday, and the one person I know who did said it wasn't that bad - in fact they called their mother that evening because they'd seen it on the news and wanted yo reassure her they hadn't been caught up in horrendous crowds/etc.

However the thing about disruption at this time is that it's likely to affect quite a lot of people who only make a handful of journeys a year by rail, and in their experience a high proportion of railway journeys will involve delays/standing/etc. Many of these same passengers are making journeys they could make by other means such as air, and will do next time.

Is there anything to be said for TOCs limiting reservations to something like 60% of expected capacity the day after engineering works - then if there's a delay they can say "passengers with reservations only" and only have a manageable number of passengers.

Looking at EC's twitter feed on Friday night, one thing they should've done when announcing that an emergency timetable would be published was to give an ETA - at least that way people would know what to expect, rather than shouting about lack of further news within an hour.

 

[ExRes]

Exactly the same way as you do it with safety critical S&T staff who are subject to the same 'Hidden' rules.

Rubbish, you try rostering Train Drivers and S&T staff the same way and see what the outcome is, you'll soon be looking for a new job with your P45 in your back pocket

 

[Stats]

From what I can see online, the organisation of yesterday was a complete shambles. Aside from the issues of communication on Boxing Day and the severe queues outside Finsbury Park station, it seems Great Northern did little to help the situation. I don’t know if they were physically unable to do much as a result of the engineering works, staffing problems, train issues etc, but from Realtime Trains, it appears they just cancelled most of their trains. Even the services to/from Moorgate were mostly cancelled, and very few services ran between Finsbury Park and Peterborough. What’s even more strange is that it appears there was little attempt to allow services to run at the opposite end of the route- looking at the Cambridge and Peterborough ends, most services were cancelled and there were large gaps between services that did run. I know capacity would have been an issue, but could they not at least have run an hourly stopper to Cambridge and an hourly stopper to Peterborough? Was there a major issue that prevented them from running anything?

Most GN services were cancelled in the afternoon due to the overcrowding at Finsbury Park. I would assume this was a collective decision so that the EC services could be cleared. Even when P4 was available trains were held outside the station until the departing P5 service had left.

Both platforms at Stevenage were been used for holding EC trains which would have prevented GN offering a service further north.