The Horror of Pacers

[Mogster]

The examples with the old Merseyrail seating are the worse. Horrendous... Not keen on the weird Northern Spirit seats which look very scruffy now either. The ones with the original bench seating are the pick of the bunch lol.

I can tolerate the 142s in summer. Tbh on a hot day the carriages are surprisingly airey, the windows are big and the opening hoppers large. The alternative 150s are serious little sweat boxes in warm weather. On a hot day I’ll choose the 142 over a 150 if a mixed set rolls up. Performance wise the 142s always seem much faster than 150s and 156s. I suppose they are quite a bit lighter.

In winter though the 142s are at their absolute worst, horribly cold and damp. An early morning journey on the things in January really has to be experienced... The large gaps under the doors let the cold air blast in and the plastic sides hold no heat. Peoples breath condenses on the cold window and other interior surfaces and runs downwards pooling on the floor... They get soaking wet inside and stay so, all winter it seems. I’ve actually had journeys with ice on the inside of the windows and on the floor that didn’t melt for the whole trip. In cold winters I’ve taken to keeping a supply of chemical hand warmers in my commuting bag... Standing on the things is very tiring due to the appalling ride.

They were barely acceptable in the 1980s. They have no place on a modern railway.

 

[Howardh]

Which is the oldest pacer still in use, and what line/s does it run??

Meanwhile; https://www.railmagazine.com/news/rail-features/pacers-the-unlikely-local-heroes-2 - something to read whilst stuck on a pac.....pendolino!

It would be difficult for any traveller not to notice the austere nature of the Pacer fleet when compared to anything else operating on the rail network today. Over the years they’ve become well-known for their bus-style appearance (both outside and inside), bouncy ride (hence their ‘nodding donkeys’ nickname) and their pronounced wheel noise on curves. And yet, despite these obvious shortcomings, with even the youngest members of the fleet now over 30 years-old, the Class 142s, ‘143s’ and ‘144s’ have achieved a longevity well beyond their intended design life. Their length of service is now on a par with many of the first generation DMUs.

Probably the only reason they are disappearing is that they are disabled-unsuitable. If they'd been designes and built with the disabled in mind as they do today, we may well be getting out the candles for their 50th anniversary, but not in celebration, but to heat the interiors a bit....

 

[sprinterguy]

Which is the oldest pacer still in use, and what line/s does it run??

It's 142001, which is a Newton Heath based Northern unit utilised on services around North West England.

 

[Howardh]

It's 142001, which is a Newton Heath based Northern unit utilised on services around North West England.

Thanks! BIB - now why doesn't that surprise me...??

Here are some images from the gorgeous little beauty http://www.railwayherald.co.uk/imagingcentre/loco/142001/LC

 

[sprinterguy]

Thanks! BIB - now why doesn't that surprise me...??

The first batch of class 142s were delivered new to Newton Heath in 1985 (In GMPTE orange and brown livery, as seen in a few of those photos): They've had a varied history, with a couple of transfers to Wales (142002/006/010) and one write off due to the Winsford collision (142008), and a few, including 142001, went off on their holidays to Exeter a little over a decade ago before coming back, but there's still a core group of the original 14 working out of Newton Heath.

 

[Howardh]

The first batch of class 142s were delivered new to Newton Heath in 1985 (In GMPTE orange and brown livery, as seen in a few of those photos): They've had a varied history, with a couple of transfers to Wales (142002/006/010) and one write off due to the Winsford collision (142008), and a few, including 142001, went off on their holidays to Exeter a little over a decade ago before coming back, but there's still a core group of the original 14 working out of Newton Heath.

I was 27. In now have a rail pass to use those very same pacers.

How sobering is that???

 

[sprinterguy]

I was 27. In now have a rail pass to use those very same pacers.

How sobering is that???

They've certainly gone on longer than I think anyone predicted when they were new!

 

[Howardh]

They've certainly gone on longer than I think anyone predicted when they were new!

So have I.....

 

[LowLevel]

They are what they are. In my own way I'll miss seeing them trundling around, but then I don't have to travel on them. Step changes have a habit of sneaking up on you. When I first worked into Liverpool Lime St Chat Moss was a backwater and the train shed was full of diesels, with the exception of the WCML services. Now it's a different place and I hardly noticed it happening. Soonish we will be gone from there as well (in theory) and I'll be deleting a couple of hundred miles of core route and diversions from my route card.

I guarantee some people will miss them when they're gone anyway! They're cute little things and surprisingly popular with their crews whenever I've spoken to them on the matter, if not their passengers.

 

[Harpers Tate]

We all have differing opinions and I can quite see how "Pacers" are the subject of so much derision. However, from my perspective, there are far bigger issues at play than the number of wheels/axles (nowadays, as most track is CWR and rides well enough). The interior ambience of 150s (and the various EMUs made to the same basic body pattern) is the worst out there. And the utterly ludicrous noise levels on 150, 153, 155, 156 probably exceed industrial safety rules i.e. would be illegal in a working environment - especially if it's hot and the windows are open. I would far rather ride on a Pacer train - as long as the seats are suitably spaced (which they mostly aren't) than on a 150 with them crammed in (which they are).

 

[Kingspanner]

Stop this now, all of you!
This thread is about how bad Pacers are, but warm feelings are creeping in to some posts.
Anyone who has never travelled on one, don't. They're awful.
Anyone wanting to bash them all before they're gone, don't. I beg you not to waste your time.
Lets get back to slagging off Pacers, I'd like to hear more horror stories as per the Thread title.

 

[Howardh]

Stop this now, all of you!
This thread is about how bad Pacers are, but warm feelings are creeping in to some posts.
Anyone who has never travelled on one, don't. They're awful.
Anyone wanting to bash them all before they're gone, don't. I beg you not to waste your time.
Lets get back to slagging off Pacers, I'd like to hear more horror stories as per the Thread title.

They are awful, but if it's all you have on your line you can hardly not travel on it! It's all relative anyway, once upon a time didn't third-class passengers travel on an open-top wagon where you either got poured on or hypothermia if not both?
What name did those trains have? (5 letters, begins with "P")

 

[Camden]

They get slated a lot, but you can park them anywhere.

 

[YorksDMU]

I recall, about early 1988, on the news, a story about a Pacer - cannot recall whether it was 142 or 144, and I was not on it, thank goodness - it was said that an early morning train between Cottingham and Beverley had split in two. Looking back on it, the coupling between the two cars had failed. Thankfully it was reported that both cars came to an automatic stop, and that no one had been injured.
I also recall both classes of Pacers having a devil of a job climbing the hill to Speeton Summit from Bridlington. They would quite often come to a sudden stop halfway up it as if they needed to stop for breath!

 

[Mikey C]

The examples with the old Merseyrail seating are the worse. Horrendous... Not keen on the weird Northern Spirit seats which look very scruffy now either. The ones with the original bench seating are the pick of the bunch lol.

I can tolerate the 142s in summer. Tbh on a hot day the carriages are surprisingly airey, the windows are big and the opening hoppers large. The alternative 150s are serious little sweat boxes in warm weather. On a hot day I’ll choose the 142 over a 150 if a mixed set rolls up. Performance wise the 142s always seem much faster than 150s and 156s. I suppose they are quite a bit lighter.

In winter though the 142s are at their absolute worst, horribly cold and damp. An early morning journey on the things in January really has to be experienced... The large gaps under the doors let the cold air blast in and the plastic sides hold no heat. Peoples breath condenses on the cold window and other interior surfaces and runs downwards pooling on the floor... They get soaking wet inside and stay so, all winter it seems. I’ve actually had journeys with ice on the inside of the windows and on the floor that didn’t melt for the whole trip. In cold winters I’ve taken to keeping a supply of chemical hand warmers in my commuting bag... Standing on the things is very tiring due to the appalling ride.

They were barely acceptable in the 1980s. They have no place on a modern railway.

As a "visitor" I don't mind Pacers, as the big windows and thin pillars give a much better view out than on 150s. Many 150s also have horrible 3+2 airline seating too

And lets face it, a long journey on some types of Underground Tube stock is hardly a pleasant experience. 45 minutes on a Pacer is probably nicer than 45 minutes on the 1992 stock with its dreadful low seating and its massive greenhouse windows so you boil in summer

 

[Mogster]

142s are just horrendous in winter. In summer just less bad...

The refreshing early morning cold shower when water has built up in the ceiling to be deposited on an unwary commuter is particularly welcome...

 

[themiller]

Many years ago, I travelled on a 142 from Carlisle to Newcastle. The weather was a crisp, sub-zero morning and the windows were totally frozen over. Despite the heater working, the cold was so intense that all passengers ended up sitting on the seat backs to try to keep from getting frost bitten. The return was much more comfortable as that train had double glazed windows. 142s are not the best trains but they aren’t the worst, either.

 

[Ethano92]

Weren't Pacers supposed to be a stop gap measure that have now lasted 40 years. Stop gap measures are usually cheap, not the best long term option or not high quality so I doubt Pacers are any different.

I suspect at least a few positive comments about these units are more sentimental than anything else and the average rail user despite the ironing board seats would be deeply confused and angry with GTR if they started running Pacers on Thameslink instead of 700s for example. Maybe not at first though as I wonder how many regular GTR passengers have had to encounter Pacers before

 

[nlogax]

I still have a pipe dream of seeing a 142 turn up at one of my local SWR stations on a winter's morning. Just to see the reactions..

 

[Kingspanner]

They get slated a lot, but you can park them anywhere.

Love that!

And this https://assets.publishing.service.g...274a429000019b/090828_B092009_Broad_Green.pdf
And this https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/547c8fe1e5274a4290000189/R122012_120702_Durham.pdf

 

[Ethano92]

I still have a pipe dream of seeing a 142 turn up at one of my local SWR stations on a winter's morning. Just to see the reactions..

Me too. I think people in the SE (including myself) take for granted how far ahead and better our transport is compared to essentially the rest of the country.

 

[yorksrob]

Me too. I think people in the SE (including myself) take for granted how far ahead and better our transport is compared to essentially the rest of the country.

When I grew up in the South East, we had trains built in the 50's, 60's and 70's. When I moved "up North", these certainly seemed "far ahead" and better, compared to newer 142's.

 

[507 001]

Going through Huyton Junction (before it was relaid the time before it was remodelled) on one at 75mph was an experience and a half.... they didn’t half bounce!

 

[Sprinter107]

I always feel safer on a Pacer than any other train late at night, especially the bus seated ones, as I can see all through the train.

 

[Marton]

Dire is the only word

Although with the AirCon yesterday’s 158 from Nunthorpe was freezing and had seats like hammocks I would rather that than the screeching from a cornering pacer.

 

[TheSel]

Dire is the only word

Although with the AirCon yesterday’s 158 from Nunthorpe was freezing and had seats like hammocks I would rather that than the screeching from a cornering pacer.

So why use the other 30 words in your response?

 

[rick9525]

According to Twitter handle @PacerPreacher the first pacer has been officially retired 142025 due to engine failure. It was due to retire in 6 days anyway. A few others go this week.

 

[TheSel]

I always feel safer on a Pacer than any other train late at night, especially the bus seated ones, as I can see all through the train.

To be fair, Class 139s are quite good for that, too!

 

[Robertj21a]

They are what they are. In my own way I'll miss seeing them trundling around, but then I don't have to travel on them. Step changes have a habit of sneaking up on you. When I first worked into Liverpool Lime St Chat Moss was a backwater and the train shed was full of diesels, with the exception of the WCML services. Now it's a different place and I hardly noticed it happening. Soonish we will be gone from there as well (in theory) and I'll be deleting a couple of hundred miles of core route and diversions from my route card.

I guarantee some people will miss them when they're gone anyway! They're cute little things and surprisingly popular with their crews whenever I've spoken to them on the matter, if not their passengers.

I travel on them, and rather like them !

It will be a shame to see them go, they certainly have a character all of their own, with nothing obvious left with similar 'charm'.

 

[Mikey C]

Weren't Pacers supposed to be a stop gap measure that have now lasted 40 years. Stop gap measures are usually cheap, not the best long term option or not high quality so I doubt Pacers are any different.

I suspect at least a few positive comments about these units are more sentimental than anything else and the average rail user despite the ironing board seats would be deeply confused and angry with GTR if they started running Pacers on Thameslink instead of 700s for example. Maybe not at first though as I wonder how many regular GTR passengers have had to encounter Pacers before

Pacers may have been used on the wrong routes, but that doesn't mean that were a completely bad idea for quiet branch lines. You wouldn't use them on the Thameslink route obviously, but if they had been used on something like the Watford to St Albans shuttle or even the closed Croxley branch, they would have been adequate.

And the 700s are the replacement Thameslink trains anyway, if you're comparing Pacers to the original BR spec 455s and 313s (with their horrible low backed seats) it would be a fairer comparison