Russia invades Ukraine

[philosopher]

Yes, seen it on Sky News today.
How does he get in and out?

I assume he must have either travelled by train from Poland or road from a neighbouring country. Flying in would have been far too risky.

 

[Loppylugs]

Yes, seen it on Sky News today.
How does he get in and out?

Went on his bicycle

 

[Pete_uk]

I hope the Ukrainian army can give the Russians another migraine in the south east when they start their offensive down there

 

[najaB]

Flying in would have been far too risky.

Not to mention that a UK military aircraft flying into Ukraine would most likely be seen as escalation by the Russians and there are no commercial flights.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

The PM has made a surprise appearance in Kyiv.

That is really good. I know it's only symbolic, but I'm sure it must raise morale amongst the Ukrainians. One (maybe, slightly unusual) thing Boris has done that I feel quite proud of (although I realise he's not the first European leader to make the trip). I recall reading at least a week or so ago that there were reports he was very keen to go, but had to wait until the UK Government could figure out good security arrangements.

I just hope the accompanying promise of arms for Ukraine he made was meaningful. The growing reports that some NATO countries - possibly including the UK - are starting to run short of weapons ourselves are a little concerning.

 

[Welly]

This Ukrainian soldier explains the concept of "Russian World/Russian Peace" which explains the mentality behind the invasion of Ukraine.

 

[Mojo]

Yes, seen it on Sky News today.
How does he get in and out?

I assume he must have either travelled by train from Poland or road from a neighbouring country. Flying in would have been far too risky.

He did indeed travel by train from Poland. This Twitter Account has a link of him posing with Ukranian Railways staff as well as a video message filmed from onboard the train.

If anyone's interested, the carriage is a "VIP-Wagon" which the railway company apparently has or at least had at least 10 of. There's a video on YouTube from 2015 of the staff showing a news reporter around (not in English):

 

[najaB]

He did indeed travel by train from Poland. This Twitter Account has a link of him posing with Ukranian Railways staff as well as a video message filmed from onboard the train.

If anyone's interested, the carriage is a "VIP-Wagon" which the railway company apparently has or at least had at least 10 of. There's a video on YouTube from 2015 of the staff showing a news reporter around (not in English):

Is it just me or is that all a bit... tacky?

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

Is it just me or is that all a bit... tacky?

Fairly standard central/eastern European traditional train decoration. Back in the day when loco crews had their "own" loco they were very often subject to individual decoration of the cab areas: shallow depth (net) curtains were a common feature.

 

[brad465]

In other news all irony meters around the world have broken beyond repair:

Ukraine War: Russia warns Sweden and Finland against Nato membership

Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said the move won't bring stability to Europe.

www.bbc.co.uk

Russia has warned Finland and Sweden against joining Nato, arguing the move would not bring stability to Europe.

Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov told reporters that "the alliance remains a tool geared towards confrontation".
It comes as US defence officials said Moscow's invasion of Ukraine has been a "massive strategic blunder" which will likely bring Nato enlargement.
US officials expect the Nordic neighbours to bid for membership of the alliance, potentially as early as June.
Washington is believed to support the move which would see the Western alliance grow to 32 members. US State Department officials said last week that discussions had taken place between Nato leaders and foreign ministers from Helsinki and Stockholm.
Before it launched its invasion, Russia demanded that the alliance agree to halt any future enlargement, but the war has led to the deployment of more Nato troops on its eastern flank and a rise in public support for Swedish and Finnish membership.
Finnish MPs are expected to receive a security report from intelligence officials this week, and Prime Minister Sanna Marin said she expects her government "will end the discussion before midsummer" on whether to make a membership application.
Finland shares a 1,340km (830 miles) long border with Russia and has been rattled by Russia's invasion of Ukraine.

But Moscow has been clear that it opposes any potential enlargement of the alliance. Mr Peskov warned the bloc "is not that kind of alliance which ensures peace and stability, and its further expansion will not bring additional security to the European continent".
Last week Mr Peskov said that Russia would have to "rebalance the situation" with its own measures were Sweden and Finland to join Nato.
And in February Maria Zakharova, Russia's foreign ministry spokeswoman, warned of "military and political consequences" if the countries joined the bloc.
Despite the threats, both countries have pushed ahead with their bids and stepped up defence spending.
On Monday, army leaders in Helsinki announced a new plan to allocate €14m (£10.88m) to purchase drones for Finland's military.
And last month Swedish officials said they would boost defence spending by 3 billion kronas ($317m; £243m) in 2022.

 

[Giugiaro]

In other news all irony meters around the world have broken beyond repair:

Ukraine War: Russia warns Sweden and Finland against Nato membership

Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said the move won't bring stability to Europe.

www.bbc.co.uk

The irony here is that Mother Russia is acting just like a terrible ex-husband.

 

[DanNCL]

There are apparently reports of Russia using a chemical weapon in Mariupol…

Defenders of #Mariupol just said Russia used chemical weapons on them around an hour ago – soldiers are having difficulty breathing and vestibulo-atactic syndrome. Earlier today Russian puppets in occupied Donbas openly called for the use of chemical weapons against them

https://twitter.com/lapatina_/status/1513600921099542538?s=21&t=TMSMXHxXT_f48sVUq3LDXw

 

[GusB]

There are apparently reports of Russia using a chemical weapon in Mariupol…

If there are, could you actually post a link that we could follow?

 

[Cowley]

If there are, could you actually post a link that we could follow?

There’s reports of this on the Daily Mail, Daily Express and a couple of other websites but I think we need to wait until there’s something more confirmatory before we put it on here.

 

[DanNCL]

If there are, could you actually post a link that we could follow?

I have amended my original post to include a quote and link to a tweet from a journalist from the Kyiv Independent. I haven’t found anything from Western Media yet, if I do find anything I will share it.

 

[najaB]

There are apparently reports of Russia using a chemical weapon in Mariupol…

So, Mr Putin, remind me how this was all a noble mission to de-nazify Ukraine?

 

[DanNCL]

Biden promised a few weeks ago that NATO would respond if chemical weapons were used in Ukraine. Now that it seems this has happened, I wonder what NATO’s response will be.

So, Mr Putin, remind me how this was all a noble mission to de-nazify Ukraine?

Rule number one of this invasion: whatever the Kremlin says, believe the exact opposite.

 

[AlterEgo]

It does seem an interesting distinction to make - shelling people in a theatre doesn't provoke a response but poison gas does.

 

[GusB]

It does seem an interesting distinction to make - shelling people in a theatre doesn't provoke a response but poison gas does.

Of course shelling people in a theatre provokes a response, but so far we've been told that any meaningful reaction would trigger world war three.

I'm sure I'm not the only one who sees what is happening and wants to do something more to help the people in Ukraine, but Russia has nukes and we can't go there. Putin is getting away with murder and we sit by the sidelines thinking "ooh, better not do anything about it in case he nukes us".

 

[AlterEgo]

Of course shelling people in a theatre provokes a response, but so far we've been told that any meaningful reaction would trigger world war three.

I'm sure I'm not the only one who sees what is happening and wants to do something more to help the people in Ukraine, but Russia has nukes and we can't go there. Putin is getting away with murder and we sit by the sidelines thinking "ooh, better not do anything about it in case he nukes us".

I mean, the interesting distinction is that Biden’s red line is chemical weapons. Why are those worse than shelling people or raping women, both of which have happened countless times so far?

 

[najaB]

It does seem an interesting distinction to make - shelling people in a theatre doesn't provoke a response but poison gas does.

It's because shelling a theatre can be explained as a mistake with some shred of plausibility: "We thought that the building was being used as a field HQ" or "We weren't aiming at that building, the bombs fell short". Without those involved admitting that it was deliberate it is very hard to make an airtight case that crimes were committed.

You can't accidentally transport chemical weapons from their storage locations to the frontline, load them onto delivery systems and deploy them.

Biden promised a few weeks ago that NATO would respond if chemical weapons were used in Ukraine. Now that it seems this has happened, I wonder what NATO’s response will be.

I suspect that the gloves are off with respect to the weapons that Ukraine will be supplied with - those MiG 29s might be heading their way after all (and to be honest, it makes more sense to send them now given that Ukraine is likely to go on the offensive). Also expect that the pressure on EU countries to stop their purchase of gas from Russia to be doubled.

 

[REVUpminster]

It is in the interests of Germany to let Russia win and the best way is to deny Ukraine weapons which they have been doing since the beginning.

 

[Shrop]

Does anyone know what these claims are, of various politicians, which say "Putin will be held to account"? Are these politicians perhaps envisaging a scenario where Putin will one day be paraded in a court somewhere, told how naughty he has been and sent off to jail? If not, then what else is supposed to happen to make Putin regret causing this war? Is there some weird hope that he will be repatriated into society and issue an apology for his actions? I just don't get what value it is to anyone, to say he will be held to account ...

 

[yorksrob]

Does anyone know what these claims are, of various politicians, which say "Putin will be held to account"? Are these politicians perhaps envisaging a scenario where Putin will one day be paraded in a court somewhere, told how naughty he has been and sent off to jail? If not, then what else is supposed to happen to make Putin regret causing this war? Is there some weird hope that he will be repatriated into society and issue an apology for his actions? I just don't get what value it is to anyone, to say he will be held to account ...

I'm afraid I agree. I can't see by what mechanism he will realistically be held to account, unless through action by his own countrymen.

 

[gg1]

I'm afraid I agree. I can't see by what mechanism he will realistically be held to account, unless through action by his own countrymen.

I can see a scenario where post war sanctions on Russia will not be fully lifted until Putin has been removed from power and handed over to the International Criminal Court, making it in their own interests (which realistically is the only reason they support him currently) for the oligarchs to back a coup.

In such a scenario I suspect Putin would meet with an unfortunate 'accident' before reaching The Hague however.

 

[Loppylugs]

In such a scenario I suspect Putin would meet with an unfortunate 'accident' before reaching The Hague however.

It wouldn't be unforunate !

I would love to envisage his Victory Parade with what he has left. A guy piloting a horse and cart with a bow and arrow slung over his back.

 

[Giugiaro]

So, Mr Putin, remind me how this was all a noble mission to de-nazify Ukraine?

Oh, the irony...

 

[Shrop]

In such a scenario I suspect Putin would meet with an unfortunate 'accident' before reaching The Hague however.

An unfortunate accident is about as useful in making Putin regret his was crimes, as is people saying they're a bit cross with Jimmy Saville for his dodgy behaviour, when in fact the latter died believing that he was the hero of the country.

Surely a suitable punishment would be to put Putin, and his sympathisers (especially his army generals) in rooms with the victims of bombs, rape, beatings etc, one at a time, and to listen to what they think of him/them. Not for him to get beaten up as we don't need to be as barbaric as this, but to have him forced to listen to what he's done to his victims, for hours, days and weeks without a break. And all whilst not being allowed out of that room at any time. The room, should be very cold, his only bed being a thin blanket on a hard floor, and with very little food. Altogether, something which forces him to think about what he's inflicted upon others. The punishment needs to fit the crime.

Whatever happens, Putin should not be permitted to die believing himself to be a hero.

 

[gg1]

It wouldn't be unforunate !

It was a facetious 'unfortunate'

An unfortunate accident is about as useful in making Putin regret his was crimes, as is people saying they're a bit cross with Jimmy Saville for his dodgy behaviour, when in fact the latter died believing that he was the hero of the country.

Surely a suitable punishment would be to put Putin, and his sympathisers (especially his army generals) in rooms with the victims of bombs, rape, beatings etc, one at a time, and to listen to what they think of him/them. Not for him to get beaten up as we don't need to be as barbaric as this, but to have him forced to listen to what he's done to his victims, for hours, days and weeks without a break. And all whilst not being allowed out of that room at any time. The room, should be very cold, his only bed being a thin blanket on a hard floor, and with very little food. Altogether, something which forces him to think about what he's inflicted upon others. The punishment needs to fit the crime.

Whatever happens, Putin should not be permitted to die believing himself to be a hero.

My post wasn't about what SHOULD happen but what I think WILL happen.

If Putin is removed in a coup, I can't see the new (most likely military) rulers of Russia deporting him to face any form of international trial but I can definitely see him facing justice in Russia in the form of execution.

 

[Richard Scott]

It was a facetious 'unfortunate'


My post wasn't about what SHOULD happen but what I think WILL happen.

If Putin is removed in a coup, I can't see the new (most likely military) rulers of Russia deporting him to face any form of international trial but I can definitely see him facing justice in Russia in the form of execution.

If he is removed in a coup expect it'll be very similar to the way Romania dealt with Ceausescu.