penaltyfines
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- 4 Sep 2010
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- 298
Just wondering why 1st class (walk-on) fares don't qualify for a 16-25 railcard discount - and whether you agree with it!
Just wondering why 1st class (walk-on) fares don't qualify for a 16-25 railcard discount - and whether you agree with it!
I emailed ATOC about this last week actually, and am awaiting a response.
Personally I find it quite offensive and discriminatory that 16-25 Railcard holders can't get a discount on First Anytime fares, whereas Senior Railcard holders can.
I've asked them to explain why the current situation exists, and if they are planning to allow 16-25 Railcards to be used on First Anytime fares in the near future.
I will post any response I receive here.
Personally I find it quite offensive and discriminatory that 16-25 Railcard holders can't get a discount on First Anytime fares, whereas Senior Railcard holders can.
First Class is a premium service. Students (primary target market) are supposedly meant to be being careful with money, not spending it on 1st Class Fares.
Also consider the personality differences between students and the likes of businessmen, senior citizens etc. The way I've seen some students behave reinforces my belief that they may not be great candidates for First Class, especially with VT (and free ale).
First Class is supposed to be an exclusive atmosphere. Unfourtunately I feel TOCs have eroded that atmosphere away with ultra-cheap First Advances that attract people who THINK they are better than everyone else and then act like a tit on board, (whilst sitting next to somebody with a £400 FOS).
First Class is a premium service. Students (primary target market) are supposedly meant to be being careful with money, not spending it on 1st Class Fares.
Also consider the personality differences between students and the likes of businessmen, senior citizens etc. The way I've seen some students behave reinforces my belief that they may not be great candidates for First Class, especially with VT (and free ale).
First Class is supposed to be an exclusive atmosphere. Unfourtunately I feel TOCs have eroded that atmosphere away with ultra-cheap First Advances that attract people who THINK they are better than everyone else and then act like a tit on board, (whilst sitting next to somebody with a £400 FOS).
Why offensive?
Family and Friends Railcards aren't valid at all in First. Is that discriminatory and offensive too?
Why's everything so offensive to everyone these days?
HM Forces Railcard's are valid on First Class fares. In my opinion, ATOC only do this to "look good", and since most people working in the armed forces get a low salary, ATOC don't expect many of them to consider travelling First Class!
Why is it offensive for 16-25 years old? Well, why should a 25 year old not be entitled to a discount with their Railcard, when a 60 year old is? Both people want the same product - leisure travel. There are many well off people who qualify for a 16-25 Railcard, and would consider travelling First Class whenever possible (if the price is reasonable). The current situation is offensive because ATOC are effectively saying that young people are not "worthy" enough to travel First Class, whereas older people are.
First Class is supposed to be an exclusive atmosphere. Unfourtunately I feel TOCs have eroded that atmosphere away with ultra-cheap First Advances that attract people who THINK they are better than everyone else and then act like a tit on board, (whilst sitting next to somebody with a £400 FOS).
First Class is a premium service. Students (primary target market) are supposedly meant to be being careful with money, not spending it on 1st Class Fares.
Also consider the personality differences between students and the likes of businessmen, senior citizens etc. The way I've seen some students behave reinforces my belief that they may not be great candidates for First Class, especially with VT (and free ale).
First Class is supposed to be an exclusive atmosphere. Unfourtunately I feel TOCs have eroded that atmosphere away with ultra-cheap First Advances that attract people who THINK they are better than everyone else and then act like a tit on board, (whilst sitting next to somebody with a £400 FOS).
Well it must be even more offensive for 26-59 year olds who do not qualify for either railcard. Perhaps you should be grateful that you can get discount off some tickets with a railcard lots of people can not even have a railcard.
Peter
Interestingly, I almost never travelled by train until I went to university and got a railcard. I think the train companies have done quite well out of my leisure travel!I don't believe that students are the primary target market, as the Railcard is aimed at leisure travel,
On TPE I just buy a First Advance the day before as you can use 16-25 railcards with them
It is "reasonable" that Family and Friends Railcards aren't valid in First Class, because you don't expect young children to be using it.
HM Forces Railcard's are valid on First Class fares. In my opinion, ATOC only do this to "look good", and since most people working in the armed forces get a low salary, ATOC don't expect many of them to consider travelling First Class!
Why is it offensive for 16-25 years old? Well, why should a 25 year old not be entitled to a discount with their Railcard, when a 60 year old is? Both people want the same product - leisure travel. There are many well off people who qualify for a 16-25 Railcard, and would consider travelling First Class whenever possible (if the price is reasonable). The current situation is offensive because ATOC are effectively saying that young people are not "worthy" enough to travel First Class, whereas older people are.
It is NOT called a "Student" Railcard - it is called a 16 to 25 RaiWhy should Senior Railcard holders get a discount on these fares, when 16-25 Railcard holders cannot?
Why should you expect 16-25 people to get a discount?You can't expect "adults" to get a discount too!
Isn't your argument about F&F railcards not having it effectively saying they are not worthy to travel first class?The current situation is offensive because ATOC are effectively saying that young people are not "worthy" enough to travel First Class, whereas older people are.
No, they're only stating that the holders of a 16-25 railcard shouldn't qualify for a discount.
Well it must be even more offensive for 26-59 year olds who do not qualify for either railcard.
and the majority that get the say in a democracy.
Why should you expect 16-25 people to get a discount?
What some people need to realise is that there is no divine right to these things. ATOC are under no obligation to have any kind of discount system whatsoever. You should be pleased that you are in an age group where you at least do get a discount on standard travel (which is fine for the majority...)!
I'm a member of today's youth. And sometimes, looking around seeing the demanding attitudes today, not recognising that they're actually lucky, disgusts me.The media and the elderly demonise today's youth - even you've done so in your post. 16-25s deserve something back off society, a lot of it would simply appear to be jealousy.
Here's a novel idea why don't we (like DB) introduce a national railcard that is available to everyone?
Whilst you may behave courteously, sadly, the majority do not. It's the majority that create stereotypes, and the majority that get the say in a democracy.
Here's a novel idea why don't we (like DB) introduce a national railcard that is available to everyone? Seriously why not reward everyone that regularly travels by train rather than just those that fit a certain age range or have a certain job or have young kids?
and some students like to use first-class to actually get some work done, ideally without the company of a bunch of loud-mouths in cheap suits who don't know what 'quiet' coach means.
Absurdly high car insurance premiums precludes many from getting a car and they have to travel somehow. What's more should those under 25 ever need to rely on state benefits (increasingly likely given high youth unemployment) they will get about 20% less simply for being under 25! despite paying NICs at full rate. The media and the elderly demonise today's youth - even you've done so in your post. 16-25s deserve something back off society, a lot of it would simply appear to be jealousy.