I'd estimate the chances as being somewhere between slim and none. Is there a untapped demand for services to stop there?Hi all...does anybody know the current possibility of this?
I'd estimate the chances as being somewhere between slim and none. Is there a untapped demand for services to stop there?
I'd estimate the chances as being somewhere between slim and none. Is there a untapped demand for services to stop there?
I'd estimate the chances as being somewhere between slim and none. Is there a untapped demand for services to stop there?
I think that there would have to be a strong case for any reopening, with supporting evidence that there is a significant market that isn't being catered for by a change at Lancaster.
I'd be surprised if such a market existed, to be honest.
I think its been discussed many times although its unlikely to happen at present. When more trains on the Windermere Branch Line used to run beyond Oxenholme Lake District there may have been a case although given very few do now its unlikely that stopping any of the Scottish trains at Carnforth could be justified.
I think that's the key issue. There's very little that currently runs along the main line at Carnforth that you'd want to stop there.
However, the other side to the argument - which no one so far has pointed out - is that there is a substantial commuter market from Carnforth (and a much bigger one at Lancaster) heading South, which is very poorly served by the 1tph at Carnforth, and by the very irregularly spaced out trains at Lancaster. The main road from Carnforth to Lancaster is also frequently very congested. As you point out, if the Windermere trains were extended to provide an additional hourly service down to Preston (and perhaps beyond) then they would be very good candidates to call at Carnforth and tap into that commuter market. (As a side-effect, it'd probably also increase passenger numbers to Windermere for day-trippers and tourists, since you'd be able to get there from many more destinations without changing)
If it were within an 70 minutes of London it may well be a different story, but it is not.
Quite. A change at Lancaster is hardly a huge inconvenience, even if travelling from north of Carnforth.
If they ever did reopen, they'd need to be on loops really (to avoid slowing services that still won't call- which would still be the majority) which pushes the cost up significantly. I won't say there's absolutely zero chance, but it isn't much above that.
I think there was an idea a few years ago to build a connecting curve north of Carnforth from the line towards Skipton onto the WCML, so trains to and from the north could stop at the surviving platforms. This would also allow stopping trains to be overtaken, although the benefits of this might be small as overtaking can already take place at Lancaster. It would also be more expensive than reinstating the former WCML platforms.
I think its been discussed many times although its unlikely to happen at present. When more trains on the Windermere Branch Line used to run beyond Oxenholme Lake District there may have been a case although given very few do now its unlikely that stopping any of the Scottish trains at Carnforth could be justified.
Depends a bit. If the trains were frequent, then changing at Lancaster wouldn't be much of an inconvenience. But when Carnforth only has (roughly) 1tph, and some destinations from Lancaster don't have much more than that, changing at Lancaster could well involve quite a long wait.
I think there was an idea a few years ago to build a connecting curve north of Carnforth from the line towards Skipton onto the WCML, so trains to and from the north could stop at the surviving platforms. This would also allow stopping trains to be overtaken, although the benefits of this might be small as overtaking can already take place at Lancaster. It would also be more expensive than reinstating the former WCML platforms.
Would they? Presumably that depends on the timetable, and whether it's possible to avoid timetabling stopping trains immediately before fast trains.
I suspect a more pertinent problem if a stopping service was arranged by extending the Windermere trains (which seems the most plausible solution) would conflicting movements just south of Oxenholme.
Southbound, overtaking at Lancaster is fine, as there are two Southbound platforms. Northbound, it's more problematic: Only 1 platform, so you can only overtake if the fast train isn't stopping. Since almost all trains do stop at Lancaster, that's a bit of an issue Having said that, perhaps a reasonable not-too-expensive solution would be building the curve you mention for Northbound services and overtaking at Lancaster for southbound services.
Hi all...does anybody know the current possibility of this?
Depends a bit. If the trains were frequent, then changing at Lancaster wouldn't be much of an inconvenience. But when Carnforth only has (roughly) 1tph, and some destinations from Lancaster don't have much more than that, changing at Lancaster could well involve quite a long wait.
There's an action group with a professional-looking website, though it may well just be the work of one person. Perhaps the OP himself????
http://carnforthplatforms.org/
Aren't the majority of Manchester - Scotland trains now six or eight carriages? Or have they stopped doubling up the 185/350s?Four car length would be sufficient.
Commonly four carriages, some are eight. Of course, they will all be five carriages by the end of the decade (not sure if any will be doubled up to form ten car workings).Aren't the majority of Manchester - Scotland trains now six or eight carriages? Or have they stopped doubling up the 185/350s?
So at the very least you would need to have five carriage-length platforms to avoid having to mess around with SDO.Commonly four carriages, some are eight. Of course, they will all be five carriages by the end of the decade (not sure if any will be doubled up to form ten car workings).
I'm not convinced that much of a commuter market exists. Apart from early morning or at night, any normal person would use the M6 rather than the A6 as it is substantially faster.