Caledonian Sleeper Mk5 Discussion

[Bletchleyite]

Looks to me like the doors are a normal height and the row of 2 bolts underneath may be for attaching a conventional step which will be fitted later.

 

[ScottDarg]

Some detail shots.

Superb pics! Thanks again for heading out to get them and sharing them.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I wonder will TPE make use of the flexibility of window positions/sizes and thus use a different layout in First and Standard to give proper alignment in both?

 

[395 Olympic Javelin]

They remind me of the former Nightstar coaches

 

[Tam]

I added yellow lines to one photo to show the comparative window heights.

 

[Tam]

Is there any way to load a short video?

 

[Clansman]

Is there any way to load a short video?

Great photo's again Tam, excellent effort

I'm not sure how to upload onto this forum (if that's even possible?) but this site lets you upload, and paste the link without a sign up. Simple process to do...

https://streamable.com/

 

[Tam]

Interior shots taken by mobile phone camera through boggin' windows (true James Bond effect). Don't ask me to name the coaches, but you can probably work it out.

 

[dgl]

interesting that there seems to be a Ku band satellite system on the roof, I wonder what that will be for as I would guess it's not just for testing and going to all that trouble for carriage monitoring would be ridiculous. So I'm guessing either a satellite internet/network link or more unlikely but possible for the reception of FTA TV.

 

[Tam]

Great photo's again Tam, excellent effort

I'm not sure how to upload onto this forum (if that's even possible?) but this site lets you upload, and paste the link without a sign up. Simple process to do...

https://streamable.com/

Let's try this...

https://streamable.com/3aadh

 

[Clansman]

Let's try this...

https://streamable.com/3aadh

Working perfectly.

Great video, thanks again

 

[Tam]

Another video...

https://streamable.com/lxgmn

 

[TimboM]

Let's try this...

https://streamable.com/3aadh

You've exceeded yourself once again Tam - proper Bond-esque efforts (particularly the internal shots). Thanks very much!!

Couple of thoughts/observations (might just be me):

- the wheels/bogies look comparatively small / simple to older stock
- does that last coach on left in the video have scrapes/scuffs down the side of it or just reflections?

 

[TimboM]

interesting that there seems to be a Ku band satellite system on the roof, I wonder what that will be for as I would guess it's not just for testing and going to all that trouble for carriage monitoring would be ridiculous. So I'm guessing either a satellite internet/network link or more unlikely but possible for the reception of FTA TV.

Part of the offering with the new stock is wifi throughout, so guessing it's to support this?

 

[sprinterguy]

The base of the door look like they will be below platform level here in the uk?

Railhead to bottom door edge on the mark 5 stock measures 1100mm, according to plans. On mark 3 stock railhead to solebar is 1040mm, although there's a small step up from that to footboard level so the two are probably comparable.

 

[Clansman]

I remember a list knocking about somewhere, but does anyone know the coach types that are currently in Velim, as very kindly shown by Tam? Quite difficult to make out which is which, and the unique window layout doesn't help things either.

Is it me or will the Mk5s result in a lower number of berths over more seats?

 

[aleggatta]

Let's try this...

https://streamable.com/3aadh

Where's the DOO cameras? Or did I miss something...

 

[TimboM]

I remember a list knocking about somewhere, but does anyone know the coach types that are currently in Velim, as very kindly shown by Tam? Quite difficult to make out which is which, and the unique window layout doesn't help things either.

Is it me or will the Mk5s result in a lower number of berths over more seats?

It's one of each in the test rake: brake/seats; lounge; SLE; SLEP; SLED. I'll let you have a go at figuring out which is which...

Yes, looking at the booking info on the CS website for after the new stock is due in there are less berths per coach. Particularly the case for first class compared to now where number of berths is same as standard.

 

[Clansman]

It's one of each in the test rake: brake/seats; lounge; SLE; SLEP; SLED. I'll let you have a go at figuring out which is which...

Crikey, not an easy task, that's for sure.

Yes, looking at the booking info on the CS website for after the new stock is due in there are less berths per coach. Particularly the case for first class compared to now where number of berths is same as standard.

So by having greater first class berths than standard, and by rebranding them as "Solo" and "Shared", Serco are then able to get away with bumping the prices of the current standard class berth fare, whilst charging near enough the current rate for the seats of which the Mk5s will have more of. Sneaky way of getting more cash in hand at the end of the day.

Not bad for a loss making franchise.

 

[jopsuk]

In a fantasy world, if each of the five services was to be a separate train (with enough stock, locos, etc), how many (new) coaches could each terminus take? Not that the Aberdeen one would need to be long of course.

 

[Bletchleyite]

So by having greater first class berths than standard, and by rebranding them as "Solo" and "Shared", Serco are then able to get away with bumping the prices of the current standard class berth fare, whilst charging near enough the current rate for the seats of which the Mk5s will have more of. Sneaky way of getting more cash in hand at the end of the day.

Not bad for a loss making franchise.

It makes sense anyway - too many companies won't allow first class, yet staff won't share compartments because, well, would you share a hotel room on a business trip?

(I'd genuinely rather go in the seats - and have done - than share with one other person - it's just too intimate with a stranger. I wish they hadn't dropped the pods)

 

[dgl]

Part of the offering with the new stock is wifi throughout, so guessing it's to support this?

Looking at various websites/searching online that would seem to be the case, there are certainly products on the market that provide such a service (such as http://www.indracompany.com/sites/default/files/INTERNET_TRAIN_baja pag.pdf ).

I'm guessing in the wilds of Scotland getting a data link via 3/4G would probably be quite a task involving the construction of multiple new mobile base stations thus by using satellite the higher cost of data would be offset by the cost of providing new mobile links.

 

[Scotrail84]

It makes sense anyway - too many companies won't allow first class, yet staff won't share compartments because, well, would you share a hotel room on a business trip?

(I'd genuinely rather go in the seats - and have done - than share with one other person - it's just too intimate with a stranger. I wish they hadn't dropped the pods)

H+S stopped them.

 

[TimboM]

Crikey, not an easy task, that's for sure.

Distinguishing the lounge and seats/brake cars is pretty clear in Tam's photos. Trying to work out which Sleeper car is which variant though maybe a little more challenging...!

 

[Bletchleyite]

H+S stopped them.

If that had bothered them that much they could have found a way to make them work within the law. Or replaced them with longitudinal couchettes, or something.

I think they just preferred to have one fewer class and it was a convenient excuse.

 

[Clip]

Fantastic work Tam.

 

[Bungle965]

H+S stopped them.

Interesting that H+S stopped them doing it that but did not stop Northlink Ferries from doing it on their overnight service.
Sam

 

[Bletchleyite]

Interesting that H+S stopped them doing it that but did not stop Northlink Ferries from doing it on their overnight service

And just about every long-haul aircraft, on which safety regulations are typically WAY tighter than trains, also has them.

As I said I think it was a convenient excuse for a business decision.

 

[Mordac]

And just about every long-haul aircraft, on which safety regulations are typically WAY tighter than trains, also has them.

As I said I think it was a convenient excuse for a business decision.

Just like most other invocations of health and safety, then.

 

[TimboM]

If that had bothered them that much they could have found a way to make them work within the law. Or replaced them with longitudinal couchettes, or something.

I think they just preferred to have one fewer class and it was a convenient excuse.

And just about every long-haul aircraft, on which safety regulations are typically WAY tighter than trains, also has them.

As I said I think it was a convenient excuse for a business decision.

I doubt it was a "no, never" from the H&S police (as others have mentioned they're used in other forms of travel). However, it would've been breaking new ground where rail travel is concerned and would've required a lot of additional costs/testing etc. to get the relevant approvals and the H&S authorities satisfied (with the risk that they wouldn't be, or would require more time/cost to get them in a position they were).

With a tight timeline (and budget probably) already for the new stock, I expect adding in those costs/risks wasn't palatable in the end. So an H&S-driven business decision as it were...!