Class 345 progress

matt_world2004 · 24 Oct 2017

AlexNL said:
Are these units bought directly by TfL or are they being procured by a ROSCO?

My understanding is rail for london (Tfl) leases them out to the franchisee

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samuelmorris · 24 Oct 2017

Technically speaking it's a management contract isn't it? I don't imagine the operator even needs to lease them, just simply operate them.

TT-ONR-NRN · 24 Oct 2017

Peter Mugridge said:
Click "reply" and it automatically quotes the post you reply to.

Oh my gosh I’ve only just seen this post! Thank you that is so helpful!

hwl · 24 Oct 2017

Bald Rick said:
Ronnie Corbett did the answering. (My all time favourite two Ronnies sketch).

Meanwhile, back on topic, any substance to the rumours that TfL / MTR are refusing to accept any more deliveries?

Sort of, there is a backlog in training of maintenance staff for the units which is the overall bottleneck so trying to do more delivery / rectification / acceptance will make matters worse hence the focus on units they already have. They would like to have 11 sets for GEML use by December TT change.
However Old Oak Common is almost ready and delivery of 9 car units there will start shortly including the unit for initial ETCS testing on the western side.

matt_world2004 · 25 Oct 2017

hwl said:
Sort of, there is a backlog in training of maintenance staff for the units which is the overall bottleneck so trying to do more delivery / rectification / acceptance will make matters worse hence the focus on units they already have. They would like to have 11 sets for GEML use by December TT change.
However Old Oak Common is almost ready and delivery of 9 car units there will start shortly including the unit for initial ETCS testing on the western side.

Someone posted on the district daves forum thst testing was due to begin at the end of October from heathrow airport to airport junction.

dp21 · 25 Oct 2017

samuelmorris said:
Technically speaking it's a management contract isn't it? I don't imagine the operator even needs to lease them, just simply operate them.

Yes, I believe it's a concession rather than a franchise. Quite how the rolling stock lease (or not) works I'm not quite sure!

samuelmorris · 25 Oct 2017

Looks like 2W52 is still run by 315s so that whole diagram appears to be off the list for 345s for now. The service immediately following, 2C74 is still a 345.

Bald Rick · 25 Oct 2017

AlexNL said:
Are these units bought directly by TfL or are they being procured by a ROSCO?

TfL

Class465fan · 27 Oct 2017

http://www.metro-report.com/news/pr...ass-345-testing-starts-in-crossrail-core.html

superalbs · 27 Oct 2017

Are there any weekend diagrams for Class 345 units yet?

Am in London, so would like to give them a go.

Thanks in Advance.

class387 · 27 Oct 2017

There should be, given that the third day of 345 service was a Saturday, but I don't know the exact diagrams.

EDIT - Posted on another thread that there will be no weekend 345 diagrams for the rest of the year due to engineering work.

samuelmorris · 27 Oct 2017

Seemingly the one remaining diagram of the 6pm-ish peak departures has swapped around - 345006 was operating the Shenfield service tonight, while the 1810 to Gidea Park was back to being 315s for the first time in a while. Handy as that's the first time I've actually managed to go on 006 :P

mr_jarhead · 29 Oct 2017

345s at Abbey Wood have got the Elizabeth Line branding on them, do the Shenfield ones still say TFL rail?
(Photos from a local Facebook group)

samuelmorris · 29 Oct 2017

Yes, the Shenfield units still carry the TfL Rail branding as the service is still labelled as such - interesting to see that!

Peter Sarf · 29 Oct 2017

I think the above pictures are of 345021. I think that is the one that arrived at Abbey Wood today (Sunday) and I presume got there via national rail. So I assume it is then for testing down the Crossrail tunnels.

If so then it is a nine car unit. So definitely not for use on TfL rail out of Liverpool Street as they have to be temporarily short at 7-cars due to platform lengths (they are longer coaches iirc).

Later the two extra cars will be added to the (fourteen ?) 7-car 345s make them 9-car when its time for them to do their proper job through the tunnels so thus missing Liverpool Street.

dp21 · 29 Oct 2017

Peter Sarf said:
I think the above pictures are of 345021. I think that is the one that arrived at Abbey Wood today (Sunday) and I presume got there via national rail. So I assume it is then for testing down the Crossrail tunnels.

If so then it is a nine car unit. So definitely not for use on TfL rail out of Liverpool Street as they have to be temporarily short at 7-cars due to platform lengths (they are longer coaches iirc).

Later the two extra cars will be added to the (fourteen ?) 7-car 345s make them 9-car when its time for them to do their proper job through the tunnels so thus missing Liverpool Street.

Yes, absolutely right. Any being delivered to OOC will also be 9-cars is my understanding including those used for testing on the Heathrow branch.

Wivenswold · 30 Oct 2017

Isn't the plan to remodel Liverpool Street East Side as soon as the tunnel opens so that 2 platforms can be used for Crossrail peak services into the city and no-doubt C2C late night services?

If that is the case then a few 345s would have to stay 7 car until the work is completed.

samuelmorris · 30 Oct 2017

I imagine it depends on whether they intend to be finished with the LST 'high level' remodel before the GW section is connected 7 months later. If not, they might as well just keep running those services with 315s instead...

Wivenswold · 30 Oct 2017

Good point, one is already being kept by LO for the Upminster - Romford service, so that does make sense. They may even outlive their old colleagues, the 321s.

wls1 · 30 Oct 2017

Wivenswold said:
Isn't the plan to remodel Liverpool Street East Side as soon as the tunnel opens so that 2 platforms can be used for Crossrail peak services into the city and no-doubt C2C late night services?

If that is the case then a few 345s would have to stay 7 car until the work is completed.

c2c haven't ran late night servives into LST since the dec 2015 timetable, only run 2 of the Shoeburys each hour on weekends and all bar chafford services on any day that fenchurch is closed.

theking · 30 Oct 2017

I thought the Gidea Park stoppers were staying as 7 car into the high level at LST?

Wivenswold · 30 Oct 2017

theking said:
I thought the Gidea Park stoppers were staying as 7 car into the high level at LST?

The plan is for 4 tph from Gidea Park to Liverpool Street once the tunnel is open. To enable the 9 car 345s to fit, platform 18 at Liverpool Street will be decommissioned and 16/17 extended. So between the opening of the tunnel and completion of the platform remodelling only 7 car 345s or 2x4 car 315s will run. I guess that won't be decided until nearer the time, but it would make more sense to run them as 2 x315s so that the 345s can be lengthened and made available for the through service.

Thyper · 30 Oct 2017

Came through Abbey Wood at 16:15 today and was greeted with a Class 37 with a 7 carriage Class 345 train stabled just beyond the station. Unable to see number due to fencing along the line.

leomartin125 · 30 Oct 2017

Thyper said:
Came through Abbey Wood at 16:15 today and was greeted with a Class 37 with a 7 carriage Elizabeth Line set stabled just beyond the station. Unable to see number due to fencing along the line.

That was 345021, the first 9 car 345 to be delivered to the franchise. It commenced testing today in the tunnels around the Abbey Wood area. I'm trying to catch the 'first' one, 345020, which is sat at Crewe C.S. awaiting to be delivered by a loco to Maidenhead Carriage Sidings for Heathrow Branch ERTMS/ETCS testing. Although the last 345 to sit at Crewe, did so for several months... so I'm not holding my hopes up (though it was due to commence testing tonight and is still at Crewe so...)

D365 · 30 Oct 2017

Yeah I was going to mention I’m fairly confident that is a nine car unit.

leomartin125 · 30 Oct 2017

Still no sign of 345020 at Maidenhead. Was due to commence testing on the Heathrow branch for ERTMS/ETCS testing tonight, the path is currently activated but can't run as 020 is currently sat in Crewe C.S. as of last week. Wonder whether it will sit there for months like the last 345 up there, or whether it might actually turn up at Maidenhead this week!

matt_world2004 · 30 Oct 2017

leomartin125 said:
Still no sign of 345020 at Maidenhead. Was due to commence testing on the Heathrow branch for ERTMS/ETCS testing tonight, the path is currently activated but can't run as 020 is currently sat in Crewe C.S. as of last week. Wonder whether it will sit there for months like the last 345 up there, or whether it might actually turn up at Maidenhead this week!

Out of interest what diagram is this I wouldnt mind seeing it at heathrow junction

leomartin125 · 30 Oct 2017

matt_world2004 said:
Out of interest what diagram is this I wouldnt mind seeing it at heathrow junction

matthewmacleod · 30 Oct 2017

I saw 345011 failed at Liverpool Street this evening – it was supposed to form the 19:52, but the passengers were turfed out and it was taken out of service. I heard that it was also a 345 failure this morning that resulted in a few cancellations in to London.

Failures are to be expected of course

matt_world2004 · 31 Oct 2017

leomartin125 said:
It's night testing. At the moment the only diagram in place is a daily run to Old Oak, and tests between Old Oak and Paddington and Maidenhead throughout the night. Shown below.

Cheers

Class 345 progress

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