Class 442s - Now at the end of the road and to be withdrawn permanently

[CosherB]

Once all the 442s are in storage, will that leave in use any units using buck-eye couplings (unit to unit and not between coaches of a unit)? The only possible other one I can think of is the class 325s

Do you have a bit of a "coupling" fetish?

 

[trainmania100]

I saw 47812 dragging a 442 on Saturday, might first ever catch of this working, and probably my final too, as this is the only weekend working i have seen so far...

 

[RichardKing]

Yes it does. Stops at Gatwick, Haywards, Hassocks, Brighton.

No, the calling pattern is as followed:
London Victoria (06:06);
Clapham Junction (06:11, 06:12)
East Croydon (06:21, 06:23)
Three Bridges (06:41, 06:43)
Brighton (07:05)

 

[neilm]

These trains are falling apart. The Eastbourne service cancelled this morning because of doors, the Brighton service stuck in platform 2 at Haywards Heath right now with the same issue. Looks like southern sent the wrong ones into storage.

 

[RichardKing]

These trains are falling apart. The Eastbourne service cancelled this morning because of doors, the Brighton service stuck in platform 2 at Haywards Heath right now with the same issue. Looks like southern sent the wrong ones into storage.

2419 and 2421 were meant to be on 1F82 this morning. However, because of a door fault, they were sent up to Stewarts Lane (via Brighton, due to a signalling problem between Lewes and Keymer Junction) to have their doors seen to, and were later sent to East Croydon for 1B47. It looks like the door problem has reoccurred and, as you say, it's now blocking platform 2 at Haywards Heath.

I'd imagine that GTR aren't spending much money/time on fixing these units as they won't be on Southern for long, hence the large number of issues.

They always have 2401 and 2417 to fall back on, which are currently being stored in Eastbourne Sidings, if 2419 and 2421 have problems that can't be fixed overnight.

 

[swt class 450]

The 23:07 London Victoria to Brighton 00:03 service is formed a 12 coach 387/2 today (3x387/2) instead of the allocated 442. The announcements are also saying "Welcome aboard this Gatwick Express service to Brighton calling at Clapham Junction , East Croydon , Haywards Heath and Brighton" and repeating them in multiple languages despite being a Southern branded service.

 

[Class377/5]

The 23:07 London Victoria to Brighton 00:03 service is formed a 12 coach 387/2 today (3x387/2) instead of the allocated 442. The announcements are also saying "Welcome aboard this Gatwick Express service to Brighton calling at Clapham Junction , East Croydon , Haywards Heath and Brighton" and repeating them in multiple languages despite being a Southern branded service.

What allocated 442? It isn't booked for a 442. Monday was the first day of full 387/2 usage so of the diagrams I gave, only the two that goes to/from Eastbourne are booked 442 now.

 

[neilm]

Interesting morning the 07:32 from BTN went from 10 coaches to 5 coaches to cancelled. I guess they didn't fix the issue, and people on this forum think these trains should go to another toc :/
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

What allocated 442? It isn't booked for a 442. Monday was the first day of full 387/2 usage so of the diagrams I gave, only the two that goes to/from Eastbourne are booked 442 now.

The 07:33 from BTN to LBG and 17:57 LBG to BTN are 442s still.

 

[BestWestern]

I'd imagine that GTR aren't spending much money/time on fixing these units as they won't be on Southern for long, hence the large number of issues.

They always have 2401 and 2417 to fall back on, which are currently being stored in Eastbourne Sidings, if 2419 and 2421 have problems that can't be fixed overnight.

Have they ever spent much money/time fixing thesr units?! The strategy would appear to have been run them into ground from day one. Not something that SWT did, looking at the comparable performance at both TOCs. It's a very basic to grasp, yet some TOCs apparently don't - maintain a fleet and it will be reliable, or don't and it won't!

If the two spares have just been dumped in a siding somewhere and left to it, they'll probably be the least reliable of the lot.

 

[spark001uk]

No, the calling pattern is as followed:
London Victoria (06:06);
Clapham Junction (06:11, 06:12)
East Croydon (06:21, 06:23)
Three Bridges (06:41, 06:43)
Brighton (07:05)

Ah. OK, so it depends which 1A02 we're talking about, there's two. 0606 ex Vic, and 1815 ex Vic. Didn't think they repeated headcodes twice in a day on the same line. Mind you they are technically different operators.

 

[Class 466]

Ah. OK, so it depends which 1A02 we're talking about, there's two. 0606 ex Vic, and 1815 ex Vic. Didn't think they repeated headcodes twice in a day on the same line. Mind you they are technically different operators.

Repetition of headcodes across a day happens regularly everywhere. Especially where only one letter is used for both directions.

 

[Quakkerillo]

Interesting morning the 07:32 from BTN went from 10 coaches to 5 coaches to cancelled. I guess they didn't fix the issue, and people on this forum think these trains should go to another toc :/
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

The 07:33 from BTN to LBG and 17:57 LBG to BTN are 442s still.

Well, considering they're going to get rid of the 442's soon, and are making less and less use of them, I don't find it surprising that these units start to fail.
When they need maintenance, they'll just do the bare minimum needed, and won't invest heavily in repairing them to 'new' quality, as that's just throwing money at trains they're getting rid of anyway.
If they went to a TOC who'd be willing to keep them, and properly maintain them, I'm sure they could do still quite a few years.

 

[Smitham]

.....

 

[spark001uk]

.....

1757 LBG-BTN. There isn't a 1757 BTN-LBG.

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/W70329/2016/09/20/advanced

EDIT: OK, you spotted it.

 

[RichardKing]

Ah. OK, so it depends which 1A02 we're talking about, there's two. 0606 ex Vic, and 1815 ex Vic. Didn't think they repeated headcodes twice in a day on the same line. Mind you they are technically different operators.

Oh, sorry. I'm with you now!
There are quite a few headcodes which are repeated at different ends of the day. As long as the 06:06 1A02 departure isn't 12 hours late (something that wouldn't surprise me on GTR), it should be fine!

 

[yorkie]

.... Mind you they are technically different operators.

It's the same operator (GTR), see http://www.networkrail.co.uk/about/performance/ for a list of operators.

 

[387star]

seems odd any 442s are being retained at all with the 377s coming available

 

[swt_passenger]

seems odd any 442s are being retained at all with the 377s coming available

I agree. With all these additional 387s (originally a speculative batch) being ordered since the TSGN franchise was awarded, resulting in completely different 377 availability, I'd have thought the ongoing requirement for a few 442 operated services would cease sooner than the originally intended timescales.

There are quite a few good operational reasons not to continue with them.

I've suggested this previously, but replies usually insist original dates will be maintained.

 

[spark001uk]

It's the same operator (GTR), see http://www.networkrail.co.uk/about/performance/ for a list of operators.

Sorry yes same operator but under different sector I meant.

 

[neilm]

18:23 only 5 coaches, the problems go on.

 

[RichardKing]

18:23 only 5 coaches, the problems go on.

It must have been just one of the two units (either 2419 or 2421) that was causing the problems on 1F82 yesterday morning and 1B47 yesterday evening then.

The passengers of 1F82 will be in for a shock tomorrow morning!

 

[MatthewRead]

Didn't see any 442s at Clapham Junction today

 

[RichardKing]

Didn't see any 442s at Clapham Junction today

Unfortunately, you won't be seeing them there again (apart from when (or if) they are hauled through the SWT platforms on their way to Eastleigh, or if they are sent through Clapham Junction on their way to Stewarts Lane).

The 442s remaining on GTR until 2018 are, as of yesterday, off all Gatwick Express duties.

 

[talldave]

These trains are falling apart. The Eastbourne service cancelled this morning because of doors, the Brighton service stuck in platform 2 at Haywards Heath right now with the same issue. Looks like southern sent the wrong ones into storage.

No, they're all equally crap!

 

[RichardKing]

No, they're all equally crap!

Or, perhaps, it's GTR's maintaining of them that is not quite up to scratch!

 

[Surreytraveller]

Yes it does. Stops at Gatwick, Haywards, Hassocks, Brighton.

No it doesn't. Fast from East Croydon to Three Bridges. I think you're looking at a different 1A02.

 

[spark001uk]

No it doesn't. Fast from East Croydon to Three Bridges. I think you're looking at a different 1A02.

We've already established that.
(see previous page)

 

[neilm]

Eastbourne one 5 coaches this morning. Why are they not using the 2 spares?

 

[RichardKing]

Eastbourne one 5 coaches this morning. Why are they not using the 2 spares?

I wondered about that as well, but apparently those two units (2401 and 2417) are now off-lease and Eastbourne Sidings has a spare berth, hence why they're being stored there for the time being.

It would've been sensible for GTR to have kept a couple of spare 442s with them for this sort of issue. But, GTR is GTR...no hope! :roll:

 

[physics34]

Eastbourne one 5 coaches this morning. Why are they not using the 2 spares?

This overtook me at New Cross gate earlier and looked mighty packed!