Covid restrictions to end on 19th July

[yorksrob]

You’re probably right. But the figures speak for themselves - Sweden have had more cases/deaths than their neighbours. While they may have done a lot right, they have failed in other ways (like many places). So I don’t think we should be suggesting Sweden is the best country to look towards.

I think the point for me is that whilst they have made mistakes such as us (in terms of the care homes in particular), they've had far fewer damaging restrictions than we have, yet are in a better place in terms of illness than we are.

In regard to Sweden, they completely messed up when it came to care homes the same as us, otherwise I think they handled things pretty well. It’s worth remembering that they faced a lot of criticism and calls to “be like New Zealand” from people who tried to bully them into locking down, and at times I think they came close to losing their nerve hence statements like that made by their king.

Indeed. A lot of people had an agenda to suggest that Sweden's lighter touch approach was a mistake. Yet, here we are, a year and a half in, and their figures are frankly better than most of the heavily restricted countries.

 

[ChrisC]

From my observations of walking around, the amount of people "socially distancing" now when passing people in the street is very very few and far between. Hardly anyone is bothering with this nonsense now. I'd say it's about 99.7%. At times you still get the odd one or two who practically jumps out into the road when they see you approaching them. But near enough everyone is no longer socially distancing, as it's absolutely pointless!

I simply don't believe these polls that say as many as about 70% or even about 50% want restrictions to stay. Just no way can it be as high as those figures! IF face mask wearing in indoor settings/public transport does become optional from 19th July, just you see how many people will still be wearing them. Very very few people will I reacon! These polls will be proved extremely inaccurate! The vast majority of us have had enough of this nonsense dragging on for so long, and can't wait to ditch the things for good!

I agree with all that you say. The majority of people have had enough with all this nonsense and social distancing is all but over and people can’t wait to throw those masks away. I have complied right through these restrictions and have worn a mask where required, but after 19th July I will no longer wear one just to go in a shop or on an uncrowded bus or train. I might still keep one with me to wear if I was spending any time in a very overcrowded confined indoor space like if I was visiting London and using the tube in London at peak times. Perhaps that’s just being sensible.

During the last month I have had a couple of short breaks in very rural areas of Gloucestershire, Worcestershire and Herefordshire. I did notice that in some of the small towns there was far more social distancing and mask wearing taking place than I have seen for some time elsewhere. Most of the small independent shops had notices on the doors limiting the number of customers in the shops at a time to very small numbers. Many people were still social distancing when walking around the town and many elderly people were walking around the streets wearing masks. I certainly haven’t seen this sort of behaviour recently nearer to home in Nottinghamshire. I have never worn a mask outside and feel that some fresh air would have been far more beneficial to them than walking around the street wearing a mask.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

You've fallen for a typical bait and switch, we're interested in disease transmission, not droplet filtration effectiveness.

Well we are told that the Delta is more transmissible, maybe it is maybe it isn't, but given its govt propaganda then you manage transmission by trapping it at its source as best you can ie when it come out of your nose or mouth. My gripe with this isn't the masks its the fact test, track & isolate could create unintended outcomes and if they aren't going to change it before 16th August you need to suppress transmission hence the pitch for masks. However, i suspect there will be mass deletion of the app along with less people taking the test so the numbers won't increase as predicted so a balance will be struck that will help us come to terms with living with the virus.

Furthermore despite the recent increase in case rate/100k by 8 fold the impact on hospitalisation rates has been around 2.5-3 times so given its hospital admissions that are of primary concern they can will continue to be reassured.

So it would be extraordinary now for govt to change tack so all we will hear tomorrow is its jolly good idea to wear masks on a crowded train and if businesses want to put in there own arrangements that's up to them.

 

[greyman42]

I am also quite sure that people are gathering indoors at the moment in contravention of the current regulations.

They have been since Christmas.

 

[brad465]

Looks like tomorrow will see confirmation of July 19th unlocking happening:

Covid-19: PM urges caution as 19 July unlocking set to go ahead

Boris Johnson warns that Covid cases, currently at 30,000 a day, will rise as restrictions end.

www.bbc.co.uk

Prime Minister Boris Johnson is expected to confirm later the plan to lift almost all legal restrictions on social contact in England on 19 July.
But ahead of a news conference on Monday afternoon, Mr Johnson has urged people to be cautious.
"We must all take responsibility so we don't undo our progress, ensuring we continue to protect our NHS," he said.
He warned that Covid-19 cases, currently at about 30,000 a day, would continue to rise as society reopened.
The PM's news conference will present the latest data, with Downing Street saying that current modelling suggests hospital admissions, serious illness and deaths from Covid-19 will continue, but at a lower level than before the vaccination programme.
Number 10 said the delay in moving to the final stage of the roadmap out of lockdown, originally scheduled for 21 June, had allowed an additional 6.8 million first and second vaccine doses to be given out so far.

The government had also moved the expected end of restrictions closer to the school summer holidays, when transmission is likely to be lower, Downing Street said.
Mr Johnson said: "We are tantalisingly close to the final milestone in our road map out of lockdown, but the plan to restore our freedoms must come with a warning."
He said that vaccine roll-out had weakened the link between infections, hospital admissions and deaths, but added that the pandemic is "not over yet".
With cases set to rise as restrictions are lifted, "caution is absolutely vital", the prime minister said.
As well as the news conference, Health Secretary Sajid Javid is expected to announce the plans in Parliament.

 

[Skimpot flyer]

Pubs and restaurants seem to be getting less fussy about taking track and trace details.

I am also quite sure that people are gathering indoors at the moment in contravention of the current regulations.

My local KFC has had Dominic Cummings, Hat Man-Cock, Theresa May, Boris Gump, Jane Eyre and many others dining there, according to their records!
A garden barbeque / party in a suburb of a small Hertfordshire village had over 70 visitors, judging by the cars parked on grass verges nearby, on Saturday...

 

[Jimini]

Presser with BoJo, Whitty and Vallance confirmed for 1700 now. Javid statement in the Commons at 1530.

 

[kristiang85]

Presser with BoJo, Whitty and Vallance confirmed for 1700 now. Javid statement in the Commons at 1530.

I expect Whitty and Vallence to tell us to pretend we are still under restrictions right after Boris says it's going to be lifted as planned.

 

[greyman42]

I expect Whitty and Vallence to tell us to pretend we are still under restrictions right after Boris says it's going to be lifted as planned.

Fine by me, it gives people the choice of how they want to live their lives.

 

[brad465]

Presser with BoJo, Whitty and Vallance confirmed for 1700 now. Javid statement in the Commons at 1530.

I expect Whitty and Vallence to tell us to pretend we are still under restrictions right after Boris says it's going to be lifted as planned.

In some ways it's a surprise they managed to get them to do the conference alongside Johnson, as it's been believed they have refused in the past and one would think they'd do that if they really don't agree with whatever policy move is getting announced.

 

[trebor79]

I expect Whitty and Vallence to tell us to pretend we are still under restrictions right after Boris says it's going to be lifted as planned.

Fine by me, it gives people the choice of how they want to live their lives.

+1

 

[island]

Sajid Javid has confirmed in the House of Commons that the move to stage 4 is going ahead as planned from Monday 19th.

 

[Eyersey468]

Been confirmed the majority of restrictions will lift as planned, needless to say there are some on social media that are not happy about it.

 

[bramling]

Sajid Javid has confirmed in the House of Commons that the move to stage 4 is going ahead as planned from Monday 19th.

Anyone else thing Javid comes over much better than Hancock? The statement was quite well presented and defended. Finally something a bit positive from this government.

(I suspect that it things had gone differently last night we’d have had Boris jumping on the popularity bandwagon).

 

[Smidster]

Move to stage 4 confirmed but with a whole load of caveats.

For example Vaccine Passports are mandated in all but name.

Mad

 

[greyman42]

Move to stage 4 confirmed but with a whole load of caveats.

For example Vaccine Passports are mandated in all but name.

Mad

How do you mandate something in all but name?

 

[nlogax]

How do you mandate something in all but name?

Fudged, vague language.

 

[kristiang85]

Move to stage 4 confirmed but with a whole load of caveats.

For example Vaccine Passports are mandated in all but name.

Mad

I'm interested in seeing this report when it's published.

 

[Failed Unit]

Move to stage 4 confirmed but with a whole load of caveats.

For example Vaccine Passports are mandated in all but name.

Mad

Could you please provide more information on this please? To me it is like the masks, any business asking me to prove if I am vaccinated won't get my business as I don't like discrimination. Just want to see the detail as surely the government can't say no vaccine no entry - could you imagine if they say your are in a wheelchair you can't come in. (although many wheelchair users will argue this is the case now but that is a different debate)

The health secretary says the government is publishing a plan later showing its "safe and gradual approach" it is taking through summer.

It includes:

• encouraging business and large events to use vaccine passports in high risk settings
• using guidance for the clinically extremely vulnerable
• details of a review in September to asses preparedness for autumn and winter

Sajid Javid says it is "so important" people act with "caution and personal responsibility".

This includes:

• A gradual return to work if people are working from home
• trying to meet people outside where possible
• It is "expected and recommended" people wear face coverings in crowded indoor settings unless they are exempt

Source BBC

 

[greyman42]

Could you please provide more information on this please? To me it is like the masks, any business asking me to prove if I am vaccinated won't get my business as I don't like discrimination. Just want to see the detail as surely the government can't say no vaccine no entry - could you imagine if they say your are in a wheelchair you can't come in. (although many wheelchair users will argue this is the case now but that is a different debate)

This may sound like a daft question to some, but how do you prove you have been vaccinated?

 

[NorthOxonian]

Move to stage 4 confirmed but with a whole load of caveats.

For example Vaccine Passports are mandated in all but name.

Mad

Businesses are "encouraged" to use them.

But I doubt many will. If you own a nightclub, and the vast majority of your customers are too young to have had two doses of the vaccine, why would you potentially exclude the vast majority of your customers? Yes, I know a negative test is accepted in lieu of being "fully" vaccinated, but that's a lot more hassle (the email can take a couple of days to come through, for example - making spontaneous trips impossible).

 

[43066]

Anyone else thing Javid comes over much better than Hancock? The statement was quite well presented and defended. Finally something a bit positive from this government.

Yes absolutely. Javid seems competent and on top his brief, and has a good deal of gravitas. Hancock has always been too much of a dove and, let’s face it, his mind wasn't fully on the job.

Predictably stupid questions from Ashworth: “how high will hospitalisation go?”. (A bit like asking “how many lives have been saved by mandating masks?”).

 

[Failed Unit]

This may sound like a daft question to some, but how do you prove you have been vaccinated?

They expect you to prove it either via the NHS app or certificate. It was kicked into the long grass (correctly) as how would people from abroad know about this requirement and once they are here how would they get this evidence. I can access mine via the NHS app - but would refuse to out of principle to make a point to those that can't / won't / haven't got offered the vaccine. I thought this passport idea was killed off months ago.

 

[MikeWM]

Businesses are "encouraged" to use them.

Just like we were 'encouraged' to wear masks, and then when most of us didn't, they made it law.

So far this doesn't sound much like 'freedom'.

 

[johntea]

"Expected and recommended" is such an odd term and will cause confusion, why not just "recommended"...

 

[NorthOxonian]

Just like we were 'encouraged' to wear masks, and then when most of us didn't, they made it law.

So far this doesn't sound much like 'freedom'.

I think it's unlikely that any kind of "certification" system will be made law, at least not imminently, because it would be arguable that it is indirect age discrimination.

That might change in early September (by which point young people would have had the opportunity to get their second doses), but even then I think it's unlikely to be brought in.

 

[greyman42]

They expect you to prove it either via the NHS app or certificate. It was kicked into the long grass (correctly) as how would people from abroad know about this requirement and once they are here how would they get this evidence. I can access mine via the NHS app - but would refuse to out of principle to make a point to those that can't / won't / haven't got offered the vaccine. I thought this passport idea was killed off months ago.

So how long will it take to set up a system for issuing certificates?

 

[Failed Unit]

So how long will it take to set up a system for issuing certificates?

I am sure Matt Handcock has a friend ready to have them hand written. Seriously the current process is that you need to ask the doctor. If they were stupid enough to enforce this imagine the wasted hours the GPs would need to go through issuing these. I will be amazed if it happens, they GPs will be very unhappy and a 3rd party will cause lots of GDPR issues.

 

[Ediswan]

So how long will it take to set up a system for issuing certificates?

It already exists https://www.gov.uk/guidance/demonstrating-your-covid-19-status (that is for England)

 

[MikeWM]

That might change in early September (by which point young people would have had the opportunity to get their second doses), but even then I think it's unlikely to be brought in.

Unfortunately I see no reason to be optimistic about that. I've thought (and said) all along that this has been the purpose of much of what has happened over the past year or so. The fact that the idea keeps on being resurrected and slowly creeps along does nohing to persuade me that I've been wrong about that.

A 'papers please' society - whatever the nature of the papers - is not 'freedom'.