Crossrail - operating discussion and opening day 24th May

[Snow1964]

TfL Board Papers for next weeks Board meeting include a paper on Elizabeth line

1 Summary
1.1 This paper provides the status update of the Elizabeth line operations and on the readiness for further opening stages of the Elizabeth line railway including the remaining work on the Crossrail project.

https://board.tfl.gov.uk/documents/s18355/board-20220727-item06-Elizabeth-line-update.pdf

 

[Horizon22]

Has anyone else noticed the onboard screens seem to have a malfunction between Acton Mainline and Paddington, in both directions. They seem to go blank, not display anything and the announcements also fail. It then kicks back into life. Strange.

A known fault apparently awaiting another software update.

 

[345 050]

I wouldn't say so, no, it is a fair distance, partly over quite a narrow footbridge, and as I said earlier, much further from all the station facilities.

It used to be a very short walk from platform 14 to 15/16 H&C, however, the new fancy station entrance for LU means that the bridge ends at platform 14. Access to LU is now a bit of a walk back to gate line and then over the other bridge and into new LU station.

 

[Acton1991]

I have said it once and I’ll say it again.
Get rid of the useless, pointless irritant TfL staff on the platforms yelling into the microphone. It’s unbearable, and adds no further information to what the already very clear automated announcements offer.

Experienced it at Paddington again today. Staff shouting instructions down the tannoy and listing every destination of the train - it’s not needed and just turns into white noise. Hardly anyone listens anyway!

 

[J-2739]

Experienced it at Paddington again today. Staff shouting instructions down the tannoy and listing every destination of the train - it’s not needed and just turns into white noise. Hardly anyone listens anyway!

Paddington seemed to be the worst for this when I last took the line. The staff there also seemed to be the most highly-strung out of all the stations, and there were so many of them keeping an eye on things.

For such a beautiful station, there was such a hostile environment.

 

[trebor79]

Paddington seemed to be the worst for this when I last took the line. The staff there also seem to be the most highly-strung out of all the stations, and there were so many of them keeping an eye on things.

For such a beautiful station, there was such a hostile environment.

Yes I half noticed this the other week when I travelled. Someone bellowing a lecture about there being 27 doors on the train and please move down and use all of them. Pointless as
1. It wasn't that busy
2. You can move between cars anyway.

I suppose it must be a pretty sound destroying "job" so helps pass the time.

 

[DC1989]

I've seen at Canary Wharf staff listing every destination in deliberately slow language, I can only assume due to boredom

"The nexxxxxxxt Elizzzzzzzabeth lineeeee trainnnnn will be calling atttttt Whitechapellllllllll, Livvvvvverpoooool Streeeeeeet........."

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

I've seen at Canary Wharf staff listing every destination in deliberately slow language, I can only assume due to boredom

"The nexxxxxxxt Elizzzzzzzabeth lineeeee trainnnnn will be calling atttttt Whitechapellllllllll, Livvvvvverpoooool Streeeeeeet........."

It was exactly Canary Wharf where I pointed out someone like this. Awful.

 

[Taunton]

Do we have any understanding of which other sections of lines have been substantially relieved by Crossrail. I presume by the large crowds always at Paddington that the Underground there must be quieter - but which lines? Likewise are there other odd ones with less demand now, such as the DLR from Canary Wharf to Bank?

Regarding the poorly presented announcements (loads of them, eg manual announcements talking over automated ones), who manages the station staff. Are there supervisors, or even stationmasters of traditional form at each station? Have the announcements been imposed from above by someone, which the local management are not allowed to vary, and get performance-checked on their frequency?

 

[swt_passenger]

It used to be a very short walk from platform 14 to 15/16 H&C, however, the new fancy station entrance for LU means that the bridge ends at platform 14. Access to LU is now a bit of a walk back to gate line and then over the other bridge and into new LU station.

A route like you describe was retained in the original planning application, although the stairs to P15/16 would be removed anyway the footbridge would have still led out to the unpaid area quite near the new H&C gateline. It was a subsequent change to build an electrical equipment room at the H&C end of the footbridge.

I assumed at the time they used the electrical equipment as a reason to remove the cost of yet another small gateline and staff…

 

[JaJaWa]

I've seen at Canary Wharf staff listing every destination in deliberately slow language, I can only assume due to boredom

"The nexxxxxxxt Elizzzzzzzabeth lineeeee trainnnnn will be calling atttttt Whitechapellllllllll, Livvvvvverpoooool Streeeeeeet........."

I once watched a PSA(?) on the DLR randomly hitting the announcement buttons so it would output things like "The th th the next station is Canary Can Canary Can Canary Wharf"...

 

[Basil Jet]

I once watched a PSA(?) on the DLR randomly hitting the announcement buttons so it would output things like "The th th the next station is Canary Can Canary Can Canary Wharf"...

I did wonder what Norman Collier was doing these days.

 

[plugwash]

Went to a meeting the other day where it was discussed that Elizabeth line revenues are 210% of what was budgeted IE they are making double what they expected.

The big question I would ask is whether that was new revenue or revenue poached off other lines.

 

[Mikey C]

The big question I would ask is whether that was new revenue or revenue poached off other lines.

Agreed, otherwise it's meaningless.

Indeed the only "new" passengers for TfL I imagine are from Woolwich and Abbey Wood, at the expense of Southeastern

 

[JaJaWa]

Update from Bond Street, opening “before the end of this year”

 

[AlbertBeale]

Agreed, otherwise it's meaningless.

Indeed the only "new" passengers for TfL I imagine are from Woolwich and Abbey Wood, at the expense of Southeastern

It's real "new" revenue for the railways if there are people making journeys who wouldn't have travelled otherwise, or at least wouldn't have used rail for their trip.

 

[railfan99]

Today was the first time I was in the COS as a driver when it all went wrong with passengers. I was quite impressed with the service recovery vs what I had seen during trial running/ops. I left Abbey Wood around 25 minutes late at one point and with much shorter dwell times and maximum line speed running, I was back on time within two rounds.

Something I really noticed was how people really don't move along the train. The 2nd and 3rd carriages westbound were absolutely rammed whilst all the others had seats available. I did suggest via the PA may wish to move. No one did. Lol

How many minutes are typically allowed for your turnaround at termini?

I'm in Oz and should be on the line before the end of 2022, but as a driver, can you walk through the entire train when changing ends or do you have to step down beside the line and walk along the train?

It's real "new" revenue for the railways if there are people making journeys who wouldn't have travelled otherwise, or at least wouldn't have used rail for their trip.

Since worldwide, travellers compare perceived journey time by mode when deciding which one to use, there's every chance the Elizabeth Line is attracting new users who'd otherwise have travelled by private car (even though that might be challenging in London with your congestion charge and some narrow streets, plus what I believe is very expensive parking).

 

[Railwaysceptic]

The big question I would ask is whether that was new revenue or revenue poached off other lines.

That will also be the big question when HS2 is finally up and running.

 

[Horizon22]

Do we have any understanding of which other sections of lines have been substantially relieved by Crossrail. I presume by the large crowds always at Paddington that the Underground there must be quieter - but which lines? Likewise are there other odd ones with less demand now, such as the DLR from Canary Wharf to Bank?

Regarding the poorly presented announcements (loads of them, eg manual announcements talking over automated ones), who manages the station staff. Are there supervisors, or even stationmasters of traditional form at each station? Have the announcements been imposed from above by someone, which the local management are not allowed to vary, and get performance-checked on their frequency?

Paddington being busier might just continue to be the recovery of mainline services but also more people taking the Elizabeth line and changing at Paddington instead of taking the Central at Ealing Broadway which might be especially true in the recent hot weather! Perhaps more continue into Liverpool St instead of changing Stratford too. Others have reported the Jubilee being slightly quieter in parts as well.

As for station announcements, it appears they’ve been advised to do this at a senior level and encouraged by local managers although I’m sure over time this sort of behaviour will change as the travel on the line becomes normalised. It’s still relatively very new.

 

[Railwaysceptic]

Others have reported the Jubilee being slightly quieter in parts as well.

I'd take that with a pinch of salt. I been on the Jubilee twice in recent days and both times it was busy.

 

[Basil Jet]

Update from Bond Street, opening “before the end of this year”

Can't believe he said "Meh-Dee-See". How can anyone not know it's "Meh-Dee-Chee"

 

[JaJaWa]

Can't believe he said "Meh-Dee-See". How can anyone not know it's "Meh-Dee-Chee"

Oh the Medici Courtyard

 

[Basil Jet]

Oh the Medici Courtyard

Sorry, forgot to say thanks for posting the video.

 

[XAM2175]

The big question I would ask is whether that was new revenue or revenue poached off other lines.

That will also be the big question when HS2 is finally up and running.

I would note in relation to these points that a certain amount of 'poaching' (primarily from the Central line and southern WCML, respectively) is not only expected but actually desirable, as relieving the existing lines is part of the design rationale.

 

[Busaholic]

Can't believe he said "Meh-Dee-See". How can anyone not know it's "Meh-Dee-Chee"

A good place to sip a cappussino.

 

[ijmad]

A good place to sip a cappussino.

I prefer expresso

 

[matt_world2004]

The big question I would ask is whether that was new revenue or revenue poached off other lines.

I think a significant amount of it was the novelty of riding the Elizabeth line and the fact that there are now gatelines in the East and West which has caused perceived demand to increase . People are also making journeys that they would have otherwise not made because it is quicker

 

[Acton1991]

At my local station, Acton Main Line, it’s striking how much busier it is - there used to only be a handful of passengers waiting in rush hour, now I’ve witnessed 30/40. There must be attrition from other lines though, especially the Central lines.

 

[eisenach]

We needed to get from Lea Bridge, East London to Marylebone last week. We caught the nice new train to Stratford, then what still seems to be called TfL rail to Liverpool Street. Elizabeth Line / Crossrail to Paddington, whereupon we elected to walk the 13 minutes to Marylebone rather than fight with the Bakerloo.

I was very impressed with both TfL rail and the Elizabeth Line. At last something approaching European standards.

 

[Horizon22]

Paddington seemed to be the worst for this when I last took the line. The staff there also seemed to be the most highly-strung out of all the stations, and there were so many of them keeping an eye on things.

For such a beautiful station, there was such a hostile environment.

There's a lot there as several are involved in locking and sweeping the trains going into Westbourne Park - which at the moment is everything westbound every 5 minutes of course.

At my local station, Acton Main Line, it’s striking how much busier it is - there used to only be a handful of passengers waiting in rush hour, now I’ve witnessed 30/40. There must be attrition from other lines though, especially the Central lines.

I supposed Acton ML was always going to be a big shift - prior to the central section opening, the nearby Central Line from N. Acton was a more attractive option.