The UK is a democracy. Johnson is prime minister. Therefore he was democratically elected. QED.
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EU Referendum: The result and aftermath...
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The UK is a democracy. Johnson is prime minister. Therefore he was democratically elected. QED.
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Except, of course, that we don't elect a prime minister. The PM doesn't even need to be elected as an MP.
Johnson is a chancer, an opportunist. I've never been particularly convinced he's actually a Leaver. He is however doing things that are popular with his party (and a substantial amount of people of other parties)
If things go wrong, it will be someone else's fault. He's a politician.
Exactly. I don't remember the remoaners complaining when Blair was prime minister.
Elected by the votes of 92,153 tory party members. That's not democracy.
Who else should elect the leader of the Tory party?
Struner
Member
Of course! & honour the Good Friday Agreement! As the uk will stand by it’s word!
Although we don't directly elect a PM, whoever are the party leaders and would become PM play a big part in how we vote. The country did not vote for Johnson.
I do remember some scathing criticism of Brown, when he took over from Blair without a general election.
In particular, from, uh, Johnson...
https://www.newstatesman.com/politi...how-boris-johnson-described-gordon-brown-2007
Struner
Member
Lol
krus_aragon
Established Member
The trouble is that Boris Johnson is one of six hundred and fifty that we democratically elect. Why is he to be the one to decide the others are getting in the way of democracy? He is Prime Minister because he is presumed to hold the confidence of Parliament, but Parliament has only sat for a whole seven hours (on the 25th of July) since came into office.
Regardless, if that conclusion were reached, I think the correct way of dealing with those who are "getting in the way of democracy" is to dissolve Parliament, and go to the people for another General Election. (That's not as easy to do now though, since the Fixed Term Parliaments Act.) Using an extended prorogation to hamper the efforts of the opposition is a rather underhanded political manoeuvre. The opposition may well be seeking to undertake equally underhanded actions, but they don't do so from a position of power.
In the conventional Westminster System, the Prime Minister gains authority from commanding the support of Parliament. And the Members of Parliament gain their authority by being selected by the electorate. Traditionally, referenda haven't been part of the system at all. But we now have the strange situation where the electorate gave one view during a referendum, and then selected a Parliament that holds an opposing view. Add on the fact that the recent coalition government made it harder for Parliaments to be dissolved early, and that's the root of the constitutional crisis that's been simmering away for the past few years.
Struner
Member
Indeed!
Not surprising as liars are normally hypocrites as well.
The thing with Gordon Brown is that he wasn't a nutter, wasn't going to do anything drastic and in most ways was good for this country, plus he managed to get us through a pretty bad financial crash/recession (which the conservatives seem hell bent on returning us to), Boris Johnson? he isn't even good enough for the bin.
Bantamzen
Established Member
I present you Boris Johnson, his merry band of cabinet members, and all those leavers rooting for a no deal scenario....
That's a long way of saying you don't want to honour the democratic will of the people.
The Good Friday Agreement v Democracy. Democracy wins. Good night.
krus_aragon
Established Member
The Queen's set the date. She's only allowed to act on the advice given to her, and the current Prime Minister isn't likely to change his mind.
I don't believe that the date can be changed once Parliament is prorogued. If a different Prime Minister came along before then, and gave differing advice, it may be practical to cancel the proroguing. But don't quote me on that.
The other option that I've heard mentioned is a "Humble Address to the Queen", which would be a message from Parliament as a whole (following a vote on its contents). As the Prime Minister acts with the support of Parliament, having Parliament override him could lead to an even more interesting political situation.
Struner
Member
We all know that the uk’s current pm cannot be trusted. So what’s the point of concluding whatever kind of treaty?
In that case we can stop this thread and just leave with no deal.
Struner
Member
Good luck to you then. But I’m not sure everyone agrees.
At least the good people of NI will be able to look for bombs attached to the bus you just threw them under...
At least the good people of NI will be able to look for bombs attached to the bus you just threw them under...
It's not me putting bombs under anything. The British government have said they will never impose a hard border in Ireland. It's the EU who want to do it.
AlterEgo
Veteran Member
I don't think sarcasm or irony translates well in this medium.
I don't see any sarcasm or irony here.
Quite right. The GFA was not accepted by referenda held in Northern Ireland and Ireland on the 22nd of May 1998 with "yes" votes of 71% and 94% respectively while a decision to leave the EU without a deal was made by the UK electorate on....no, wait a minute!
Who were the "Remoaners" when Blair was Prime Minister?
Are you arguing that another country should be able to block the UK leaving the EU?
Exactly.
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