You have twice said that it's unlikely for a gateline staff member to say that they never give permission because you've seen it done on TV.To quote you from earlier, that isn't what I said. Though it's what you wanted to read.
You have twice said that it's unlikely for a gateline staff member to say that they never give permission because you've seen it done on TV.To quote you from earlier, that isn't what I said. Though it's what you wanted to read.
You have twice said that it's unlikely for a gateline staff member to say that they never give permission because you've seen it done on TV.
But the question being asked isn't "Is verbal permission ever given by anybody in the railway industry, ever?" The question being asked is "Did you give verbal permission?" To which the answer, quite legitimtely, could be "No."Therefore to deny verbal permission is ever granted is not very realistic.
But the question being asked isn't "Is verbal permission ever given by anybody in the railway industry, ever?" The question being asked is "Did you give verbal permission?" To which the answer, quite legitimtely, could be "No."
So, you are suggesting that a magistrate should ignore the sworn testimony of a witness saying that they didn't do something because "I saw someone on TV do it"?However we are discussing the usual situation, not the one theoretical member of staff out of thousands that probably doesn't exist.
It seems odd that you'd even ask a member of staff that question as you'd expect to be told no
How many angels can dance on the head of a pin? Does rail travel need to get so complicated; I appreciate that people who have bought cheap train specific tickets shouldn't get away with using a different train, but surely the penalty could be restricted to paying the difference between the fare paid and the fare (as at the time of the original booking)
for the train he did travel on?
Blimey - what a thread!
Surely all this depends on what was said at the barriers? So did the chap say "is that the next London train", or did he say "is that the next London train? Can I travel on this ticket which is for the later service"?
Some TOCs now ask staff not to give permission for things that can make things hard for other staff,
hard to believe at all.and I would find it hard to believe staff would say you could use a ticket on the wrong train.
Because some people wave their hands around as they speak.
It isn't exactly uncommon to ask for directions and someone tell you and point at the same time.
Indeed, but this wasn't somebody asking for directions. It was somebody asking for permission which one would normally expect to require an exchange of words.
We are all groping in the dark since we weren't there but it struck me as odd that the passenger used the expression "waved through" rather than "I asked permission, and the Inspector agreed".
One large TOC asks staff not to freely authorise travel quite possibly because of the many examples posted on here. Staff should direct people with enquiries of this nature to a ticket office, or revenue staff. The reason is that their supposed goodwill can often create major problems for colleagues later on.
I realise in this case gateline staff are revenue but of course we don't know what definitely happened here. And it might have been agency staff, who are most likely to say anything. Not that the customer has any reason to care.
I appreciate that people who have bought cheap train specific tickets shouldn't get away with using a different train, but surely the penalty could be restricted to paying the difference between the fare paid and the fare (as at the time of the original booking)
for the train he did travel on
Not this again.
Where’s the disincentive there?
You shouldn’t travel on trains your ticket isn’t valid for. If the worst that could happen is the company charge you for the difference *only when you are discovered*, why on Earth would anyone buy the right ticket in the first place?
Not this again.
Where’s the disincentive there?
You shouldn’t travel on trains your ticket isn’t valid for. If the worst that could happen is the company charge you for the difference *only when you are discovered*, why on Earth would anyone buy the right ticket in the first place?
You can't conceive a situation where someone shows the gate line staff their tickets and says can I use these tickets on the XX:XX to Y, and the member of staff tells them it is that one over there, pointing at it.
Now to the customer they have been given permission, but did the member of staff actually hear the question.
I'm trying to recall what happens at Lime Street for Virgin departures (which I use several times a year) and my impression is that, although VT staff are present, they usually don't check tickets.
What you post makes sense, but some people have less devious minds, and indeed more patience, hence why this type of post will continue to appear.
I think you'll find the people trying to get around paying the correct fare are the people with most devious minds, hence why the suggested solution won't work!
I think you'll find the people trying to get around paying the correct fare are the people with most devious minds, hence why the suggested solution won't work!
So how does that stop people buying the cheapest ticket and take the chance? Since there's no financial penalty under your scheme. And if their ticket isn't checked they get away with it ...
This 'simple solution' gets posted every few weeks in the regular threads about advance fares, and I really do think that people just don't think it through. The suggestion was also made by someone else a couple of weeks back and rebutted by me and others around about post #53...
Perhaps examination of tickets and enforcement of restrictions at the barrier would assist in sorting the deliberate (who will find a way through) from the accidental.
Impossible in the case of CCST tickets as there is no spare capacity on the magnetic strip for such coding. In any event, it would require a rework of barrier software as well and would raise many questions about how it could be reasonably enforced and communicated. Perhaps wider use of the Blackpool North system of not letting anyone on to a platform until a set (and generally rather limited) time before departure might work. However, I am not seriously proposing that.Better yet time stamp advance tickets somehow so that they will not open barriers until X minutes prior to departure. I have no idea how easy this would be to engineer.