HST Preservation?

[Thunderer]

With the Iconic "Inter-City 125" getting ever nearer to it's "end of life", are there plans to preserve a working example? - Perhaps with the original Paxman Valenta engines and in it's original 1970's livery?

 

[GatwickDepress]

The excellent 125 Group states their "ultimate aim is to preserve an example of this fine train after the end of its working life."

How realistic it'll be for one to be preserved by them when the push comes to shove, I have no idea.

 

[starrymarkb]

They've also acquired a Valenta for noise and soot purposes IIRC

 

[Yew]

I Imagine they will be quite a few on Heritage railways. Maybe some re-valenta-ed but (Funded by selling the MTU's and VP185's) And I think there will certainly be plenty of MK3 coaching stock around..

 

[JoeGJ1984]

I'd like to think they'll still do mainline railtourss at 125mph (afterall, they are called the intercity 125!)

 

[Murph]

I'd imagine that the savvy charter and rail tour operators will try to snap up as many complete sets as they can afford to, if they have any sense. Creating generator vans to allow the use of HST Mk3s on other locos might be relatively easy and feasible as well, since the HST ETS is standard industrial 415VAC 3 phase, isn't it?

Demand for tours on them might take a few years to build, but I'd be amazed if they didn't become popular for tours once they are no longer in daily service, given how successful and iconic they proved to be.

 

[gazthomas]

Just need to paint them blue and grey and they will come!

 

[duesselmartin]

Germany certainly showed how difficult is to retain that type of train.
Efforts to retain a VT11.5 or ET403 have failed so far on cost and storage of such a lenghty train

 

[starrymarkb]

Is there enough of a market for multiple sets doing tours. The more casual railtourer would rather have fine dining behind a kettle. Are there enough HST cranks to sustain it or will we end up with another load of Class 37s fighting for limited funds and market?

Maybe preserve one or two sets and leave room for something more interesting that might otherwise be lost.

 

[cjmillsnun]

Just need to paint them blue and grey and they will come!

Blue and grey, or in InterCity Swallow livery. That said, I can't see more than about 3 full sets being preserved, with perhaps one other set donating its coaches, 1 PC and the 3 phase gear to go with 41001.

I suspect the 125 group will preserve one set to mainline standard. It'll probably be a useful spot hire train to the TOCs as well as for charters.

 

[zn1]

they wont be going cheap, expect to pay the market price for them...not the scrap price...2 x serviceable locos with reasonable hours , 9 mk3, plus parts..wont get much change out of £250k, which is a price id put on em at the current moment..

 

[gazthomas]

Sounds like good value!

 

[starrymarkb]

Sounds like good value!

Purchase cost is only the start. Then you have to find somewhere large enough and secure enough to store it (ie Not Coventry Railway Centre). Get Alleys to move it (so that's 11 truck trips at a few thousand per trip?) - then you have to keep it in working order, restore the interior if you don't want the FGW/EC interior - also if you do restore then you probably won't be allowed on the mainline if you swap the seats back to IC70s (no Grandfather rights) etc etc

I wouldn't touch it with a barge pole

 

[Yew]

Purchase cost is only the start. Then you have to find somewhere large enough and secure enough to store it (ie Not Coventry Railway Centre). Get Alleys to move it (so that's 11 truck trips at a few thousand per trip?) - then you have to keep it in working order, restore the interior if you don't want the FGW/EC interior - also if you do restore then you probably won't be allowed on the mainline if you swap the seats back to IC70s (no Grandfather rights) etc etc

I wouldn't touch it with a barge pole

The EMT sets still have IC70's in them

 

[starrymarkb]

The EMT sets still have IC70's in them

Then the question is what condition are they in A preservation movement ideally needs the best mechanical condition they can get!

 

[Manchester77]

I'd be shocked if a power car wasn't put into the national collection and put on display in York

 

[plastictaffy]

They already have one........ Yes, I know it's not a production one, but the the prototype one is (arguably) just as important. I for one would buy a ticket for a railtour on an HST - but only if the powercars had the screamin' Valenta's in them. And there's plenty of guys at my depot who'd do the same.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
And of course, the East-West rail project is going ahead, that will need rolling stock. HST from Oxford to Sheffield via the Marston Vale line, anyone??

 

[43074]

The HST Charters by EMT/UK Railtours are very popular, and as a result there are more planned this year. When most of the fleet is retired, I see no reason why they couldn't become more popular, especially with a ''heritage'' feel.

 

[cjmillsnun]

Then the question is what condition are they in A preservation movement ideally needs the best mechanical condition they can get!

Condition was very good last time I was on one. However under the solebar, who knows. I doubt they are too bad though.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Condition was very good last time I was on one. However under the solebar, who knows. I doubt they are too bad though.

The HST maintenance teams at Neville Hill were chosen to restore the NRM's prototype car, so I can't imagine the EMT sets will be in worse condition than the FGW ones that get a regular supply of salt water to the undercarriage! In any case, the bogies are fairly simple to switch if you have access to a facility, I presume.

 

[anthony263]

I do hope we have one in Intercity swallow livery with the old interior especially if we can get a hst railtour up the heart of wales line again

 

[yorksrob]

Definately InterCity swallow for me. Shame they don‘t do heritage liveries on service trains any more.

 

[43167]

The HST maintenance teams at Neville Hill were chosen to restore the NRM's prototype car, so I can't imagine the EMT sets will be in worse condition than the FGW ones that get a regular supply of salt water to the undercarriage! In any case, the bogies are fairly simple to switch if you have access to a facility, I presume.

Apart from the really big jobs, like power unit swap, much of the work on 41001 has been done by the 125 Group.

1 set has been designated for the national collection.

 

[David Goddard]

Would like to think that 43002 would go to the NRM, either restored to original livery or in that in which it retires.
Then would hope that at least two other sets get preserved, and be available for charters or hire work. I would certainly pay for an HST tour in ten-twenty years time, and I suspect that a large number of others would too!

 

[455driver]

43002 back in original condition/ livery and 43197 in final condition/ livery. A N other one in an intermediate livery and a VP185 inside.

I have a feeling that some will find other work as well.

 

[route:oxford]

We've done this before.

The HSTs were left languishing for years before Grand Central arranged refurbishment.

Will it truly be any different this time?

The only change is that we now know there is potential for the Mk3s to be upgraded to include power-dooors.

 

[yorksrob]

The only change is that we now know there is potential for the Mk3s to be upgraded to include power-dooors.

If we‘re talking about preservation for enthusiasts, that would rather ruin the ambience.

 

[GatwickDepress]

43002 back in original condition/ livery and 43197 in final condition/ livery. A N other one in an intermediate livery and a VP185 inside.

I have a feeling that some will find other work as well.

Cue enthusiasts' plans for HST sets to replace units on regional expresses.

 

[Techniquest]

Cue enthusiasts' plans for HST sets to replace units on regional expresses.

I'm sure they'd be welcome on the CrossCountry network too, extra capacity where it's badly needed. Then when ATW need extra capacity out of Cardiff on rugby days as they badly, badly needed it recently, then pack them over there for the day to shift all the rugby fans to West Wales and back up the Marches!

As for preserving an HST, crikey that was well underway long before I packed in my HST bashing days in January 2010! Not a clue how many Valentas they've still got, but the 125 Group did get a load in while they still could, same for cooler groups and all that. What they've done in the 5 or 6 years since my membership with the group expired I have no idea for sure, but in that time a lot will no doubt have been done.

I have little doubt they'll prove popular on railtours and the like in the future, indeed I'll be happy to see that happening. The current EMT HST tours are all fine and good, but they always start on the MML, plus it's VP185s which is just not even close to the same thing as a 'proper' HST. Get a pair of power cars on a 2+8 set, pack them with Valentas, NA-256 turbos and Marston coolers and then we're talking 'proper'! Well, so long as they're on a decent route with a good path and the right driver at least.

Whatever happens, I'd certainly like to see 'my' machine kept but it's still years off yet.

 

[AnonymousUser1]

41001 is preserved all ready - 125 group / project Miller ... and living at Ruddington it;s not that far from Brush etc - the GCR is potentially a good home for a preserved 125 given the location and the length of 'main line' that will be availalbe once the gap is bridged ...

much of the rest of the fleet is still in use ...