Jeremy Corbyn & Tom Watson elected leader and deputy leader of the Labour Party

[DarloRich]

Copeland was an extremely long held seat by the Labour Party, more that a decade prior to my birth. The result of this by-election showed:-

Conservative.....13,748....44.2% of the vote (up by 8.5%)
Labour..............11,601....37.3% of the vote (down by 4.9%)

Swing from Labour to the Conservative....6.7%

Shameful. Corbyn is to blame but his clown town supporters will blame one or more of the following

• A speech by Tony Blair
• Tony Blair
• Blairites
• Lib Dems / third party votes
• Jamie Reed
• MSM (?)
• Zionists
• BBC bias
• Chicken coups
• Farage
• Murdoch/Dacre/Barclay Bros
• "The Establishment"
• Weather
• Red Tories
• Weather
• unique circumstances brought about by the nuclear industry.
• fake news around the position of JC on nuclear
• labour abandonment

Essentially everything and anything BUT the fact their man is an absolute disaster, a massive joke, toxic with the electorate, utterly ill equipped to lead a major political party and incapable of expressing an attractive policy agenda and thus winning a general election.

Despite all their wibbles about mandate it is clear that he will never obtain a mandate form the one group that counts - the general electorate.

GO NOW.

 

[Clip]

Mcdonnell was trying to blame the loss on misinformation put forward by the Tories on BBC breakfast this morning. Was amusing.

 

[DarloRich]

Mcdonnell was trying to blame the loss on misinformation put forward by the Tories on BBC breakfast this morning. Was amusing.

anything but the truth...................

 

[yorksrob]

One factor that hasn't so far been mentioned in the Copeland by-election is the position of the Tory party itself. If Mrs May does take that party further from the open market free for all 'everything for sale' economic model that both parties have espoused for the past thirty years, they might find themselves nearer to the centre ground than I would have expected a year ago.

Corbyn or no Corbyn, I'm pretty sure that Cameron and Osborne wouldn't have won Copeland.

 

[northwichcat]

Stoke Central - Held more although the incompetence of UKIP and their alternative truth spreading leader than a broad acceptance of the Cobynian policy agenda

Copeland: Lost. A solid labour area since the 1930s, somewhere the governing party plan to close the hospital and maternity unit and has suffered great public service cuts. Votes Tory. Lost by Corbyn

Corbyn - Go. Now.

Corbyn will go on about how he twice won significant majorities in leadership elections and claim that gives him a mandate to continue to lead the party. In his opinion he can't be wrong and it's the public who are misinformed if they disagree - he's a left wing version of Thatcher.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Corbyn will go on about how he twice won significant majorities in leadership elections and claim that gives him a mandate to continue to lead the party. In his opinion he can't be wrong and it's the public who are misinformed if they disagree - he's a left wing version of Thatcher.

Ever get the feeling that the Conservative Party hope that Jeremy Corbyn stays in power for ever and ever and ever.....

 

[Dave1987]

Ever get the feeling that the Conservative Party hope that Jeremy Corbyn stays in power for ever and ever and ever.....

Paul as appalling as the Labour Party are currently the Tories have their own problems. Remember they lost the Richmond by election so Copeland merely gets them back to the parliamentary majority they had originally. Labour were very unlikely to win in Copeland because of Corbyns stance on things like nuclear power. The Labour leadership need to admit they are destroying their party but Mrs May needs to admit she is presiding over a deeply divided country and her decisions could result in thousands of job losses. Trouble is is that Labour are in no position to hold May to account. The sweetheart deal for Surrey has been swept under the carpet and the NHS is in utter crisis, Labour should be strolling to a comfortable opinion poll lead.

 

[jon0844]

Ever get the feeling that the Conservative Party hope that Jeremy Corbyn stays in power for ever and ever and ever.....

The fact that Cameron actually said Corbyn should go because he believed in a strong opposition says it all. Behind closed doors the Tories must be chuffed. In particular May, who is pretty quiet and most be happy not to have anyone questioning her (well, more than once a week).

God knows we need the left to stop the extreme right wing feeling as emboldened as they do right now. Playing right into the hands of UKIP. It's more likely the fact that UKIP and Farage are associated with Trump that has made some people reconsider.

 

[Dave1987]

The fact that Cameron actually said Corbyn should go because he believed in a strong opposition says it all. Behind closed doors the Tories must be chuffed. In particular May, who is pretty quiet and most be happy not to have anyone questioning her (well, more than once a week).

God knows we need the left to stop the extreme right wing feeling as emboldened as they do right now. Playing right into the hands of UKIP. It's more likely the fact that UKIP and Farage are associated with Trump that has made some people reconsider.

Totally agree there.

 

[miami]

Ever get the feeling that the Conservative Party hope that Jeremy Corbyn stays in power for ever and ever and ever.....

For party loyalists perhaps. I would far rather see a Blairite Labour and a Cameronite Tory party as the two parties, than a Mayite Tory and Nuttallite UKIP

These two elections weren't victories for Conservative/Labour though, there were losses for Labour and UKIP.



For excuses, seen on social media:

If Labour has been 'in a mess' it is certainly not due to Jeremy Corbyn's leadership. He represents the overwhelming majority of the party membership and they support his policies. He repeatedly gets the better of May at PMQ's. If you want to locate the source of the mess - look at the ambitious spoilers on the periphery - where Blair, Watson and their Tory-appeasing ilk have been trying to undermine party democracy without evidence of any popular support. Do you suppose Blair and his city slickers would reverse Tory intentions regarding the softly - softly sell-off of the NHS? If Labour encounter difficulties reassuring the electorate it can be trusted - that is entirely due to Balir's legacy - eagerly assisted by an unscrupulous Tory media.

Non so blind that will not see. Blair is the only non Conservative party leader to gain a majority of seats in the commons since the 70s. To have voted in a Labour PM that wasn't Blair you'd have to be in your 60s.

The country has no appetite for corbyn's politics, regardless who is to blame. Sadly a continuation of the Conservative sell off is inevitable until 2025, unless somehow the lib dems can regain enough seats in England in 2020 to force a coalition.

 

[ainsworth74]

Does so much of the Labour Party membership really not realise that if they're going to get anywhere they have look outside of their own Party? It's all well and good having a Party leader who is very popular with the Labour membership but that will count for nothing if he can't win over non-party members!

 

[Tetchytyke]

Stoke Central - Held more although the incompetence of UKIP and their alternative truth spreading leader than a broad acceptance of the Cobynian policy agenda

To an extent I agree, but don't dismiss the result that easily. UKIP were gunning for that seat, and it'll take them a while to regroup from it.

Copeland: Lost. A solid labour area since the 1930s, somewhere the governing party plan to close the hospital and maternity unit and has suffered great public service cuts. Votes Tory. Lost by Corbyn

I'm not sure how much you can genuinely pin on Corbyn. Troughton, the Labour candidate, is vehemently anti-Corbyn and voted for Owen Smith as leader. I know people from Whitehaven aren't the brightest, but rescuing Labour from Corbyn by voting against an anti-Corbyn candidate doesn't quite seem the best solution.

Whilst we talk of Copeland as a "Labour heartland", it's slightly more complicated than that. It used to be a Labour heartland. But since 2010 it has included the town of Keswick, a town as blue-blood Tory as they come, and that's seen Labour's vote share drop from 51% under Jack Cunningham down to 40% under Jamie Reed and now 38% under Gill Troughton.

The 2010 boundary changes turned it into a marginal constituency. It's not the catastrophic failure the press are so desperate to claim.

And no, I still don't think Corbyn is right for leader.

 

[Dave1987]

Does so much of the Labour Party membership really not realise that if they're going to get anywhere they have look outside of their own Party? It's all well and good having a Party leader who is very popular with the Labour membership but that will count for nothing if he can't win over non-party members!

Indeed the Labour Party seem to have forgotten why Blair won those elections so convincingly. If they continue on the way they are going now they may not be the main opposition party in the future. They need to appeal to the wider electorate, the middle ground. If they don't face up to the facts that under Corbyn they are highly unlikely to win the next GE they face obliteration in 2020. What is so frustrating is that without an effective opposition the extremists in the Tory party will ruin our country.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Indeed the Labour Party seem to have forgotten why Blair won those elections so convincingly. If they continue on the way they are going now they may not be the main opposition party in the future. They need to appeal to the wider electorate, the middle ground. If they don't face up to the facts that under Corbyn they are highly unlikely to win the next GE they face obliteration in 2020. What is so frustrating is that without an effective opposition the extremists in the Tory party will ruin our country.

It does seem that the extremists in the Conservative Party are not viewed in the same way as the extremists in the Labour Party are. Momentum seem to be far more of the "fruitcake" variety than the 1922 Committee.

 

[yorksrob]

It does seem that the extremists in the Conservative Party are not viewed in the same way as the extremists in the Labour Party are. Momentum seem to be far more of the "fruitcake" variety than the 1922 Committee.

They've outsourced their fruitcakes to right wing think tanks, such as the Institute of Economic Affairs, amongst others.

 

[Domh245]

The country has no appetite for corbyn's politics, regardless who is to blame. Sadly a continuation of the Conservative sell off is inevitable until 2025, unless somehow the lib dems can regain enough seats in England in 2020 to force a coalition.

I'd argue that it is more a case that they have no appetite for Corbyn. When polled, people agreed with a lot of his policy ideas, but Corbyn himself is the turnoff - be it for his incompetence, the skeletons in his closet, or whatever else.

 

[Howardh]

Labour party in turmoil, arguably the worst opposition party ever (Surely the SNP ARE the opposition??) with a leader that won't stand down even though he looks like he doesn't want to be there in the first place.

UKIP, an open goal in a Leave stronghold where a good vote would indicate to May that a hard Brexit should still be on the cards, and they even throw in their newly elected leader (although not sure who it is this week).

Result, UKIP still way behind. Time for them to turn the lights out and lock the door behind them, me thinks.

r

 

[Tim R-T-C]

I have heard Corbyn explain more times in recent memory why he shouldn't be leaving his position than actually giving any policies or addressing any issues relevant to the contemporary electorate.

Not exactly a recommendation.

 

[me123]

I'll agree with Howard. On paper, Labour may well be the opposition, but in practice the only people doing any real opposing are the SNP.

Not a good night for Labour. They lost Copeland, of course, but whilst they did hold onto Stoke they lost voters to the Kippers. And UKIP should have been hoping to win Stoke - whilst they gained votes compared to the General Election, it wasn't anywhere near enough. And they haemorrhaged votes in Copeland.

Quite sad to see a seat like Copeland go to the Conservatives at a time when they're presiding over the destruction of the NHS and incompetently leading us into a withdrawal of the European Union with no real plan. No wonder I've not really got any hope for the political future of the UK - the incumbents are incompetent; and the others are a combination of incompetent and insane.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

Whilst we talk of Copeland as a "Labour heartland", it's slightly more complicated than that. It used to be a Labour heartland. But since 2010 it has included the town of Keswick, a town as blue-blood Tory as they come, and that's seen Labour's vote share drop from 51% under Jack Cunningham down to 40% under Jamie Reed and now 38% under Gill Troughton.

The 2010 boundary changes turned it into a marginal constituency. It's not the catastrophic failure the press are so desperate to claim.

And no, I still don't think Corbyn is right for leader.

2015 local election results - Keswick (3 seats):

Labour Party Denstone John Thornton Kemp                898  
Labour Party Tony Lywood                              1041  Elected
Conservative Party Ronald Munby                   1139  Elected
Independent Martin Pugmire                            974  Elected
The Green Party Peter G R Rigg                        678  
Liberal Democrat Phill John Roberts                   661

If that's as 'as blue-blood Tory as they come' I'd love to see what a marginal seat looks like But it is true that the 2010 boundary changes did make the Copeland more marginal. However, that doesn't change that there was a substantial reduction in Labour's % vote and corresponding % increase in the Conservative vote, which cannot be interpreted in any way other than as terribly bad news for both Corbyn and Labour

 

[Busaholic]

I find it so depressing that there is no viable opposition to the Tory government which, after all, only 'won' the 2015 General Election by a whisker. When David Dimbleby on 'Question Time' could say last night without cracking his face that panellist Angela Rayner, an MP elected in that year, could be a contender for the leadership of the Labour Party anytime soon, without demur from her, reflects so badly on Labour's future prospects. If she really is seen as Labour's future, then the party will go the way of UKIP.

 

[Butts]

I find it so depressing that there is no viable opposition to the Tory government which, after all, only 'won' the 2015 General Election by a whisker. When David Dimbleby on 'Question Time' could say last night without cracking his face that panellist Angela Rayner, an MP elected in that year, could be a contender for the leadership of the Labour Party anytime soon, without demur from her, reflects so badly on Labour's future prospects. If she really is seen as Labour's future, then the party will go the way of UKIP.

Had they chosen David rather than Ed Miliband life could have been so different.

 

[AndrewE]

The press coverage of the Copeland result is crap. In fact what was a Labour marginal is now a Tory marginal seat. No coincidence that it was once held by one of the few right-wing pro-nuclear power Labour MPs.

I know Corbyn has always been anti-nuclear (which you might or might not agree with) but I'm amazed that the Labour party couldn't appeal to the nuclear industry workers:

We have dozens of nuclear power stations to decommission, and Sellafield itself will take decades if not centuries to clean up, so there is work there whether or not any more power stations are built.

The outsourcing of all sorts of work there will undoubtedly have encouraged contractors to cut corners to protect or expand their profits, whereas a permanent dedicated (i.e. re-nationalised) management would be the least likely to jeopardise workforce safety to protect profit margins. It must be one of the most secure jobs in the world, but the main driver has to be doing it right (for the health of the rest of us as well as the employees) rather than producing a return for shareholders.

 

[Trog]

The press coverage of the Copeland result is crap. In fact what was a Labour marginal is now a Tory marginal seat.

Very un-usual for a Government to win a seat off the opposition mid term, very much against the tide of how these things seem to work. The percentages not moving their way would be a bad result for Labour, losing should have the sirens and red flashing lights coming on at Labour HQ.

 

[miami]

Very unusual is putting it mildly. Arguably it's the first time for 130 years (the few others that have have been rather more unusual - the bbc has more http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39080605)

 

[muddythefish]

Had they chosen David rather than Ed Miliband life could have been so different.

Huge turning point for the country, with hindsight.

Miliband D would likely have won the 2010 election which would have saved us from 6 years of needless austerity under Cameron and Osborne and an unnecessary EU referendum.

 

[Dave1987]

The Labour Party at is at the moment would suffer a humiliation in the next GE. As much as the Labour Party core says that Corbyn represents exactly what they want and they want to purge their party of Blairites they need to realise they will never appeal to the wider electorate. Therefore unless Corbyn goes and goes quickly Labour will turn into a fringe party. As currently the Labour is on a self destruction course I hope that the Lib Dems can become the true centre party and bring the 48% of the country who voted remain together to provide a true opposition to the Tory extreme who want the hardest Brexit possible and want to pander to Trump. It's a shame that the more moderate Tory MPs won't speak out against what is currently happening to the country.

 

[ninja-lewis]

The outsourcing of all sorts of work there will undoubtedly have encouraged contractors to cut corners to protect or expand their profits, whereas a permanent dedicated (i.e. re-nationalised) management would be the least likely to jeopardise workforce safety to protect profit margins. It must be one of the most secure jobs in the world, but the main driver has to be doing it right (for the health of the rest of us as well as the employees) rather than producing a return for shareholders.

Sellafield Ltd is 100% owned and managed by HM Government.

As for the main driver being profits, one of the worst postwar records in that regard is HM Government. Nationalised industries and state corporations bled dry to fund public expenditure otherwise.

 

[miami]

Huge turning point for the country, with hindsight.

Miliband D would likely have won the 2010 election which would have saved us from 6 years of needless austerity under Cameron and Osborne and an unnecessary EU referendum.

Brown lost 2010. Ed Milliband lost 2015.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Does Jeremy Corbyn deliberately set out to dress in a manner, so often seen in outside locations, as Tramp-in-Chief...:roll: