Keolis/Amey to take over Wales and Borders

[Dai Corner]

Imagine at the next TfW board meeting you did a group exercise - draw a picture of train and then a flow diagram of how you do a journey from Aber to Aberystwyth.......

I imagine they'll only ever use Taffs Well, Cathays and Cardiff Bay stations, plus Flourish when that's built.

 

[Gareth Marston]

I imagine they'll only ever use Taffs Well, Cathays and Cardiff Bay stations, plus Flourish when that's built.

Are you saying they wont be using the station next to their new offices in Pontypridd?

 

[Dai Corner]

Are you saying they wont be using the station next to their new offices in Pontypridd?

Oh I haven't been keeping up and thought they were going to be co-located with the new depot at Taffs Well, but realise now they wouldn't want to be next to all that noise and have to share the canteen with fitters in dirty overalls.

 

[krus_aragon]

Imagine at the next TfW board meeting you did a group exercise - draw a picture of train and then a flow diagram of how you do a journey from Aber to Aberystwyth.......

5/X5 bus to Bangor and then T2 down to Aberystwyth, easy.

Oh, you mean that Aber...

 

[Gareth Marston]

Oh I haven't been keeping up and thought they were going to be co-located with the new depot at Taffs Well, but realise now they wouldn't want to be next to all that noise and have to share the canteen with fitters in dirty overalls.

High Viz orange with oil stains can be quite off putting....still there's probably some dedicated parking spaces for them to keep their executive cars in and not have to worry about rubbing shoulders with public transport users.....

 

[Gareth Marston]

5/X5 bus to Bangor and then T2 down to Aberystwyth, easy.

Oh, you mean that Aber...

That's one answer ( i'm sure it woudln't be the worst) Id love to get the A3 flip chart and the marker pens out ......

 

[adrock1976]

Regarding filling in the missing gaps between Shrewsbury and Aberystwyth and for summer extras along the Cambrian Coast, I have designed a possible timetable to see how it could look like in the following thread:

https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...n-with-clockface-departures-post-2020.169187/

 

[Cardiff123]

Is it normal when a franchise is ending for no Advance tickets to be available beyond the franchise end date?
No Advance tickets are available to buy for travel on Wales & Borders services from 14th October onwards.
I guess TfW/KA will be setting the price of Advance tickets from that date and obv they can't start selling those tickets until they are in charge?

 

[Gareth Marston]

Is it normal when a franchise is ending for no Advance tickets to be available beyond the franchise end date?
No Advance tickets are available to buy for travel on Wales & Borders services from 14th October onwards.
I guess TfW/KA will be setting the price of Advance tickets from that date and obv they can't start selling those tickets until they are in charge?

Spot on, no AP nor bookable seat reservations on anywhere in ATW land beyond the 13th October including SAILRAIL to Ireland.

 

[iantherev]

That's one answer ( i'm sure it woudln't be the worst) Id love to get the A3 flip chart and the marker pens out ......

Change at Cardiff Central and Shrewsbury. I did it often enough 35 years ago when I was a law undergraduate.

 

[uxm]

The Swansea 'ValleyLines' (or so I sometimes call them), do not currently have any passenger services. As things stand, they will NOT be getting even a diesel passenger service in the new franchise. For clarity, by Swansea 'ValleyLines' I mean the following routes:

• Swansea - Resolven - GlynNeath,
• Swansea - Crynant - Onllwyn
• Swansea - Llandarcy - Clydach - Pontardawe - Ystradgynlais
• Swansea - Gowerton - Gorseinon - Hendy Junc. - Glanaman - Gwaun-Cae-Gurwen

The last two have significant portions of track missing as well as having no passenger services; electrification is a long ways off I think (although, if the 'train testing facility' comes off it might make sense).

Swansea electrification is a victim of funding for rail infrustructure being 'non-devolved'. The Welsh Government are allowed to invest in rail infrustructure if they want, but there is no money for it in the block grant so technically investing in Welsh rail infrustructure is the UK government's responsiblity. That said, while I think cancellation of MML electrification is an unmittigated disaster, I think the (hopefully temporary) cancellation of electrification to Swansea may have a silver lining. If it had been wired, the masts may have stood in the way of increasing capacity between Cardiff and Bridgend, which is sorely needed including the ability for fast trains to overtake stopping passenger services.

Except Cardiff to the Severn Tunnel; that's the only Network Rail bit that will be getting wires in the currently-planned future.

I'm pretty sure they were killed off in the beaching axe and are abandoned.

 

[uxm]

Does anybody have any idea what rolling stock MTR was gonna use?

 

[PHILIPE]

Does anybody have any idea what rolling stock MTR was gonna use?

/www.railforums.co.uk/threads/keolis-amey-wales-future-rolling-stock.164954

 

[krus_aragon]

/www.railforums.co.uk/threads/keolis-amey-wales-future-rolling-stock.164954

That thread's mainly discussion about what KA was/is going to use, not MTR. Some of the early rumours mentioned (such as short HSTs on the NW coast) could reflect MTR's offerings, or just an over-active rumour mill.

 

[Cardiff123]

Does anybody have any idea what rolling stock MTR was gonna use?

Ex-DLR units in the Valleys and Manchester Metrolink M5000 units everywhere else?

 

[kieron]

Now one for someone locally to answer , if they can - there seemed to be no evidence of the green "Samaritan" notices (the ones that give the help line and advice on how to call them ,if help is needed) - they are pretty well everywhere in England (cannot speak for Scotland)

I can't speak for the Rhymney line, but they were added to the bottom line platforms at Shotton after a tragedy a couple of years ago. They painted yellow lines on the platforms around the same time. Perhaps the way the signs are used varies from one area to another, as I know of other places near Shotton which had them before then.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

I can't speak for the Rhymney line, but they were added to the bottom line platforms at Shotton after a tragedy a couple of years ago. They painted yellow lines on the platforms around the same time. Perhaps the way the signs are used varies from one area to another, as I know of other places near Shotton which had them before then.

Thanks - they should be everywhere - part of a national action plan I believe (which includes foot crossings etc)

 

[krus_aragon]

Thanks - they should be everywhere - part of a national action plan I believe (which includes foot crossings etc)

I remember hearing a young lad at Bangor station quizzing his mother why there weren't any yellow lines on the platform, like down in Cardiff. Only later did I realise that the existence of the platform loop lines was a likely explanation: non-stop traffic doesn't run next to the platform!

 

[Rhydgaled]

I'm pretty sure they were killed off in the beaching axe and are abandoned.

Not entirely abandoned, not the whole lot anyway, but no passengers services. Here's a breakdown:

• Swansea - Resolven - GlynNeath
  • Swansea High Street - Swansea Docks LINE LIFTED (if it ever existed)
  • Swansea Docks - Near Neath IN USE (freight only)
  • Near Neath - Cwmgwrach colliery TRACK EXISTANT (RealTime Trains suggests no trains)
  • Cwmgwrach colliery - GlynNeath LINE LIFTED
• Swansea - Crynant - Onllwyn
  • Swansea High Street - Swansea Docks LINE LIFTED (if it ever existed)
  • Swansea Docks - Near Neath IN USE (freight only)
  • Near Neath - Onllwyn (Coal Wash) IN USE (freight only)
• Swansea - Llandarcy - Clydach - Pontardawe - Ystradgynlais
  • Swansea High Street - Swansea Docks LINE LIFTED (if it ever existed)
  • Swansea Docks - Llandarcy IN USE (frieght only)
  • Llandarcy - Near Morriston IN USE
  • Near Morriston - Clydach - Pontardawe - Ystradgynlais LINE LIFTED
• Swansea - Gowerton - Gorseinon - Hendy Junc. - Glanaman - Gwaun-Cae-Gurwen
  • Swansea - Gowerton IN USE
  • Gowerton - Gorseinion - junction with Swansea District Line LINE LIFTED
  • junction with Swansea District Line - Hendy Junc - Pantyffynnon IN USE (including freight-only chord)
  • Pantyffynnon - Gwaun-Cae-Gurwen IN USE (freight only)
  
  
  With the exception of the route to Pontardawe/Ystradgynlais, the majority of each of these routes still has some track (generally freight only)

 

[uxm]

Not entirely abandoned, not the whole lot anyway, but no passengers services. Here's a breakdown:

• Swansea - Resolven - GlynNeath
  • Swansea High Street - Swansea Docks LINE LIFTED (if it ever existed)
  • Swansea Docks - Near Neath IN USE (freight only)
  • Near Neath - Cwmgwrach colliery TRACK EXISTANT (RealTime Trains suggests no trains)
  • Cwmgwrach colliery - GlynNeath LINE LIFTED
• Swansea - Crynant - Onllwyn
  • Swansea High Street - Swansea Docks LINE LIFTED (if it ever existed)
  • Swansea Docks - Near Neath IN USE (freight only)
  • Near Neath - Onllwyn (Coal Wash) IN USE (freight only)
• Swansea - Llandarcy - Clydach - Pontardawe - Ystradgynlais
  • Swansea High Street - Swansea Docks LINE LIFTED (if it ever existed)
  • Swansea Docks - Llandarcy IN USE (frieght only)
  • Llandarcy - Near Morriston IN USE
  • Near Morriston - Clydach - Pontardawe - Ystradgynlais LINE LIFTED
• Swansea - Gowerton - Gorseinon - Hendy Junc. - Glanaman - Gwaun-Cae-Gurwen
  • Swansea - Gowerton IN USE
  • Gowerton - Gorseinion - junction with Swansea District Line LINE LIFTED
  • junction with Swansea District Line - Hendy Junc - Pantyffynnon IN USE (including freight-only chord)
  • Pantyffynnon - Gwaun-Cae-Gurwen IN USE (freight only)
  
  
  With the exception of the route to Pontardawe/Ystradgynlais, the majority of each of these routes still has some track (generally freight only)

My point stands, the Beeching axe didn't only close routes it closes passenger services in non- profitable lines, Dr Beeching stated that.

 

[uxm]

here are some of the new franchise signs, Llandaf is the south wales metro sign and Prestatyn is the transport for wales sign.

 

[anamyd]

Good to see the first of the new signs. Would be nice if they replied to the email I sent them two weeks ago asking about how the audio announcements will change :-/

 

[sw1ller]

Noticed Heswall ont the Borderlands line had the new signs today too. Well, I say new signs.... it’s a sticker, but the effort is there I suppose.

 

[Gareth Marston]

Keolis confirm increased journey times on Crewe to Chester shuttle. Actual quote from Keolis.

https://www.dailypost.co.uk/busines...wales-trains-slower-15116084#comments-section

The trains will be introduced on the lines next year.

The only place where the reduced speed will increase travel times is on the Chester – Crewe shuttle.
A spokesman added: "The travel times will be increased by two minutes between 2019 and 2021, but this will not affect connections and outward travel, the timetable has been designed as such.”

 

[Bletchleyite]

2 minutes is neither here nor there provided the timetable supports it. Crikey, adding hustle alarms to Merseyrail units in the 1990s necessitated a 2 minute lengthening of the Ormskirk to Liverpool running time (as it slowed station stops by about 10 seconds each), and I suspect Maghull North has probably necessitated 1 or 2 more. I doubt anyone has really noticed.

 

[Gareth Marston]

2 minutes is neither here nor there provided the timetable supports it. Crikey, adding hustle alarms to Merseyrail units in the 1990s necessitated a 2 minute lengthening of the Ormskirk to Liverpool running time (as it slowed station stops by about 10 seconds each), and I suspect Maghull North has probably necessitated 1 or 2 more. I doubt anyone has really noticed.

Agree its not the end of the world however its good to have some detail confirmed from Keolis directly now were 5 weeks and less to the takeover.......

 

[craigybagel]

The current timetable only gives a 5 minute turnaround at Crewe. You can't move the departure from Chester earlier as the Manchester - North Wales arrives on Platform 3 around then (normally the shuttle has to wait for the arrival of this service before its cleared to depart platform 1). They'll have to push the departure from Crewe back which to be fair should work, though that will mean the current 9 minute turnaround at Chester will be cut down to 5, the same as Crewe. What that will do for reliability, on a service where luggage loads tend to be high, remains to be seen.

What also remains to be seen is how well they cope with running at full speed for 50 minutes out of every hour, for an entire day, with most trips carrying a heavy loading.

 

[sw1ller]

The current timetable only gives a 5 minute turnaround at Crewe. You can't move the departure from Chester earlier as the Manchester - North Wales arrives on Platform 3 around then (normally the shuttle has to wait for the arrival of this service before its cleared to depart platform 1). They'll have to push the departure from Crewe back which to be fair should work, though that will mean the current 9 minute turnaround at Chester will be cut down to 5, the same as Crewe. What that will do for reliability, on a service where luggage loads tend to be high, remains to be seen.

What also remains to be seen is how well they cope with running at full speed for 50 minutes out of every hour, for an entire day, with most trips carrying a heavy loading.

I would assume a lot of that 50 minutes will be coasting, so not a massive drain on the mechanics other than the rolling parts. Especially on the way to Chester as it’s very slightly more downhill.

I actually think the times will be similar to a 150 running on 1 engine. That manages to keep to the timings all day, speaking from experience.

 

[driver_m]

When are W&B starting road learning to Lime St? They'd best get cracking if they want to start in December. Or will this be quietly pushed back to May/December/God Knows?

 

[sw1ller]

When are W&B starting road learning to Lime St? They'd best get cracking if they want to start in December. Or will this be quietly pushed back to May/December/God Knows?

Good question, well presented....