London North Eastern Railway (LNER) First Class service

[MidnightFlyer]

...all the hot options on the all-day/evening menu rotations look appealing to me: steak pie, beef lasagne, fish and chips or sausage and mash.

Aye, good to see a back to basics approach - I think the above are a lot better and more enjoyable than the foreign-named minimalist meals that they (and other TOCs) attempt to serve.

it's as rare as hens teeth :cry:

I'm sure I've seen you use that phrase on here about 50 times before

 

[ainsworth74]

But it does seem you still only get two types, which change with each rotation.

Why not all eight at once, or even four from eight on the plate? That makes it more of a "selection".

Whilst I feel like a broken record at this point, the restaurant service was renowned for having the best cheese board available on any service train. The current one is, needless to say, a shadow of that.

 

[HST Power]

Looking at the menus in detail (CTRL and '+' zooms the page in, incidentally), this is the first time since the new offering was introduced that all the hot options on the all-day/evening menu rotations look appealing to me: steak pie, beef lasagne, fish and chips or sausage and mash.

I agree, it looks good to me. I've always enjoyed the sandwhiches on the All Day Offer but I hope I get to try the fish and chips, and the sausage and mash. Probably won't be travelling until February though. Shame!

Oh, and Butts, I thought of a way you could combat the lack of booze in First Class. You seem to travel fairly often so me thinks you must have a whole heap of East Coast Rewards, why not use them and get a free wine case?

 

[Butts]

I agree, it looks good to me. I've always enjoyed the sandwhiches on the All Day Offer but I hope I get to try the fish and chips, and the sausage and mash. Probably won't be travelling until February though. Shame!

Oh, and Butts, I thought of a way you could combat the lack of booze in First Class. You seem to travel fairly often so me thinks you must have a whole heap of East Coast Rewards, why not use them and get a free wine case?

Lack of Booze is not such a problem as the lack of Grub if you observe most of my posts

I haven't got a "whole heap" of points as being a "cheapskate" I get the cheapest Advanced Fares. I have not checked the redemption for the Wine but if it's as poor value as 500 points for a £10 M&S Voucher I'll give it a miss

Actually I'm going to have to Fly down to "the smoke" and get an EC service back as it's likely to be my only chance of experiencing the new menu - up here you often get the "run out" autobull !!

 

[HST Power]

I haven't got a "whole heap" of points as being a "cheapskate" I get the cheapest Advanced Fares. I have not checked the redemption for the Wine but if it's as poor value as 500 points for a £10 M&S Voucher I'll give it a miss

You can get 8 bottles of Beer Hawk for 1000 points, 15 bottles for 1500 points or 24 bottles for 2100 points.

http://www.eastcoast.co.uk/beerhawk

Or, you can get yourself 12 bottles of wine for 2250 points. Or just 3 for 900.

http://www.eastcoast.co.uk/east-coast-rewards/rewardsbenefits/naked-wines/

I can't say I touch wine and spirits but if you can cash in 500 points for a £10 voucher, 3 bottles of wine for 900 points sounds OK to me!

 

[Butts]

You can get 8 bottles of Beer Hawk for 1000 points, 15 bottles for 1500 points or 24 bottles for 2100 points.

http://www.eastcoast.co.uk/beerhawk

Or, you can get yourself 12 bottles of wine for 2250 points. Or just 3 for 900.

http://www.eastcoast.co.uk/east-coast-rewards/rewardsbenefits/naked-wines/

I can't say I touch wine and spirits but if you can cash in 500 points for a £10 voucher, 3 bottles of wine for 900 points sounds OK to me!

Considering the value of "Free Travel" for a similar level of points to some of these "booze offers" I'll give them a wide berth

 

[sidmouth]

Despite past comments, I must say I was impressed today when I traveled Peterborough to Kings Cross. This morning I noted all PBO boarding passengers were offered a bacon butty with a choice of bread (and very nice too), and on way back home tonight all passengers were offered the dinner (BTW I was on 18.03 to Skipton). I declined as I had a meal waiting for me on arrival home, but at least was nice to be asked. I noted a fellow passenger had the sea bass, boiled potato and broccoli - there was nothing stingy about the portion, with the fish half hanging off the plate.

I feel like EC have finally arrived - just pity its taken 18 months...

 

[ainsworth74]

I feel like EC have finally arrived - just pity its taken 18 months...

That won't last long. Unless there's been a sudden policy change consistency is still poor. As I've said, when it works it's good but the problem is it doesn't work often enough (and if you're heading north from York then things really are poor).

 

[mirodo]

A little off topic as it relates to the EC 1st class lounges, but i thought this was the best place for it.

I was travelling from Kings Cross on Friday (on a non-EC service), but decided to make use of some of my reward points to get a 1st Class lounge pass.

The attendant in the lounge attempted to take the printout of my pass from me, saying "we usually take them from people". He handed it back to me reluctantly when I requested.

I was under the impression that the pass was an all-day affair, so had I been travelling to another station with an EC 1st class lounge (which I wasn't, actually, but that's by-the-by), I could use it at the other end.

Have I got it wrong, or does somebody need some retraining?

 

[Butts]

That won't last long. Unless there's been a sudden policy change consistency is still poor. As I've said, when it works it's good but the problem is it doesn't work often enough (and if you're heading north from York then things really are poor).

Thanks Ainsworth for remembering myself Blind Traveller and the other "hungry" patrons up here at the extremes of the EC Empire

 

[ainsworth74]

Thanks Ainsworth for remembering myself Blind Traveller and the other "hungry" patrons up here at the extremes of the EC Empire

Having Darlington as my East Coast 'home base' means I also get to experience the delights of travelling north with EC. I don't do it very often but so far, since the change, I've been north twice, from Darlington, in first class (both times this year) and once everything worked fine and got the full breakfast menu (though the service had come from Leeds so this is hardly surprising). On the other (serving the mid-morning menu) I flagged someone down after we left Newcastle to be told that 'oh we've already been through to do food orders, I'll send him round to you again'. Upon leaving the train at Edinburgh I had yet to see any member of the East Coast team since that encounter. So that's a 50% success rate so far.

Have I got it wrong, or does somebody need some retraining?

No you're right. I think an email to East Coast might be worthwhile.

 

[Bungle73]

A little off topic as it relates to the EC 1st class lounges, but i thought this was the best place for it.

I was travelling from Kings Cross on Friday (on a non-EC service), but decided to make use of some of my reward points to get a 1st Class lounge pass.

The attendant in the lounge attempted to take the printout of my pass from me, saying "we usually take them from people". He handed it back to me reluctantly when I requested.

I was under the impression that the pass was an all-day affair, so had I been travelling to another station with an EC 1st class lounge (which I wasn't, actually, but that's by-the-by), I could use it at the other end.

Have I got it wrong, or does somebody need some retraining?

I'm ****ed off about this. I had my own run in with a Host in the KGX FC Lounge myself, as anybody who read my thread would know. She too insisted on taking it off me, in fact she was quite abrasive in general towards me. I wrote off an email to Customer Services and they claimed they didn't understand what I was talking about, even though I explained everything that happened in very simple language.

I know for fact that they are NOT supposed to take the Pass off you: a) it is supposed to last all day, and b) it specifically says in their own website that you should keep it.

I think someone here needs to get onto EC and demand to know why their FC Lounge Hosts have seemingly been instructed to relieve customers of their Passes on entry to the lounge. I may even write another email myself, and I've good mind to get onto the ASA.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Well no one here seems interested in taking up this case. No matter, I fired off my own email to EC the other night.

 

[mirodo]

I intend to make a complaint myself, I just haven't got round to it yet...
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Now done:

I recently travelled from Kings Cross, and decided to use some of my reward points to get a pass to use the first class lounge facilities.

I was surprised when the lounge host attempted to take my email printout from me - I persuaded him to let me have it back, but he claimed it was usual practice to take them from customers. This is in direct contradiction to the instructions on the rewards web page, which states that the pass is valid for the entire day and should be retained by the customer.

I am aware of other customers who have had a similar experience at the Kings Cross lounge with a different lounge host, so it would appear that some re-education of the staff there is needed.

I would be grateful of your assurance that all lounge staff will be retrained in the correct procedure for handling lounge passes obtained through the reward scheme, and look forward to hearing from you in respect of a date by which this training will be completed.*

 

[Bungle73]

I'm not sure what they think even gives them right to take it. It's my ink and my paper, so as far as I'm concerned the Pass belongs to me.

 

[calc7]

There seems to be a very anti-customer culture amongst some (particularly London-based) EC staff. I'm not sure if it's passed down from management - but as mentioned previously, there seems to be disdain and even jealousy felt by some staff when customers get more "freebies" than in their arbitrary opinions believe are due. The same goes for toast, booze et al on train - what is the problem of an extra slice or extra scotch when you have a clear surplus and First Class is empty?!

How on earth they are so passionate about this on a personal level I do not understand.

 

[A-driver]

There seems to be a very anti-customer culture amongst some (particularly London-based) EC staff. I'm not sure if it's passed down from management - but as mentioned previously, there seems to be disdain and even jealousy felt by some staff when customers get more "freebies" than in their arbitrary opinions believe are due. The same goes for toast, booze et al on train - what is the problem of an extra slice or extra scotch when you have a clear surplus and First Class is empty?!

How on earth they are so passionate about this on a personal level I do not understand.

There is a lot of conflict currently between EC staff and management. They are having more and more work put on them by management and generally treated like dirt. First class lounge staff especially are getting more and more work that should be making other jobs. I Imagen that's why they are often a little anti customer-under paid, under valued and overworked.

On a side issue I fail to understand some of this thread-this is a train service. You pay to travel from a to b, a first class ticket isn't the same as going to a restaurant. The food and drink is complimentary-not included within the ticket price. Surely you should be grateful you get anything at all?!

 

[Bungle73]

There is a lot of conflict currently between EC staff and management. They are having more and more work put on them by management and generally treated like dirt. First class lounge staff especially are getting more and more work that should be making other jobs. I Imagen that's why they are often a little anti customer-under paid, under valued and overworked.

I'm not sure how any of that is the customers' problem or concern. If a staff member has a problem with their management they should take it up with them and not take it out on their paying customers.

On a side issue I fail to understand some of this thread-this is a train service. You pay to travel from a to b, a first class ticket isn't the same as going to a restaurant. The food and drink is complimentary-not included within the ticket price. Surely you should be grateful you get anything at all?!

"Grateful" that we get anything at all?? The food and drink is an advertised part of the service! They are using advertising along the lines of "Travel FC and this is what you get". It's unacceptable to not provide something that has been advertised.

 

[A-driver]

I'm just saying that a lot of the first class staff are on low pay, long hours and its nothing more than a job to them- like working in tesco or a pub. I doubt they really think that much about how many freebies to give out etc.

As for advertising I would imagin that it clearly says in the adverts and ticket terms and conditions that food and drink is subject to availability, not always avaliable and limited to 1 per ticket etc.

My point is that people are combining that the trolly only went round giving free drinks twice between London and Newcastle etc. As far as I can see that is fine, you got a complimentary drink and got to your destination in a first class carriage which is what you actually paid for.

Considering you can by a 1st class advance on east coast for less than you can buy a first class ticket on several commuter TOCs I think anything you get is good going.

 

[Butts]

I'm just saying that a lot of the first class staff are on low pay, long hours and its nothing more than a job to them- like working in tesco or a pub. I doubt they really think that much about how many freebies to give out etc.

As for advertising I would imagin that it clearly says in the adverts and ticket terms and conditions that food and drink is subject to availability, not always avaliable and limited to 1 per ticket etc.

My point is that people are combining that the trolly only went round giving free drinks twice between London and Newcastle etc. As far as I can see that is fine, you got a complimentary drink and got to your destination in a first class carriage which is what you actually paid for.

Considering you can by a 1st class advance on east coast for less than you can buy a first class ticket on several commuter TOCs I think anything you get is good going.

The problem is the lack of the advertised service often occurs on quiet services with perhaps not more than a dozen passengers travelling 1st Class, so the staff are hardly "overworked" on these occasions.

Some staff are great others are abysmal, consistency is the missing element in the package.

The cost of the ticket is immaterial some people pay hundreds for shoddy service.

 

[calc7]

I'm just saying that a lot of the first class staff are on low pay, long hours and its nothing more than a job to them- like working in tesco or a pub. I doubt they really think that much about how many freebies to give out etc.

I can understand why some of them "don't care" - but this doesn't explain why they actively ration supplies on quiet services, as if it is their own personal stock.

As for advertising I would imagin that it clearly says in the adverts and ticket terms and conditions that food and drink is subject to availability, not always avaliable and limited to 1 per ticket etc.

No, it doesn't say that. It says it's complimentary and subject to availability (which I take as meaning the advertised service will be offered unless several adverse factors mean it cannot be - not just poor operations and stock management, or moody staff). If management's intention is that in a 5 hour trip you get three sandwiches, a bag of crisps and three cold drinks and no more, they should say that. The current wording doesn't imply a "free for all" but at the same time it does set expectations rather high.

 

[A-driver]

I'm just saying that its a train service, not a restraint service. If you don't feel you get what you are after then don't pay for 1st class and take food on with you.

 

[calc7]

I'm just saying that its a train service, not a restraint service. If you don't feel you get what you are after then don't pay for 1st class and take food on with you.

It's a "train service" in Standard Class. If East Coast didn't put on a jamboree how great First Class is - fine. I would then be able to decide whether I thought the advertised service was worth the additional money. But as things stand, you are over-promised and whether or not the advertised offering appears is hit-or-miss. This is worse than having a "worse" but consistent and expected service IMO!

 

[A-driver]

But my point is that people on here seem to be constantly complaining about the service but still paying for it again and again!

I'll be honest-the company dosnt care. They want to limit what they give you as giving out food and drink costs them money. They want to employ less staff to serve you as that costs money to. If this were a restarunt then I'd understand your argument but its not!

You pay a first class fare to travel to your destination in a larger seat with more legroom. As a goodwill gesture to show apepreciation of the higher price you have paid they offer you a free drink and snack. That is not actually what you are paying for though. That is the difference.

The only way they may take note is if everyone votes with their feet and stops using first class. But that's not going to happen as the majority of first class users arnt there for the free food and drink-they often decline it completely or have a complimemtary drink and don't want the trolly bothering them every half hour or what ever.

I just don't see why people here find the concept hard to grasp- it is complimentary food and drink-not a free bar and all you can eat buffet! You will still need to have a meal when you get off!

 

[Marton]

On a side issue I fail to understand some of this thread-this is a train service. You pay to travel from a to b, a first class ticket isn't the same as going to a restaurant. The food and drink is complimentary-not included within the ticket price. Surely you should be grateful you get anything at all?!

This is a train service which takes people a long way at meal times.

It is a train service which used to provide good food for a charge which enabled those of us travelling long distances at the end of the working day to eat before going to bed.

Now leaving the north at 1800 its unpredictable what you get. arriving in London at 2100 or 2200 is not a good time to eat and digest a meal.

I would prefer guaranteed food that i paid for - now heading south in the evening is a nightmare with no proper meal (ie Meat/Fish/Veggie + Potatoes/Rice/Pasta + Salad/Vegetables). North in the evening and breakfast not to bad.

 

[yorkie]

But my point is that people on here seem to be constantly complaining about the service but still paying for it again and again!

I'll be honest-the company dosnt care.

Can you provide a source for that? That is certainly not what EC says.

You pay a first class fare to travel to your destination in a larger seat with more legroom. As a goodwill gesture to show apepreciation of the higher price you have paid they offer you a free drink and snack. That is not actually what you are paying for though. That is the difference.

But that is not what EC say. If EC said that then no-one would be complaining at the false advertising.

EC ran a 25 reasons campaign giving reasons to upgrade to First Class.

The first reason was because they were giving out £25 fares (though when some passengers used a ticket costing £25 despite holding the correct reservations the guard of an Inverness-London train claimed that the fare was too low and indicated that he felt that they were not entitled to complimentary items, though they were still provided)

Here are the other reasons they gave:

2. Enjoy a genuinely warm welcome the moment you step on board

3. Stretch out in your roomy, reclining seat and watch the beautiful East Coast scenery pass by

4. Spread your newspaper, computer, books or magazines on the table and relax in comfort with that extra leg room

5. Take time to enjoy the calm and peace of the First Class Quiet Coach

6. Relax and tuck into one of our vegetarian breakfasts

7. Opt for a hearty full English instead

8. Or be virtuous and choose a healthy breakfast of Greek yoghurt with fruit compote and granola

9. Whatever you choose, enjoy it served to you at your seat

10. Alongside a nice cold glass of fresh fruit juice

11. Sip a cup of freshly-ground coffee or English Breakfast tea

12. Admire stunning East Coast scenery framed by your window

13. Nibble complimentary snacks and refreshments

14. Indulge yourself with a complimentary glass of Sauvignon Blanc

15. Email your friends to tell them how great your journey is with free Wi-Fi

16. Revive your laptop by hooking it up to the power socket

17. Peruse the menu and choose your complimentary lunch

18. Again, served to you at your seat

19. Choose from a selection of mouth-watering sandwiches

20. Or a delicious hot meal

21. And finish your meal off with a tempting slice of cake

22. Treat yourself to one of our National Trust-inspired creations – like our handmade Nunnington Spiced Fruit Loaf

23. Have just one more bite of our delightful Marmalade Cake

24. Or lick your lips at the thought of a complimentary scone oozing with strawberry jam and cream

25. Immerse yourself in culture along a route that covers some of the UK’s most historic and beautiful cities

Perhaps if you were in charge of marketing and said "We don't care, you pay for travel and a nicer seat, not the food" then, while you may not last long in the job (though that would be a matter for the Company), people would not be complaining that the advertised service was not provided.

 

[lincolnshire]

When you look at some of the trains its hardly worth having First Class as there are so few passengers, last week for example approx 19-15 going southbound at Doncaster two nights running no more than 18 passengers in all the First Class accommodation and how many staff does that require to look after them ?

Next time your out and about just look how many passengers are in First Class? I think you will now find more business men traveling standard as there company tries to save money a luxury they can live without.

 

[maddeningcrowds]

You pay a first class fare to travel to your destination in a larger seat with more legroom. As a goodwill gesture to show apepreciation of the higher price you have paid they offer you a free drink and snack.

Incorrect. You pay a first class fare because you want convienience and you are able to pay for it. Inconsistency in the service is therefore the biggest problem. For example, if you cannot rely on there being a meal when it is advertised, then you loose the convienience of not having to worry about it, and you loose the advantage of being in first.

 

[sidmouth]

I'm just saying that its a train service, not a restraint service. If you don't feel you get what you are after then don't pay for 1st class and take food on with you.

EC should never have advertised what they couldn't provide (consistently).

The key problem for me was the degragation in service following the introduction of the "complimentary" service. Prior to its introduction I was guaranteed food from Peterbrorough and Kings Cross, which I didn't mind paying for - it was called at seat dining (remember it). Following its introduction I have arrived KGX on several occasions starving and fractious and peed off after paying £130 for the pleasure (and on one occasion by the time I realised there was no 1st class food on offer, the cafe bar had closed, so doubley peed off and fractious). It's only on the last occasion I have travelled I have been offered a bacon butty (which in the old days I was able to buy quite happily). So what has been (and I can't stress how so) annoying was the loss of service I could used to enjoy and take for granted.

To my mind its taken 18 months to get back to where EC were prior May 2011 (in terms of service delivery), but no doubt due to inconsistencies others are still waiting.

 

[yorksrob]

I think I'd be a bit miffed if I'd coughed up £130 and didn't get the advertised meal. Perhaps it's a case of TOC's forgetting that not everyone's on an advanced ticket.

 

[MCR247]

Whats the difference between 'evening meal' and 'evening menu'?