Personally, I don't care, the old show had become a dull series of three old clowns messing around in their own stereo type way... In the last 3-4 seasons, the show had become a hobby for Clarkson, May & Hammond, lost any sense of the greatness it had, and just lived on the viewers good will. The farce in Patagonia was the moment when Clarkson should have been fired, he risked film crew lives - end off, get shut.
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Matt LeBlanc and 4 others join Top Gear
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Personally, I don't care, the old show had become a dull series of three old clowns messing around in their own stereo type way... In the last 3-4 seasons, the show had become a hobby for Clarkson, May & Hammond, lost any sense of the greatness it had, and just lived on the viewers good will. The farce in Patagonia was the moment when Clarkson should have been fired, he risked film crew lives - end off, get shut.
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R
RailUK Forums
3 of them bring massive egos
2 I dont know
1 token female presence (although she is a hot driver
)I am shocked the Daily Mail did a story alluding to this today, and that so many people have been going along with it.
Nasty comments about women and, shock, a black man.
I am friends with Rory (actually I also know Chris Harris from events too) and he's had to endure loads of nasty comments today, some of it quite shocking. The most common being that he's only there because he's black, not that he's an enthusiastic and passionate motoring journalist who has been into cars for years (and also knows shed loads about other tech, making it ideal for talking about all the clever tech in modern cars, electric car technology, autodriving etc).
Earlier today, someone found a picture of when he went on a company team building event (When he was at cnet I assume, but I am not 100% sure) and they did clay pigeon shooting. He posed with two guns and a cigarette in his mouth, which people are now using to suggest he's some two-bit gangster who may have been smoking weed.
It's very sad to hear the same comments being made on here. Rory auditioned, he wasn't approached and picked so the BBC could tick a box.
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Well as long as you can live with the series being cut like it was was in the nineties because it was dull. Clarkson was one of the instrumental people in making Top Gear the powerful brand it was because he knew that viewers didn't want a dull boring car show. And funnily enough Fifth Gear tried to copy the "challenges" concept he came up with. Ow and The Stig and Star in a Reasonably priced car were all his ideas! Wonder what ideas Chris Evans will come up with apart from copying what Clarkson created?
I am not sure they're going to try and copy the Top Gear of old, or at least not exactly.
I just hope that whatever happens, and I am sure the BBC will be watching closely to tweak/re-edit future content based on feedback from viewers, it is a success.
Anyone into cars will want to wish Top Gear success AND that the Amazon show is good too. I doubt anyone will be too upset about having to remember to watch TWO programmes about cars every week.
Fifth Gear and others were pretty awful, but I'm sure people still watched if they were into cars.
Top Gear has of course always been about attracting people who just want to be entertained. That is going to be tough for the BBC naturally, but we will have to wait and see.
How far can each roadtest make him projectile vomit, the further it goes the 'better' the car!
Minilad
Established Member
How far can each roadtest make him projectile vomit, the further it goes the 'better' the car!
Which, funnily enough, is what happens to me when I stumble upon Clarkson.
Seems to me most of the people moaning about the new line up aren't really fans of cars, just fans of that idiot.
ExRes
Established Member
That will be a first for BBC then
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You'd agree that Evans for Clarkson seems pretty much par for the course then
That's a bit premature isn't it, it's a bit like saying a new train is rubbish and going to be a failure before its turned a wheel... Oh, silly me, I'd forgotten that you've history on damning things before they have had chance to prove their abilities
Clarkson doesn't have a unique ability, but he was fortunate enough to be in a place to take on the franchise at the time and gave us many years of entertainment. Sadly, he's had his day, his bad attitude got the better of him and he punched his director - personally I'd not employ a thug like him, but I wish him well and he will probably continue to be a thug under a new employment contract. I don't have an Amazon Prime "contract" so won't get to see his new show, but I'd imagine it will be more of the same, that was fun in the 00's, but became dull in the 10's as the world move on from Clarksons blinkered view of British Empire rhetoric.
I'm open minded, looking forward to a refreshing reboot with an ensemble cast of people interested in cars. Fifth Gear failed because it copied what others had mastered in both incarnations of TopGear.
We now have a cast of six regulars, that fills me with hope that the series will evolve each season, adapting to viewer tastes, bringing in new talent, having guest presenters and mostly, not allowing itself to become a set formula that couldn't be changed, like the Clarkson era TopGear had become.
Tetchytyke
Veteran Member
Sabine Schmitz, eh, disgraceful choice.
What would a woman- and not just any old woman, a Kraut woman- know about driving a car, eh? Eh?
:roll:
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Fifth Gear failed because it was on Channel Five.
ExRes
Established Member
I wonder what 'adapting to viewer tastes' really means, does it mean that the Evans variety will be to viewer tastes while the Clarkson variety wasn't ?, perhaps average viewing figures in excess of 5m for every series since 2007 do show its massive unpopularity with viewers
How is it a diverse presenting line up when they all appear dressed in Jeans for the photo?
Indeed! The fact that the old show had a global audience of close to 150 million because the Beeb sold the rights to broadcast the show in multiple different countries, plus the Top Gear Live shows, plus all the merchandising. People clearly hated the ideas Clarkson came up with
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Just like you making out that it will be fantastic and there will be a massive fleet of them! :roll:That's a bit premature isn't it, it's a bit like saying a new train is rubbish and going to be a failure before its turned a wheel... Oh, silly me, I'd forgotten that you've history on damning things before they have had chance to prove their abilities
Even the last few series in the early part of this decade drew audiences in this country alone of 5-7 million! Clarkson tweeted once that he couldn't believe the show was still drawing a audience that large even after 13 series, so clearly a large amount of people disagree with you there. Yes Clarkson is an oaf with a massive ego. But then so is Chris Evans and his choice of Eddie Jordan proves that!
Like I said before I will watch the first of the new series to see what new ideas they have come up with.
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They still went ahead last year as "Clarkson, Hammond and May Live"
Don't forget that Clarkson's producer friend Andy Wilman was responsible for a lot of the ideas such as the creation of 'The Stig' and he has also left the BBC to join Amazon Prime.
Indeed because there were thousands of people that had bought tickets and the Beeb didn't want the massive bill for cancelling them.
The combination of Wilman and Clarkson along with the friendship they had with Hammond and May was what made Top Gear the monster it became. To still be drawing audiences as large as they were after 22 series just shows how good all 4 where/are. If you look on Wikipedia is says that event the last series was drawing 6-7 million viewers. So to say people were bored of the old show is rubbish. But like you say all 4 have gone to Amazon Prime, unfortunately one of their best ideas has had to stay with the BBC.
Lampshade
Established Member
Anyone complaining about Sabine clearly doesn't know who she is
Tetchytyke
Veteran Member
Clarkson's TV persona is of a bombastic oaf, which is a big part of what made Top Gear interesting and entertaining. It's also a big part of why Clarkson's 1999 chat show sank without trace, it should be said.
Top Gear was about much more than Clarkson though. If anything, I'd say the most important person on that team was Richard Porter, the scriptwriter; you can see just how funny he is on his own website, sniffpetrol.com. Porter has also moved to Amazon.
Evans' Top Gear won't be the same and, truth be told, it would be a huge mistake for them to try and make it the same. But I think the personalities that they've recruited are all strong enough to make the new programme work. Eddie Jordan is a bit of a tit, but that's not necessarily a bad thing, while Chris Harris has proven himself antagonistic enough during his time at Autocar. Schmitz seems to be the one everyone is upset about, as though they can't believe a woman knows about cars, even though she drove the Nurburgring in a Transit van as fast as Clarkson did in a Jag and has the charisma to clown around whilst doing it.
What's annoying me about this is people arguing that the new programme will be a bag o's***e because the old programme was good. There's no reason why both programmes can't be just as good as each other.
Top Gear was about much more than Clarkson though. If anything, I'd say the most important person on that team was Richard Porter, the scriptwriter; you can see just how funny he is on his own website, sniffpetrol.com. Porter has also moved to Amazon.
Evans' Top Gear won't be the same and, truth be told, it would be a huge mistake for them to try and make it the same. But I think the personalities that they've recruited are all strong enough to make the new programme work. Eddie Jordan is a bit of a tit, but that's not necessarily a bad thing, while Chris Harris has proven himself antagonistic enough during his time at Autocar. Schmitz seems to be the one everyone is upset about, as though they can't believe a woman knows about cars, even though she drove the Nurburgring in a Transit van as fast as Clarkson did in a Jag and has the charisma to clown around whilst doing it.
What's annoying me about this is people arguing that the new programme will be a bag o's***e because the old programme was good. There's no reason why both programmes can't be just as good as each other.
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Whilst I agree with some of your points I don't agree they won't try and repeat some of what the old Top Gear did. They are keeping the Stig, keeping "Star in the reasonably priced car", wonder whether they will keep the Power lap board, Cool Wall? If they were completely reinventing the show then surely they would ditch the old format completely?
The Star in the Reasonably Priced Car didn't rely on the chemistry be the 3 presenters as it only ever included Clarkson and the guest.
With having Sabine on the show I don't think there's a need to keep The Stig. I imagine it could be BBC wanting to sell The Stig merchandise opposed to needing The Stig.
Geezertronic
Established Member
I think people have short memories or are ill informed tbh. The old Top Gear format had Vicki Butler-Henderson and (if I remember correctly) Kate Humble as well didn't it? So by having Sabine on the new Top Gear, it's not like a woman hasn't been a presenter on there before.
Also any criticisms about Rory being another token offering are crap as well.
Like Dave1987, I will watch it to begin with out of interest...
And Julia Bradbury.
EM2
Established Member
And Angela Rippon a long, long time ago!
Films like Avatar and Marvel Superheroes pap make billions of dollars through lots of people seeing them - doesn't make for good viewing necessarily. Viewership as noted by others is down to the fact there's little else for car fans to watch, other than Fifth Gear which is about 20 minutes long if you cut the adverts and the annoying repeated "coming up" rubbish that spoils many TV shows today... The great elements of TopGear cost big money especially the roadtrips and the races, the BBC has the corporate ability to sell on the show, so is happy to invest in the show not just for the UK market, like FifthGear, Classic Car Show etc...
No, Clarkson is a thug who punches people he argues with, a bully if you like... Evans is just very excitable and has a problem with depression... Like a third of the country ! I might add, that I disagree strongly with the description of Clarkson being an idiot by some other members of the forum, it's clear from his wealth, that he's a pretty shrewd business mind.
That's good to hear, open mind on new ideas
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Spot on !
Clarkson the man and Clarkson the character are two seperate things. Clarkson the man rides a bike. Clarkson the character runs over people on bikes.
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Yet last of the summer wine ran for 37 years.
How did he, and he alone, bare responsibility for anything that happened? Even if you believe the H982FKL license plate wasn't a coincidence. If you were going to fire Clarkson you'd have to fire Wilman at that point too, and probably whoever approved their risk assessment. Hindsight is a wonderful thing.
Top Gear was a cash-cow for the BBC - making a £50m a year profit, meaning a £2 discount on the TV license. Now that's a drop in the ocean compared with the nearly £1 billion a year license fee cut the government imposed in the last few years. Even if this new show is successful enough to stay on air and not become a dreary pre-clarkson show for car nerds (or worse), I don't see it reaching the international sales that Clarkson-gear and it's associate did.
One problem that the old series had was, due to it's value, it took a lot of toll on the crew, especially the presenters (who had to go). It wasn't just old men on a grueling international filming schedule, the tours took a lot too. A crew of 7 presenters will mittigate it, and explain how Evans can keep doing his breakfast show without needing to go to the Bolivian rainforest for 3 weeks.
However Top Gear was different things to different people. To some it was a car show, to others a sitcom, to others the TV equivalent of the daily mail. The new show may end up being a car show, but that's not why people tuned in. Cars, like trains, are dreary boring things to transport you around. A few nerds like them, that's not really enough to justify a program though, at least under normal circumstances where more viewers = higher budget. You could argue the BBC should fund a car show (or a trainspotting show) in a BBC4 style "don't chase the ratings", but it certainly wouldn't be the same show as the Clarkson era.
That's true, however it would seem that Clarkson the man had anger issues that were different to the Clarkson the character comedy anger.
I'd run with that, despite their money making abilities, the management team at TopGear had made unacceptable risks - Patagonia was one such risk, it could be argued that the Iraq and Southern USA trips were also a risk too far, but I'd agree, hindsight is a wonderful thing.
Well we don't know what's in the new show yet, it could be argued that given TopGear's budget, other motoring shows could have done a similar or even better job.
Indeed, it may be the case that other presenters could be brought on board to help along the specials - an F1 driver joining two presenters, an ex army type presenter adding extra interest to a road test in Bosnia for example... I'm not a TV producer, I don't really know the game, but I do know what I enjoy and the most interesting things I've seen on TV recently involved an ex para officer walking the length of the Himalayas and a pilot in a wheel chair visiting remote places that were only accessible from the air.
There was the element of entertainment that made the Clarkson era TopGear engaging for people that aren't interested in cars - my wife enjoyed TopGear, but isn't mad on cars by any stretch of the imagination - but recently, she's become just as disengaged from the show as I've been.
Another failing of the BBC in my opinion, they dealt with Clarkson very poorly. They had just pushed for another 2 episodes of the final season I believe, a symptom of the core problem of pushing too far. He was going through a stressful divorce at the time too I believe.
As someone who has been known for fits of anger (although not physical, at least not since school, I just send emails - or make forum posts - that I later regret) I do sympathise.
It's hard to get a feeling for how much danger there really is when all you're doing is watching the finished show, however from what I understood at the time (obviously different now) northern Iraq was a pretty safe environment to be in, and Syria was probably safer than London at the time.
It was getting tired, but capturing those viewers is crucial. I wonder how much that was because the 3 were tired. It was time for a change, for both the trio and the program. We'll see how well both shows perform.
The naysayers said the same thing about Evans when he took over from Wogan, however Wogan's 8.1 million listeners has increased to 9.4 under Evans.
Tetchytyke
Veteran Member
Clarkson was going through a stressful divorce because of his own behaviour. He brought it on himself through his arrogance. Sound familiar?
Having heard rumours from years ago from friends, I'm just amazed his ex-wife tolerated him as long as she did.
I don't understand how anyone can say the BBC "treated him poorly" after he repeatedly punched someone. If any of us did it at work we'd get our P45 without passing go and without collecting £200. I dont see how the BBC could have done anything else. There's a line that can't be crossed, and he crossed it. If it was just verbals they'd have brushed it under the carpet, like they had been doing for years.
Having heard rumours from years ago from friends, I'm just amazed his ex-wife tolerated him as long as she did.
I don't understand how anyone can say the BBC "treated him poorly" after he repeatedly punched someone. If any of us did it at work we'd get our P45 without passing go and without collecting £200. I dont see how the BBC could have done anything else. There's a line that can't be crossed, and he crossed it. If it was just verbals they'd have brushed it under the carpet, like they had been doing for years.
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A previous BBC director general bit a colleague and didn't get fired, but that's by the by. Clarkson punched piers Morgan too.
However I meant how they treated him before hand. It was apparently obvious to many (hindsight etc) that he was a volcano ready to explode.
However I meant how they treated him before hand. It was apparently obvious to many (hindsight etc) that he was a volcano ready to explode.
BestWestern
Established Member
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Sabine should be much better than her predecessors.
Humble etc were of course back in the 'boring' days. Butler-Henderson did herself in because, whilst she certainly knew about cars, she often appeared to be on the verge of attempting intercourse with the camera - she overcooked the 'sexy' act somewhat and became token totty. Her approach was more akin to Men & Motors (a low rent sort of Max Power magazine meets Babestation effort, for those who may be unfamiliar) rather than the universal humour that underpinned New TG, and her pouting would have clashed with the format of the newer shows.
I rather imagine Sabine Schmidt will operate at a higher level, doing humour rather than porn, which should work. I don't mind Evans myself, but they can keep Eddie Jordan.
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Minilad
Established Member
Who wouldn't fancy being taken round The Ring by Sabine?
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