My Transport for London day

[Starmill]

I'm having a Transport for London day out on Saturday (well... not ALL day. I'm flexible, but it'll probably be about five and a half hours) and just wondered if anyone has any advice to offer me? I've only visited the capital once before and didn't use much local transport.

I'm aware that I'm unlikely to see a great proportion in my limited time... but is there anything I should "know" - you know, because, although I'm a daily user of NR trains, I'm from the land where people buy tickets on the trains... from a man or woman who also opens and closes the doors. I'm told this is much less the case down there...

I'd like to see the DLR, because I've heard its driverless and you can see out the front :0 and have a go on Tramlink because I love trams... But the rest of my day will be intrinsically based on the Tube, so I need a basic route plan. To help me draw one up, please could anyone give me some suggestions as to what you think are the most interesting bits of any rail-based transport in London?

So far, I've got points of interest:

*DLR
*HS1
*Remodelled King's X
*S Stock/2009 Stock
*Reopened East London Line / 377s
*the idea of LUL on NR rails... fascinates me
*(Clapham Junction)
* A ride on a 444

I don't even know if that last one's possible on a 1-6 travelcard! Oh well.

And... is HS1 worth it just to Stratford, and can you get it added to the Travelcard?

Anyway, thanks for your help, I just wanted some extra opinions, as there's only so much you can do with Google - and the TfL website is really befuddling me for my ticket research (I already have my advances to LONDON TERMINALS - whatever that means).

 

[telstarbox]

Which terminal are you arriving/leaving London from?

 

[W-on-Sea]

Most of the DLR is pretty interesting, from the POV of both re-use of old railway routes (and in some cases structures) and in terms of the views of London that you get from the elevated sections. The viaduct section on the Isle of Dogs (between Crossharbour and Poplar/Westferry) is a must, I'd say, and possibly part of the London City Airport/Woolwich Arsenal branch, too. The Beckton branch is a bit less interesting IMHO - although it's very post-modern, running down the middle of a highway, and dipping down with a couple of the stations (Cyprus and, I think, Beckton Park) being located in the centre of roundabouts just below road level.

I don't THINK you can get HS1 added to a travelcard. Is it worth it? Only time I've been on it was when I was going to the Olympics, and you could travel on it for free. For that distance and time (and cost), in all honesty, I'd say: probably not.

 

[Mojo]

What is confusing you about the TfL's ticket pages on the website?

High Speed 1 is not valid on your Travelcard; you would need to purchase a return for use on the route if travelling out from central London and back again. Travelling to Stratford isn't really worth it as it is mostly underground and doesn't reach the top speed.

If it's just a day on Saturday; you will need to buy a Zone 1-6 Off-peak Day Travelcard. If you have a Railcard this is £5.60, if not it's £8.50.

If you want to see LU trains on NR rails, a good place to go is north of Queens Park on the Bakerloo. You also get the interesting situation where Bakerloo trains run through the sheds just to the north of the station.

 

[causton]

It sounds like you are coming in to Euston, in this case I would:

-Get a London Overground train (every 20 minutes) out of Euston to Queens Park
-See the Queens Park Bakerloo line as Mojo says above, take Bakerloo to Willesden Junction
-Take London Overground to Clapham Junction and check it out
-South West Trains to Waterloo (You can sometimes get a nice train on the fast up platforms, I think it might be platforms 7 and 8? You can get a 159 and possibly a 444 into Waterloo!)
-Jubilee line to Canning Town
-Check out the DLR (especially Cyprus etc, where you're inbetween the carriageways of a road, as mentioned above!), go to Stratford, have a look at HS1, then either take HS1 into St Pancras or take the tube to King's Cross and check it out

Edit: You could also take the Bakerloo further and connect with the hourly Southern service from Harrow + W / Wembley Central to Clapham Junction - it runs over some rare-ish lines and you get a good view of some yards/sidings as you're doing it

 

[Starmill]

Well guessed, I'm arriving to/from Euston, how did you know? I didn't mention it though, because although I'll need to arrive there in good time for my 18:40 departure to Manchester Pic, I'll actually be starting from South Kensington.



That about the DLR sounds fascinating actually, especially the bit about being in the middle of a road!

Queens park area will be a go-er too I think, and I'd love a ride on a 377!

Now, I'm told there are some platform edge doors lurking around down there... I didn't think we had any examples in the UK, please, where are they? Thanks!

Mojo: I dunno really, I just wanted simple answers, like can you use a railcard (which is great btw, thanks!) and are they valid on tramlink or HS1, and it seemed to take ages to find them and then not really be sure about the answer...

If I've got to buy separate tickets, I doubt that its worth it for 5 mins looking at the inside of a 395 - wonderful machines as I'm sure they are.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Well guessed, I'm arriving to/from Euston, how did you know?


Now, I'm told there are some platform edge doors lurking around down there... I didn't think we had any examples in the UK, please, where are they? Thanks!

Your location under your avatar says "Manchester"; Euston is a logical guess...


The PEDs will be found on the underground platforms on the Jubilee Line Extension.


Re: The DLR... for a first timer I would recommend going to Lewisham by Southeastern from London Bridge and going Lewisham - Bank; by starting at Lewisham you can guarantee a seat at the front, and for a first timer the descent into Bank is something that will stick in the memory.


One thing... as you are going on a weekend, do check in advance for engineering works; there is quite a lot of it this weekend.

 

[causton]

The Jubilee line extension (Green Park - Stratford) has PEDs on the underground section of the line i.e. Westminster - North Greenwich

(If you didn't know beforehand, the Jubilee line was cobbled together from what was once the Bakerloo line, which was once itself the Met line (Stanmore - Baker Street) and then ran to Charing Cross via Green Park. Charing Cross closed when the extension opened, which was from Green Park to Stratford)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Your location under your avatar says "Manchester"; Euston is a logical guess...

That's exactly how I guessed :P

 

[Starmill]

Well, at least somebody's brain is working at this time of night, cos mines struggling, clearly. I guess I was just thrown off by the first post, but it does seem rather obvious now.

Well, then. Jubilee Line here I come! (It's not closed, phew.)

 

[TheVicLine]

If you are at Euston do a left out of station onto Euston road and it's a 5 minute walk to to the refurbed St Pancras International NR station, which is worth a look if you have not seen it, if only for the architecture.

While in the capital the London Transport Museum is interesting if you get a bit of spare time.

 

[snail]

The DLR... for a first timer I would recommend going to Lewisham by Southeastern from London Bridge and going Lewisham - Bank; by starting at Lewisham you can guarantee a seat at the front, and for a first timer the descent into Bank is something that will stick in the memory.

The departure from Bank is pretty good too! I did that during the Olympics, changing at Royal Victoria for the cable car to North Greenwich.

If you do get a front seat, sit on the RH side as the train crew sometimes take over the left hand control unit (but if it's busy they will stay at the doors).

With only a day, I would give HS1 a miss, 5 quid to sit in a tunnel for 5 minutes isn't the most thrilling experience. Save it for a proper trip to the South Coast or, even better, Paris!

 

[12CSVT]

For a class 444 ride, the best way to do that on a travelcard is to wait on platform 7 & 8 at Clapham Junction for a Waterloo service. Of course many services from these platforms could be 450s or 159s.

 

[Starmill]

For a class 444 ride, the best way to do that on a travelcard is to wait on platform 7 & 8 at Clapham Junction for a Waterloo service. Of course many services from these platforms could be 450s or 159s.

Excellent tip, thanks a lot! I've been on more 158s than I care to remember, so I probably won't bother with a 159 (more, or less uncomfortable than EMTs refit?). A 450 might be interesting though...

 

[VTPreston_Tez]

May I also recommend the Heathrow driverless pods? A bit out of the way but they look amazing, I'm going myself on Sunday!

 

[Starmill]

May I also recommend the Heathrow driverless pods? A bit out of the way but they look amazing, I'm going myself on Sunday!

What are they? That sounds exciting!

 

[ainsworth74]

What are they? That sounds exciting!

Might I suggest

 

[Starmill]

Might I suggest

That meme never gets any wittier, you know.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
They're on the wrong side!!!!
And I don't google random things usually...It's habitual. I thought "driverless pods" would've been a bit too vague.



Moving on from this.....

If I go to Wimlbedon with SWT and then Tramlink to Mitcham Junction, which is the best way back to Lewisham? I can see about three...

Thanks

 

[telstarbox]

Try http://journeyplanner.tfl.gov.uk, which takes account of weekend engineering works.
The shortest route tomorrow is National Rail, changing at Tulse Hill and Peckham Rye.

 

[bicbasher]

Try http://journeyplanner.tfl.gov.uk, which takes account of weekend engineering works.
The shortest route tomorrow is National Rail, changing at Tulse Hill and Peckham Rye.

There are no through services to Lewisham from Peckham Rye on Sundays, the OP will have to stay on a Southern train and change at London Bridge for Southeastern.

 

[Starmill]

There are no through services to Lewisham from Peckham Rye on Sundays, the OP will have to stay on a Southern train and change at London Bridge for Southeastern.

Thanks, but I did it today Peckham Rye was a little... depressing! Then again, none of it was aesthetically pleasing, except for the Tramlink. Waterloo, Clapham Junction, Wimbledon - all are looking decidedly tatty.

It was such a strange experience for me, using those three trains. It's like being on a tram or something... no guard!!! Ahh!

 

[bicbasher]

Thanks, but I did it today Peckham Rye was a little... depressing! Then again, none of it was aesthetically pleasing, except for the Tramlink. Waterloo, Clapham Junction, Wimbledon - all are looking decidedly tatty.

It was such a strange experience for me, using those three trains. It's like being on a tram or something... no guard!!! Ahh!

Yes, Peckham Rye is not the nicest of stations, although Southern have tried their best with what they have. That may change when the shops in front of the station are demolished to provide an open square which will expose the Victorian station front properly for the first time since the 1930s.

It's a shock as a South London commuter when I travel outside the Capital and experience commuter trains with guards, although London Overground continue to use guards on most of it's lines excluding the East London line.

I would have personally visited the refurbished ticket hall at Crystal Palace, it was the first time it's been used since the heyday of the Crystal Palace itself.

Also walking from the London Overground platforms is an experience in itself where you can tell how busy the station used to be when the exhibition was on.

 

[Starmill]

Yes, Peckham Rye is not the nicest of stations, although Southern have tried their best with what they have. That may change when the shops in front of the station are demolished to provide an open square which will expose the Victorian station front properly for the first time since the 1930s.

It's a shock as a South London commuter when I travel outside the Capital and experience commuter trains with guards, although London Overground continue to use guards on most of it's lines excluding the East London line.

I would have personally visited the refurbished ticket hall at Crystal Palace, it was the first time it's been used since the heyday of the Crystal Palace itself.

Also walking from the London Overground platforms is an experience in itself where you can tell how busy the station used to be when the exhibition was on.

Oh really? Well I'm glad they have guards, I'd simply assumed that they were as bad as the rest since the ELL was the one I went on. I'm really having trouble wrapping my head around this idea... When I first heard of the idea of DOO, I assumed it would be the preserve of light rail and rapid transit systems, where it seems more appropriate, and that NR wouldn't tolerate it. Guess you learn something new everyday!

 

[Class377/5]

Oh really? Well I'm glad they have guards, I'd simply assumed that they were as bad as the rest since the ELL was the one I went on. I'm really having trouble wrapping my head around this idea... When I first heard of the idea of DOO, I assumed it would be the preserve of light rail and rapid transit systems, where it seems more appropriate, and that NR wouldn't tolerate it. Guess you learn something new everyday!

We run 12 car peak DOO services using 377. Its a tad different from what you get in Manchester.

Sounds like you had a good day really.

 

[Starmill]

We run 12 car peak DOO services using 377. Its a tad different from what you get in Manchester.

Ya don't say! Remind me never to get on your train!

 

[Mojo]

Ya don't say! Remind me never to get on your train!

What makes you say that?

 

[urban469]

What about the TfL dongleway?

And the TfL Thames Clipper. You could do a nice loop: London Eye to the O2 by boat, dongleway return journey at the O2, then Jubilee Line (with PEDs) from North Greenwich back into town (or you could do some DLRing while you're on that side of the city).

If you're taking the Met S8 stock, get a fast out to Moor Park and then get the Chiltern Turbo back into Marylebone over the same track.

In terms of buses (if you're interested): try the NBfL on route 38, and the old RM on Heritage Route 9 or 15. Plus one of the hydrogen buses.

 

[Starmill]

What about the TfL dongleway?

And the TfL Thames Clipper. You could do a nice loop: London Eye to the O2 by boat, dongleway return journey at the O2, then Jubilee Line (with PEDs) from North Greenwich back into town (or you could do some DLRing while you're on that side of the city).

If you're taking the Met S8 stock, get a fast out to Moor Park and then get the Chiltern Turbo back into Marylebone over the same track.

In terms of buses (if you're interested): try the NBfL on route 38, and the old RM on Heritage Route 9 or 15. Plus one of the hydrogen buses.

That, I plan to do in my follow up trip at the end of November. Along with the Beckton branch and Watford DC line Thank you! Do any semi-fasts run on saturdays though?

As for the DOO, I'm just not used to the idea at all, so I'm clearly not making a balanced judgement, but that many people on a train, under the sole control of one person? It seems... high risk. That said, a ride on a 377 would be amazing. All these new EMUs you get (

 

[urban469]

That, I plan to do in my follow up trip at the end of November. Along with the Beckton branch and Watford DC line Thank you! Do any semi-fasts run on saturdays though?

As for the DOO, I'm just not used to the idea at all, so I'm clearly not making a balanced judgement, but that many people on a train, under the sole control of one person? It seems... high risk. That said, a ride on a 377 would be amazing. All these new EMUs you get (

Ah, no, you're right. No Met fast or semi off-peak. Watford DC: do the Bakerloo to Harrow & Wealdstone and then LO to Watford.

DOO, yes, true. But I guess there are a lot more people in the line control room then there would be on a rural NR line. Maybe? And LO nearly always has a second member of staff on board to dispatch (I think).

Yes, the 377 from H&W to Clapham is quite an adventure, through Old Oak Common. Along that part of the line, it used to switch from pantograph to third-rail (although I have a feeling that changed recently).

 

[causton]

DOO, yes, true. But I guess there are a lot more people in the line control room then there would be on a rural NR line. Maybe? And LO nearly always has a second member of staff on board to dispatch (I think).

They call those guards

Yes, the 377 from H&W to Clapham is quite an adventure, through Old Oak Common. Along that part of the line, it used to switch from pantograph to third-rail (although I have a feeling that changed recently).

Nope, still switches north of Shepherds Bush

 

[Starmill]

Oops. I can't go to Watford on a travelcard! I'll have to go back to Euston from H & W and take a 377 out of Victoria!