Packed services.

Discussion in 'UK Railway Discussion' started by Prodigy, 31 Oct 2011.

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  1. Prodigy

    Prodigy Member

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    [​IMG]

    This morning I was catching the 8.07 service from Mossley to Manchester which had come from Huddersfield... only I didn't catch it. For some reason the train was only two carriages instead of the usual four Nothern put on for this service. Me and my Dad attempted to board it but it wasn't happening as people squeezed on we gave up and decided to wait for the 8.27 service (which was luckily 4 cars), as you can see from the picture above there was no chance of us getting on.... I've never in my life time experienced the service this busy and even with two cars I thought everyone waiting for it at Mossley would of got on. This thread is not a gripe at Northern as I don't no the circumstances of why there was only two cars, this is more kind of a discussion thread.

    • Do the services you use most often get so packed people are unable to board?
    • What is the most packed service you've experienced, or in some cases not experienced because it was too full to board?

    Just thought it would be an interesting topic to see how many services around the country are affected by the same problems.
     
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  3. Twoonthebuzzer

    Twoonthebuzzer Member

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    To answer your last point, at that time in the morning pretty much every service going into a major town or city will be like the one you pictured above!!

    DfT need to get more stock onto our railways with ever increasing passenger numbers!
     
  4. Prodigy

    Prodigy Member

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    And I thought with the Goverment encouraging people to use Public Transport over Cars that would be the case, but certainly not!
     
  5. Lampshade

    Lampshade Established Member

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    I'd love to have seen it when someone sat smack bang in the middle of the carriage decided they wanted to get off at Ashton-Under-Lyne :lol:
     
  6. Badger

    Badger Member

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    Almost every Birmingham to Stanstead or reversed train.

    The most packed I've been on though was Nuneaton to Coventry when New Street was closed and we had to go around - tiny train, not used to that kind of capacity.
     
  7. Prodigy

    Prodigy Member

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    :cry:
    Would've been a struggle for sure. I guess people in Stalybridge are lucky in the fact that they have more frequent services at peak times in the morning towards Manchester + they also have more peak services back there in the evening. I'm hoping, not for the sake of myself but those in Ashton, that the Metrolink is a frequent and fast service for them in the morning because that'll mean there's less chance of them being late due to not being able to get on an already packed train.
     
  8. Mojo

    Mojo Administrator Staff Member Administrator

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    Looks like there's more room on there if people just moved down in the saloon, unless there's a suitcase there I cannot see.

    Busiest times normally are on the District line Eastbound at Victoria station in the morning. Very few people get off and it's hard to get on; you normally have to let a few trains go past. Westbound trains however are normally fine.
     
  9. dk1

    dk1 Established Member

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    That wouldve been me then on the 17 something out of Victoria last year :roll: We had to go into the toilet to let others cram into the donkeys doorway.

    Just one of those things nowadays. Cant see much changing in the short term.
     
  10. EM2

    EM2 Established Member

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    Any NXEA Metro that stops at Forest Gate in the peak after about 8am. I have known them so busy that the doors on the 315 can't be closed and 'passenger power' has forced others off...
    Coming out of LST in the late peak is OK, until you get to Stratford. I never sit down now, having once not been able to get to the door and ending up at Manor Park.
     
  11. aformeruser

    aformeruser Veteran Member

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    There are changes planned from December, when the extra 142s and 150s are diagrammed to be in use:
    06:29 Huddersfield-Victoria will be booked as a 150 instead of a 142.
    07:16 Lime Street-Huddersfield will be booked as a 156 instead of a 150.
    08:30 Huddersfield-Victoria will be booked as a 150 instead of a 142.
    16:00 Southport-Victoria will be strengthened to 2x142s.
    16:27 Victoria-Huddersfield will be booked as a 156 instead of a 150.
    17:27 Victoria-Huddersfield will be strengthened to 142+150
    18:27 Victoria-Huddersfield will be booked as a 156 instead of a 150.

    And in response to the questions asked in the original post. I've seen trains that full on what are supposed to be 'quiet' lines in Northern's and PTE's eyes.
     
  12. Prodigy

    Prodigy Member

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    Might be a stupid question but with platform 1 at Mossley soon to be extended to properly allow for 4 carriages will trains on the service more often than not be 4 carriages or does Northern not have enough rolling stock to do this?
     
  13. londonmidland

    londonmidland Member

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    I'm sure First Capital Connect London bound services (Thameslink line) are usually quite packed! Also SouthEastern.
     
  14. ANorthernGuard

    ANorthernGuard Established Member

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    That is one of the things that frustrates me, Its rush hour everyone knows its going to be rammed, you ask people to move towards the middle of each coach and guess what...NO ONE moves, its only when you sternly (but fairly say) if people don't move the train won't they soon get the message!
     
  15. ess

    ess Member

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    Finsbury Park to Moorgate AM peak trains are MUCH worse than that!
     
  16. dk1

    dk1 Established Member

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    That must have been the one. Was a single 142 & awful. Lets hope these trains are reliably strengthened. So often they get nicked to help out & obviously save a cancellation.

    On commuter routes such as NXEA Metro its always like that but luckilly the next train is only a few minutes behind so not such a big deal.
     
  17. ainsworth74

    ainsworth74 Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    I was thinking that, you could cram on a few more people there. Just break out the crow bars and tasers!
     
  18. yorksrob

    yorksrob Veteran Member

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    I noticed the 20:3X Victoria - Leeds via Rochdale was a 158 on Saturday, so I wonder whether this will also be a more permanent upgrade. I have seen them swap a 2-car Pacer for either a 3-car one or a 15X (can't remember which exactly) which was supposed to go to Huddersfield because they physically couldn't fit half of the people on.

    The 158 did seem to accommodate everyone more easily even than the 3-car pacer on occasions, although whether this was just a quieter evening I couldn't tell.
     
  19. mister-sparky

    mister-sparky Member

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    you think that's busy and packed... you are kidding right?!

    trying living in the south east and getting a train from charing cross or victoria in london around 6pm, TWELVE carriage trains with every carriage fuller than that one.
     
  20. MidnightFlyer

    MidnightFlyer Veteran Member

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    Please let's not get into a 'North vs. South: Who's Got Worse Overcrowding?' thread...
     
  21. WestCoast

    WestCoast Established Member

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    The difference is that something can be done about at overcrowding issue on Northern! What do you do after 12 carriages?

    Plus, standing up on a bouncy Pacer is a little different to a smooth EMU, with plenty of standing space and supports. The Pacers are rubbish for standees (they're not designed for this kind of service!), hardly anything to grab and there is very little circulation space.

    I know any kind of standing isn't ideal for most journeys (especially with such a volume of people in the South East) however, a Pacer just isn't the best train for standees.
     
    Last edited: 31 Oct 2011
  22. Deerfold

    Deerfold Established Member

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    Having lived and commuted in Yorkshire and the South East it seems to be more dificult to get people to move down the carriage in Yorkshire - I've seen people left behind on infrequent routes with a fair bit of space left on the train.

    Odd as the chances of a friendly random conversation are higher in Yorkshire.

    And the train in the pic does seem busy but not full (having experienced severe overcrowding in both North and South).
    --- old post above --- --- new post below ---
    When I first tried to get from Kings Cross to my new office in Southwark I tried the Northern line. On my first attempt I got on the 5th train to arrive.

    Then I found the bus took about 25 minutes. Technically slightly longer than the train but almost guaranteed to get on the first one.
     
  23. Prodigy

    Prodigy Member

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    I'd imagine it's much easier to stand on a train in London than it is to stand on a Pacer in the North. Plus over 6 times the amount of passengers are able to Travel on South East services with 12 carriages compared to 2 or 4 carriages that most North West commuter services get.
     
  24. btcc fan

    btcc fan Member

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    Worst I have ever experienced was joining a Manchester Picadilly service to Blackpool at Salford Crescent at about 17:50 on a Friday ..

    On arrival to Salford Crescent the train (a 3 car 185) was already overcrowded, yet lots more wanted to join and did. Was very interesting experience till Bolton when a load of people got off.
     
  25. WestCoast

    WestCoast Established Member

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    Manchester to Preston is rammed at peak times, especially between Manchester and Bolton.

    As for the South East, well it's a major problem that isn't going to away and can't be solved all that easily.

    In the Netherlands, peak times see 12-coach double deckers (= 24 carriages of seating), it's impressive! You thought 12-coach services were large in the South East!
     
    Last edited: 31 Oct 2011
  26. Prodigy

    Prodigy Member

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    Won't work if you're getting off at Preston obviously but if you're gettong at Bolton you want to avoid most of the cramming between the Manchester and Bolton get on the services to Bolton from Manchester Victoria instead of Picadilly if you can, almost always manage to get a seat.
     
  27. YorkshireBear

    YorkshireBear Established Member

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    yes but huddersfield manchester victoria is 1 an hour :)
     
  28. Deerfold

    Deerfold Established Member

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    More frequent during the peaks. Briefly.
     
  29. ChiefPlanner

    ChiefPlanner Established Member

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    You would be amazed how many people can pack into a 313 or a 319 - that looks uncomfortable , but I have witnessed and travelled on much worse - about 28 into a 319door vestibule and around 28 into the 1st class section on a 319/4 is about the limit - with all gangways and inter seat stowage areas claimed.

    Makes quite a difference to the braking too , let alone the suspension - the air bag really work !!!
     
  30. Minstral25

    Minstral25 Established Member

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    When 10x times the number of passengers waiting to get on then 6x the space isn't much good and whilst I am told a Pacer is a bit bouncy it's just as hard standing in London as it is up North.

    A genuine plan to increase all train lengths across the country is very necessary. The real war is between DaFT and the commuter not North v South East as the overcrowding is just as bad. If Cameron thinks that we need more investment on capital plans in this country then he needs to get on with Station extensions and buying more rolling stock.

    At my local station [and line] it has 12 coach capacity but only 2 trains per day are 12 coach in length and trains do leave people behind. Although we are getting a third to much fanfare!
     
  31. WestCoast

    WestCoast Established Member

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    Standing in crowded conditions is not pleasant at all. However, I would argue that some trains are more suited to standing passengers than others. There are examples of both in all areas of the country.

    You're right about extensions to 12-car (and consistent 4-8 car services in the North). If the country wants to maintain and increase it's mobility, I personally think it's the only way.

    It's a great shame that double-deckers cannot be used IMO, having seen the 'crowd eaters' at work on the continent, it would be a natural progression after 12-car services in SE England.
     
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