Scotrail HSTs - 4-5 years in

[jagardner1984]

Given how closely linked Scotrail now is to government, it is surprising this isn’t more of a political story as to the decision making around this project and the intended versus delivered results. And gives one explanation as to the management desire for secrecy.

I guess big unfinished ferries in Port Glasgow provide a more visual representation of failure on the front of a newspaper.

 

[50002Superb]

Unfortunately my usual source advised a couple months ago, that ScotRail were not wanting this precise information made public anymore.

Consequently, I no longer get updates beyond which sets are in service day-to-day (which you can get off RTT normally anyway).

My most recent info from 2 months ago is that four sets are stood down, leaving 21 for traffic as I advised previously.

The same two powers are still out of service at Haymarket - 128 & 169.

The fleet is otherwise the same as the previous update I gave; no further 2+5s have been made up.

Did you say which four were stood down? Apologies there’s so much off topic stuff on this thread now it might have got lost in the noise

 

[hexagon789]

Did you say which four were stood down? Apologies there’s so much off topic stuff on this thread now it might have got lost in the noise

Supposed to be -

H02, 08, 12 and 23.

 

[50002Superb]

Supposed to be -

H02, 08, 12 and 23.

Sorry, I thought you meant the HSTs not the sets!!

 

[43096]

Sorry, I thought you meant the HSTs not the sets!!

An HST is the trailers plus power cars!

 

[hexagon789]

Sorry, I thought you meant the HSTs not the sets!!

Ah no, sorry. The trailer sets.

The power cars are all available for traffic bar the two involved in Carmont (030 and 140), plus 128 and 169 as advised above.

So they’re not at all embarrassed that 43128 has never turned a wheel in service for ScotRail after over 4 years?

Never been my impression. Last I heard it was effectively a 'Xmas tree' inside.

 

[50002Superb]

Ah no, sorry. The trailer sets.

The power cars are all available for traffic bar the two involved in Carmont (030 and 140), plus 128 and 169 as advised above.


Never been my impression. Last I heard it was effectively a 'Xmas tree' inside.

Thanks again, do you know where the Carmont ‘power cars’ went to?

I believe 030 is at Kilmarnock but not seen it confirmed

 

[43096]

Thanks again, do you know where the Carmont ‘power cars’ went to?

I believe 030 is at Kilmarnock but not seen it confirmed

43030 is at Kilmarnock. 43140 was disposed of for scrap in April 2021.

 

[Railperf]

Any increases in HST diagrams planned for May onwards?

 

[hexagon789]

Any increases in HST diagrams planned for May onwards?

No.

Quite simply - no.

 

[John Bishop]

Any increases in HST diagrams planned for May onwards?

They’re still nowhere near getting the current diagrams running properly without failures and short forms. I don't think we will ever see an increase in booked HST workings moving forward, it simply isn’t practical or sustainable. That’s the sad reality.

 

[50002Superb]

43030 is at Kilmarnock. 43140 was disposed of for scrap in April 2021.

Understood, thanks.

Do they still store anything at Slateford?

 

[CJSwan]

Understood, thanks.

Do they still store anything at Slateford?

Quite a lot of the yet to be used fifth carriages I think

 

[jagardner1984]

Quite a lot of the yet to be used fifth carriages I think

There might be another motorhome hiding behind them

Best go get a Blue tent.

(Tongue very firmly in cheek).

 

[BRX]

No.

Quite simply - no.

How about 5th carriages being added?

 

[hexagon789]

How about 5th carriages being added?

Again, no.

In fact, if the same person who informed me about HA02, 08, 12 and 23 is correct - they may well never be added.

 

[ld0595]

Again, no.

In fact, if the same person who informed me about HA02, 08, 12 and 23 is correct - they may well never be added.

What an absolute waste.

 

[Davester50]

In this thread @Bald Rick said:

They were, and are, very very expensive to lease and operate.

If there is any retrenchment in the Scotrail fleet due to a reduction in demand post Coivd, I’ll have a tenner on these being the first out the door.

Hope you get those tenners in now.

I know hindsight is wonderful, but it didn't take a genius to see the project was quite terrible.

Called it up there with the Ferry scandal here too.

 

[hexagon789]

In this thread @Bald Rick said:

Hope you get those tenners in now.

I know hindsight is wonderful, but it didn't take a genius to see the project was quite terrible.

Called it up there with the Ferry scandal here too.

For the time being at least, we will likely see simply a continuation of the 15/13 diagrams as now but obviously with the same substitutions over reliability caveat.

 

[Davester50]

For the time being at least, we will likely see simply a continuation of the 15/13 diagrams as now but obviously with the same substitutions over reliability caveat.

We've heard previously that there's a guaranteed lease period until 2030

The ScotRail HSTs are covered by a Section 54 agreement that covers their lease through to 2030.

Will the seemingly rejected sets and unused additional cars have to be paid for for another 7 years even if they're sitting out of service, unless a settlement with the owner can be made?

 

[50002Superb]

Quite a lot of the yet to be used fifth carriages I think

Thank you, I am up in a couple of weeks and wanting to plan where I need to visit

 

[hexagon789]

We've heard previously that there's a guaranteed lease period until 2030

Exactly, I wasn't intending to suggest that we were suddenly going to see a change there - hence my choice of 'continuation'.

Will the seemingly rejected sets and unused additional cars have to be paid for for another 7 years even if they're sitting out of service, unless a settlement with the owner can be made?

I assume so.

 

[Davester50]

I assume so.

Wonderful.

 

[hexagon789]

Wonderful.

I'll ask someone about that, but they may not be able to give me a straight answer you understand

 

[Davester50]

I'll ask someone about that, but they may not be able to give me a straight answer you understand

Thank you.
I take it the 4 sets mentioned (HA02, 08, 12 and 23) have all operated in service at some point, or are some like the 5th cars and never been used?
I've seen aircraft rejected and returned to the lessor as they've had "issues", so I could see a similarity to that, but if they've been used...

 

[hexagon789]

Thank you.
I take it the 4 sets mentioned (HA02, 08, 12 and 23) have all operated in service at some point, or are some like the 5th cars and never been used?
I've seen aircraft rejected and returned to the lessor as they've had "issues", so I could see a similarity to that, but if they've been used...

I believe they have all worked passenger services, but under different set numbers.

Remarkably, a full 15 sets out today (27/04). First time in a while.

 

[chuff chuff]

43128 is supposedly being put back together how long that will take god knows but there's another power car sitting just inside the number two road in the shed that has been missing it's end light covers for a number of weeks does anyone know what number this one is?

 

[InvHst]

12s not been withdrawn it's currently in Inverness under big exam. 128s not far away from a return can't put a timeframe on that but it's coming back. Same amount of diagrams from May however with a potential increase of 2 plus 5 sets across the network but a consideration for Inverness due to only having platform 1 and 2 currently available to fit them

 

[route101]

How is the Aberdeen to Inverness route for catching an HST?

 

[hexagon789]

How is the Aberdeen to Inverness route for catching an HST?

In terms of number of booked workings or chance of booked workings being kept?