Thameslink/ Class 700 Progress

[jon0844]

No it goes back far further. For example Southern 3 years before the next franchise was due to start going to see DfT to tell them they need to fund massive driver recruitment and programme on the existing FCC and Southern franchises including increasing the scale of the driver training set up to cope with the scale of the task needed (the bottleneck 377/5 has pointed out especially with all the new stock and cascades). Govia there for have very good evidence that DfT goofed up very early on and DfT probably don't want this to surface. This isn't the only example either.
The driver numbers on FCC dropped faster after bid submission date than before which would have left all the bidders with a bigger issue to solve on driver training than DfT anticipated.

If that's true, I apologise to GTR. Indeed, I have always said that most of the problems are of the DfT's doing (like making GTR do its dirty work). The problem is that once Govia realised it wasn't going to make any money, it had no incentive to do much thereafter.

So, the DfT gets most of the blame - yet GTR doesn't get off scot-free by a long shot.

 

[bramling]

If that's true, I apologise to GTR. Indeed, I have always said that most of the problems are of the DfT's doing (like making GTR do its dirty work). The problem is that once Govia realised it wasn't going to make any money, it had no incentive to do much thereafter.

So, the DfT gets most of the blame - yet GTR doesn't get off scot-free by a long shot.

I think that's largely a fair summary. DFT and their putrid Thameslink Programme are guilty as hell in this mess, but GTR have made things worse. Their employee relations is utterly appalling, and there are things they could have done to reduce the impact of the various issues, like running longer trains where possible or implementing emergency timetables, yet instead they've just chosen to do the bare minimum. Then we see rubbish like the first-class situation on the 387s - it may seem like a trivial thing, but if you're a commuter trying to board one of the affected busy services in the morning peak (paying £XXXX per year for the privilege) then it's a pretty major inconvenience.

 

[jon0844]

First class was poorly signed on GN 317 and 321s from when they took over, so they already showed signs of not caring much long before they had to deal with the guard 'issue'.

The Key is also another area where they've shown little interest in doing anything more than they had to (namely offer season tickets on a smartcard).

More to the point, staff I know said very quickly after the changeover that morale dropped off a cliff. It wasn't perhaps obvious then, but does seem clear now. Finding someone who works for GTR that doesn't openly slag them off to customers is probably quite hard. And normally you'd think that this was very risky as you don't know who you're talking to.

But eventually people don't seem to care. It gets to the point where people almost want to be sacked to end the misery.

Now I don't know if all staff see things that negatively, but the ones who face the public and have probably had nasty (and unjustified) comments thrown at them are certainly not best pleased.

 

[physics34]

I think that's largely a fair summary. DFT and their putrid Thameslink Programme are guilty as hell in this mess, but GTR have made things worse. Their employee relations is utterly appalling, and there are things they could have done to reduce the impact of the various issues, like running longer trains where possible or implementing emergency timetables, yet instead they've just chosen to do the bare minimum. Then we see rubbish like the first-class situation on the 387s - it may seem like a trivial thing, but if you're a commuter trying to board one of the affected busy services in the morning peak (paying £XXXX per year for the privilege) then it's a pretty major inconvenience.

They have minimal staff at all levels due to cost cutting. Basically things like passenger comfort are right at the bottom of priorities.

 

[Deepgreen]

700005 on the 1638 from Blackfriars to Three Bridges had only half of its internal lighting working, at least in the several cars I could see along the train. Is this another known issue?

 

[ScotGG]

Everything people describe was evident on GoVia's Southeastern franchise going back years led by Charles Horton (now the head of GTR)

 

[bramling]

Everything people describe was evident on GoVia's Southeastern franchise going back years led by Charles Horton (now the head of GTR)

Does anyone, anywhere, have a good word to say about Charles Horton?

Everyone who speaks of him, no matter where he's worked, seems to speak very negatively.

 

[Class377/5]

Does anyone, anywhere, have a good word to say about Charles Horton?

Everyone who speaks of him, no matter where he's worked, seems to speak very negatively.

Prior to him joining GTR I'd heard good things about him from colleagues in the industry. However we are very off topic.

 

[Class377/5]

700030 ran as the following overnight 06/02/17

3Z01 23+45 Three Bridges Depot to Littlehampton via Arundel
3Z02 02+58 Littlehampton to Three Bridges Depot via Hove and Haywards Heath

This was following first

First ever 700 between Horsham and Littlehampton
First ever 700 between Littlehampton and Worthing
First 700/0 RLU between Worthing and Preston Park via Hove

 

[Hophead]

700030 ran as the following overnight 06/02/17

3Z01 23+45 Three Bridges Depot to Littlehampton via Arundel
3Z02 02+58 Littlehampton to Three Bridges Depot via Hove and Haywards Heath

This was following first

First ever 700 between Horsham and Littlehampton
First ever 700 between Littlehampton and Worthing
First 700/0 RLU between Worthing and Preston Park via Hove

Without wishing to go back over the last 500 posts or so, this implies 700s have done Three Bridges - Horsham before then?

 

[Class377/5]

Without wishing to go back over the last 500 posts or so, this implies 700s have done Three Bridges - Horsham before then?

Yes. One 8 car has been to Horsham Sidings. I don't know when but we had a brief with a picture of a unit in there.

 

[urpert]

700005 on the 1638 from Blackfriars to Three Bridges had only half of its internal lighting working, at least in the several cars I could see along the train. Is this another known issue?

I was on one on Saturday with the same affliction. I'd assumed it was just a case of 'wrong button pressed in cab'.

 

[Minstral25]

700030 ran as the following overnight 06/02/17

3Z01 23+45 Three Bridges Depot to Littlehampton via Arundel
3Z02 02+58 Littlehampton to Three Bridges Depot via Hove and Haywards Heath

This was following first

First ever 700 between Horsham and Littlehampton
First ever 700 between Littlehampton and Worthing
First 700/0 RLU between Worthing and Preston Park via Hove

Just interested - Where are we with deliveries please? - 700030 in service (or at least test) would suggest 30 8-cars delivered and a post the other day said 700036 was at Bedford so perhaps more?

 

[Bald Rick]

Just interested - Where are we with deliveries please? - 700030 in service (or at least test) would suggest 30 8-cars delivered and a post the other day said 700036 was at Bedford so perhaps more?

Post #6786 is your friend

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I have just seen a post on a Yahoogroup saying 700 040 is on the way; it has been seen near Calais.

 

[Minstral25]

Post #6786 is your friend

Ahh!! I searched on delivery instead of deliveries - Thank you

 

[SF-02]

I have just seen a post on a Yahoogroup saying 700 040 is on the way; it has been seen near Calais.

Ohh speeding up deliveries? Good to see

 

[Class377/5]

Tomorrows 700040 will be the 46th delivery. That's leaves 69 deliveries left. Previous announcement was all units ready around May 2018 so that leaves 64 weeks (taking two weeks off around festive period) so one a week with the occasionally twice weekly to maintain the plan of all units ready by end of May next year.

 

[fusionblue]

Tomorrows 700040 will be the 44th delivery. That's leaves 71 deliveries left. Previous announcement was all units ready around May 2018 so that leaves 64 weeks (taking two weeks off around creative period) so one a week with the occasionally twice weekly to maintain the plan of all units ready by end of May next year.

What's a creative period?

I have a mental image of all the factory staff and train drivers sitting around painting and doing pottery

 

[traji00]

What's a creative period?



I have a mental image of all the factory staff and train drivers sitting around painting and doing pottery

Most likely a typo - I think he means 'festive period'.

 

[Class377/5]

What's a creative period?

I have a mental image of all the factory staff and train drivers sitting around painting and doing pottery

Most likely a typo - I think he means 'festive period'.

Indeed I do. What I get for messaging on the way home after a long day!

 

[Deepgreen]

Indeed I do. What I get for messaging on the way home after a long day!

Your own little creative period!

 

[spark001uk]

Without trawling back to the most recent diagrams, is Sevenoaks seeing much 700 working yet?

On that note, perhaps 377/5 if you passed the latest diagram updates to OP he wouldn't mind posting it at #1 for us? Just a thought.

 

[W230]

Without trawling back to the most recent diagrams, is Sevenoaks seeing much 700 working yet?

Yes. There's certainly a 09.42hrs arrival that i've driven a few times and i've seen a couple more in service around then. They're also used later in the day too though not sure when off the top of my head.

 

[ComUtoR]

Yes. There's certainly a 09.42hrs arrival that i've driven a few times and i've seen a couple more in service around then. They're also used later in the day too though not sure when off the top of my head.

The arrival before it is also a 700 but today it was a 319 :/

 

[spark001uk]

Uh oh, they're falling apart already! Just got up off the seat on 109 and the cushion came with me!!

Yes. There's certainly a 09.42hrs arrival that i've driven a few times and i've seen a couple more in service around then. They're also used later in the day too though not sure when off the top of my head.

OK cheers. Just got on at Catford about an hour ago and it was a pair of 319s, and the one going the other way.

 

[tsr]

Uh oh, they're falling apart already! Just got up off the seat on 109 and the cushion came with me!!

I believe the seat cushions are designed to be able to be swapped easily, for example by cleaners. Perhaps a little too easily!

 

[Class377/5]

Without trawling back to the most recent diagrams, is Sevenoaks seeing much 700 working yet?

On that note, perhaps 377/5 if you passed the latest diagram updates to OP he wouldn't mind posting it at #1 for us? Just a thought.

As that doesn't exist and I had to build everything myself it's quite easy to be cut and pasted every time I update. Or have a 700 diagrams thread?

 

[Failed Unit]

As that doesn't exist and I had to build everything myself it's quite easy to be cut and pasted every time I update. Or have a 700 diagrams thread?

Maybe a moderator could put it on the frequently requested diagram thread.

 

[Bungle965]

Maybe a moderator could put it on the frequently requested diagram thread.

I feel there would be far too many diagrams for it to be on the thread. Not to say that I would not like to see it, I would. But diagrams are being updated all the time with more and more units arriving so I imagine that the mod would find it difficult to keep on top of.
Sam