Which little-used stations might be candidates for closure in the new age of cost-cutting?

[HSTEd]

If we consider that Manchester Airport is always going to have long distance services, Mauldeth Road, Burnage and East Didsbury are a faff - the former two served reasonably by bus, the latter has a tram stop and frequent (if slow) buses, though I doubt they would go as Burnham would make too much of a fuss about it.

I really don't agree with this - as I've said before and no doubt will say again, Manchester Airport long distance services are supposedly justified on the basis of a "single seat ride" for people with heavy luggage.

Which means the utility of those services will not be seriously degraded if we just made every long distance train from Picadilly to the Airport stop all stations - which then gives us an ersatz metro line in South Manchester at very little actual cost.

Given the dire state of the Manchester bus system, even on the supposed "Bus Priority corridor", axing the rail service is insane

 

[BeijingDave]

Ideally, Manchester Airport services should probably be optimised to take as many people as possible from towns in its catchment area which are a bit too expensive to get a taxi from - that is, services from places like Chester, Stoke-on-Trent, Wigan, arriving as early as 06:00.

Anyone from Burnage or East Didsbury is probably going to get relatives to drop them off or a taxi. Anyone from Cleethorpes will be using Leeds-Bradford if at all possible.

 

[The Planner]

Coventry Arena, since due to rolling stock resourcing issues, it is closed when it could be most used - on match days

Thats also down to the NUCKLE scheme never getting anywhere. There is a crossover meant to go in south of the station to allow for terminators.

 

[supervc-10]

Having lived in south Manchester, there's a good reason why I used to take the train from Maudleth Road despite it being quite a walk despite the buses available. I trust the train, I don't trust the bus! The number of times I'd be waiting for a bus for 20+ minutes past its scheduled time was ridiculous. Not everyone wants to take a taxi or persuade a relative/friend to take them to the airport, and we need to be encouraging public transport use, not pushing people back into private cars or taxis.

 

[BeijingDave]

Having lived in south Manchester, there's a good reason why I used to take the train from Maudleth Road despite it being quite a walk despite the buses available. I trust the train, I don't trust the bus! The number of times I'd be waiting for a bus for 20+ minutes past its scheduled time was ridiculous. Not everyone wants to take a taxi or persuade a relative/friend to take them to the airport, and we need to be encouraging public transport use, not pushing people back into private cars or taxis.

I agree but I think it would be best optimised to serve those people with longer car journeys.

 

[mike57]

Haven't seen Arram mentioned in the thread. 5 north bound services and 4 southbound currently, Prior to covid around 1500 passengers per year, last year down to 98. Another of those stations that probably costs very little to keep open. When the Hull - Brid stoppers are reintroduced one could argue that it might be worth stopping all the local services to see if passenger numbers can be improved. If they dont then after a year or so it goes back to a ghost station. Although rural there are quite a few settlements around the area so it might be better used if it was publicised and more useful.

I think the reason that there is so much opposition to closures now has been touched on earlier in the thread, people are worried it will be the thin end of the wedge (which it probably will be being cynical of things where politics is involved).

Equally if services are improved usage does increase, our local station Bempton was running at around 12,000 - 13,000 per year prior to 2019, but when the hourly service was introduced usage went up to approx 16,000 in 2019-2020 even although Covid took a bite out of usage for the last month or so.

Circumstances change, and the problem is if a station is closed there will then be pressure to sell it off, demolish etc. You then cant get it back easily, even if needs change. Really, with a few very rare exceptions I think the no closures without a painful process is the right one as it seems to be the only way to preserve the infrastructure. Politicans (of any party) 'guarantees' are not worth the paper they written on.

 

[supervc-10]

I agree but I think it would be best optimised to serve those people with longer car journeys.

I'm not sure if cutting out those stops, which are part of regular Northern stopping services to Crewe from Piccadilly or Liverpool, are going to do much for those who are taking the train from further afield. There are already a lot of destinations served by direct trains from the airport. Let's not forget too that MAN is gaining a stop on HS2 as well. I appreciate that the Styal line is pretty full- but removing the existing commuter services to start longer distance routes isn't really going to fix that.

 

[philthetube]

Berney Arms does serve *some* purpose in terms of being used by walkers and ramblers. I’ve used it - okay admittedly mainly to photograph the station, but we were by no means the only people to alight, and that was on a weekday. The cost of maintaining it can’t be that great, though if it was ever decided to dispense with the line then that would of course be another matter.

Berney Arms in an interesting one, I use it a couple of times a year, admittedly whe the weather is nice, but I have never been the only one to leave the train in a morning. I suspect that the official usage numbers are far lower than actual, because of large numbers of passengers, including myself, who Buy tickets to Yarmouth and then walk to elsewhere from Berney Arms, you can certainly up the usage figures by 2 annually just for me.

I wonder if any other stations have similar situations.

 

[bramling]

Berney Arms in an interesting one, I use it a couple of times a year, admittedly whe the weather is nice, but I have never been the only one to leave the train in a morning. I suspect that the official usage numbers are far lower than actual, because of large numbers of passengers, including myself, who Buy tickets to Yarmouth and then walk to elsewhere from Berney Arms, you can certainly up the usage figures by 2 annually just for me.

I wonder if any other stations have similar situations.

Yes we certainly didn’t buy a ticket to Berney Arms. Can’t remember as it was a few years ago, but it would have either been a simple return to Yarmouth, or we used boxes. Probably the latter actually, as we did something strange afterwards like a trip to Lowestoft and back to Norwich in time to catch the 3x321 evening service to London. A good little day out as it happened.

 

[yorksrob]

The station is on its own branch line! You could close the entire stretch of track.

It's not a branchline, is the alternative route to great Yarmouth which avoids the problem of having it at the end of a single track branch.

 

[bramling]

It's not a branchline, is the alternative route to great Yarmouth which avoids the problem of having it at the end of a single track branch.

Yes I always understood it was retained because the Acle route was deemed not to provide enough capacity for the busiest times. Whether that still applies nowadays is of course another matter!

 

[YorksLad12]

I'm not sure I'd consider it a "relocation" really. It's only moving to the other side of the nearby overbridge, some stations have staggered platforms as far apart as that.

I think we'll have to agree to disagree on this one. It's a proper relocation for me because it's moving to the other side of the junction (and allowing for services between Huddersfield and Wakefield to call), though I get that it's probably only 160m from the western edge of the current station to the eastern edge of the new one.

 

[yorksrob]

Yes I always understood it was retained because the Acle route was deemed not to provide enough capacity for the busiest times. Whether that still applies nowadays is of course another matter!

Well, in the new leisure focused railway, can we afford to destroy capacity to an important tourist destination !

 

[bramling]

Well, in the new leisure focused railway, can we afford to destroy capacity to an important tourist destination !

The answer may well be yes if that capacity is only required for a few weeks in the summer.

Not saying that’s the case as I don’t really know what the current score is with Yarmouth, though in all honesty why anyone would want to go there for a day out, let alone a holiday, is completely anathema to me!

 

[yorksrob]

The answer may well be yes if that capacity is only required for a few weeks in the summer.

Not saying that’s the case as I don’t really know what the current score is with Yarmouth, though in all honesty why anyone would want to go there for a day out, let alone a holiday, is completely anathema to me!

Well, it's not the Champs Elysees, but take a stroll down Yarmouth promenade in the summer and you'll find plenty of people enjoying themselves

 

[BJames]

Most trains reverse short of it, I think as it saves a couple of minutes. It serves very little.

That's correct - I've been down to Looe a few times and have never been on the train that stops at Coombe Junction Halt - think it's one or two in each direction Mon-Sat. The other trains reverse outside of it.

 

[bramling]

That's correct - I've been down to Looe a few times and have never been on the train that stops at Coombe Junction Halt - think it's one or two in each direction Mon-Sat. The trains reverse outside of it.

When staying locally, we got up early one morning to ride it (essentially to tick those couple of chains of track off in the proverbial book!). No one got one or off there, and I can’t imagine how it would be used by any “genuine” passengers. But equally the cost of retaining it must be pretty minimal.

The only other station in Cornwall which I’d say is properly superfluous is Lelant Saltings, since the park and ride moved. I suppose one could make a case for Lelant too, but one suspects that would be better used if it had a regular service.

I’d agree there’s at least two stations on the Barnstaple line which could be pruned without causing upset. Chapelton and Portsmouth Arms. Kings Nymphton and Lapford possibly as well. The latter is virtually unusable as the access is incredibly dangerous requiring walking along a busy road over a bridge with a blind corner.

On a different note, Llangunllo on the Central Wales Line might as well close too. The adjacent house or houses seem to have done their best to enclave the station as their own. A rather awkward experience for anyone to actually use it.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

I think we'll have to agree to disagree on this one. It's a proper relocation for me because it's moving to the other side of the junction (and allowing for services between Huddersfield and Wakefield to call), though I get that it's probably only 160m from the western edge of the current station to the eastern edge of the new one.

Having just checked the plans again, you're right. The junction itself is also moving and the formation being massively rebuilt, so it's hard to place where the new stuff will be in relation to what's there now!

 

[Bletchleyite]

Well, in the new leisure focused railway, can we afford to destroy capacity to an important tourist destination !

Could it instead be provided by longer trains?

 

[70014IronDuke]

Invershin or Culrain? Surely at least one could go without anyone noticing?

 

[Kite159]

Gilfach Fargoed.

Close enough to Bargoed for any genuine users to walk to Bargoed, and would get rid of some tiny platforms. Depends what the platform structure is like.

 

[D6130]

Invershin or Culrain? Surely at least one could go without anyone noticing?

Not really. There's no road crossing over the Kyle of Sutherland for some considerable distance, so the only way to reach one village from the other is either by train....or on foot/cycle via the footpath alongside the railway bridge.

 

[AGH]

Sankey for Penketh must be on its last days. Warrington West hasn't worked out as planned but too close to each other to be sustainable

 

[70014IronDuke]

Not really. There's no road crossing over the Kyle of Sutherland for some considerable distance, so the only way to reach one village from the other is either by train....or on foot/cycle via the footpath alongside the railway bridge.

I accept that I'm an armchair planner here, but even so, given the very poor usage figures (even pre-Covid), couldn't those few people in the one village to lose its station manage the walk? Since even the morning 'semi-fast' into Inverness doesn't stop at one of the two (surprisingly, perhaps), that surely shows how much Scotrail values the traffic potential of the settlements.

I know it won't happen (to save maybe 2 minutes max, not worth the political fall out), but you'd think it might be considered. These two stops make Harling Road look genuinely busy.

 

[RPI]

Lelant Saltings has to be a candidate, to ever put it back in would cause a significant performance issue as Carbis Bay now has every train calling, also Lelant is within easy walking distance.

 

[The exile]

Gilfach Fargoed.

Close enough to Bargoed for any genuine users to walk to Bargoed, and would get rid of some tiny platforms. Depends what the platform structure is like.

While I agree that Gilfach Fargoed is a curiosity, we have to be careful with the argument that “station x is close enough to station y to walk” as it assumes that people are starting from station x - not already walking there from the opposite direction. Might not be enough to justify retaining station x, but needs to be kept under consideration.

 

[Gathursty]

Clifton (Manchester) which for some reason has a defibrilator outside. There's some foot traffic with walks along the Irwell nearby, some houses and a factory but the service level is rubbish, just like Ardwick. Ryder Brow and Belle Vue are also stations where buses probably take more of the local custom in that part of Manchester.

As much as I really like Wennington, I don't think it is near enough of a population.

Finally, Salwick.

 

[Ken H]

Clifton (Manchester) which for some reason has a defibrilator outside. There's some foot traffic with walks along the Irwell nearby, some houses and a factory but the service level is rubbish, just like Ardwick. Ryder Brow and Belle Vue are also stations where buses probably take more of the local custom in that part of Manchester.

As much as I really like Wennington, I don't think it is near enough of a population.

Finally, Salwick.

If you are going for Wennington, think Clapham N Yorks. Nowhere near anywhere. Downgrade to a request stop or put it out of its misery. Clapham has a half decent bus service.

 

[Neptune]

If you are going for Wennington, think Clapham N Yorks. Nowhere near anywhere. Downgrade to a request stop or put it out of its misery. Clapham has a half decent bus service.

Clapham has higher user figures than Wennington so it must be doing something better.

 

[Basil Jet]

Clapham has higher user figures than Wennington so it must be doing something better.

It must be all the people getting off the omnibus.