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15/08/17 Waterloo derailment and disruption (latter likely to continue to 16/8)

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hwl

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Cranes are apparently something of a last resort nowadays. I read an article about the subject a while ago that said the typical railway breakdown crane of the past wasn't worth having nowadays, because derailments are so few and far between, and the vast majority are now re-railed by jacking.

Back when there were loads of cranes all over the network they were collectively dealing with thousands of incidents per year...

The few big cranes around are completely booked up on specific infrastructure tasks.

There is a Kirow 800 just meters away in this case but an easy jacking job which is safer and less risky.
 
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coursemyhorse

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I don't really understand why the advice is not to travel tomorrow. Why will there be delays tomorrow which is now 8 hours away from the first morning trains. It's already been 16 hours since the derailment. How long does it take to re-rail a train and move it out of the way?
 

hwl

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I don't really understand why the advice is not to travel tomorrow. Why will there be delays tomorrow which is now 8 hours away from the first morning trains. It's already been 16 hours since the derailment. How long does it take to re-rail a train and move it out of the way?

They will still probably be an extra 3 platforms down (same as today) until the damage to the track is repaired. You also appear to assume the train will be moveable without repairs
 
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bb21

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I don't really understand why the advice is not to travel tomorrow. Why will there be delays tomorrow which is now 8 hours away from the first morning trains. It's already been 16 hours since the derailment. How long does it take to re-rail a train and move it out of the way?

No one is saying don't travel, however disruption is likely so plan accordingly if you need to. The residual impact from today will likely be felt tomorrow, especially in the morning peak, due to stock and crew displacement, etc.

You then also have the complication of a reduction in capacity as stated above, with likely cancellations.
 

tsr

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;) They aren't all booked up but you are correct enougth

Well, two cranes had just been booked at slightly short notice to go to a little incident in East Anglia...

They will still probably be an extra 3 platforms down (same as today) until the damage to the track is repaired. You also appear to assume the train will be moveable without repairs

... and that the signalling is in full working order, that said working order is still deemed safe (we don't know if there was a wrong-side signalling failure or not), and that none of it is quarantined or restricted in what it can do.
 

DelW

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Only 7 since the construction of the Linford St flyover connection for the old Eurostar route to Waterloo International.

There's 8 again by Vauxhall though. In fact I don't think there were ever 8 tracks all the way along the entire route, it was always a bit odd through Queenstown Rd on the Windsor side...

Indeed, nothing to do with the flyover, I have a Quail Southern Region map from 1981 and there were only 7 tracks through the area then. From the north, Up Windsor, Up Windsor fast, Down Windsor, UMF, DMF, UMS, DMS. It does look as though it's the Queenstown Road platform which obstructed an eighth track, but there may be earlier bridge structures in the way as well.
 

LeylandLen

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Cranes are apparently something of a last resort nowadays. I read an article about the subject a while ago that said the typical railway breakdown crane of the past wasn't worth having nowadays, because derailments are so few and far between, and the vast majority are now re-railed by jacking.

Back when there were loads of cranes all over the network they were collectively dealing with thousands of incidents per year...

The few big cranes around are completely booked up on specific infrastructure tasks.
Apparently one large railway crane has arrived at Ely having come from Wigan via Crewe to move the containers and attend to the derailed freight train at Ely West .
 
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spark001uk

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Looks like the UMF and DMF are now being used as far east as the West crossings.
Or I'm blind and they were always open! ;)
 

Railman

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Has anyone heard if the passenger train was leaving under clear signals or was it "talked past". looks like it hit the ballast train side on where the lines come together.
 

swt_passenger

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hwl

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Indeed, nothing to do with the flyover, I have a Quail Southern Region map from 1981 and there were only 7 tracks through the area then. From the north, Up Windsor, Up Windsor fast, Down Windsor, UMF, DMF, UMS, DMS. It does look as though it's the Queenstown Road platform which obstructed an eighth track, but there may be earlier bridge structures in the way as well.

The are "temporary" additional supports for the main span BML bridge just west of Queenstown Road restrict it to 7 tracks (in addition to the later Eurostar flyover)
see these image (not mine) shows of the support:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/steve...GeA-bXP22C-dhScUb-5adCrY-rguCQ9-DcRuan-ruH3WW

If the BML bridge supports were sorted (concrete instead) then the spare track bed between P1&" could be used but then the Eurostar flyover becomes an issue.
 
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spark001uk

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Just passed the scene on way into Waterloo, the 456 is now on the track, showing whites to the front and someone at the driver's seat. It appeared to be moving, slowly. The wagons had been moved clear to the West of it. AFAICS the 66 was no longer attached to the wagons. Although as per the cam stills it appears they've now been reattached and pulled into the platform.
 
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Taunton

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Seems to have been the first departure of the day from plats 11-13. As in previous incidents involving the first train of the day when there have been overnight works, a look at what was done in the night will be a first step.
 

SpacePhoenix

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Would any of the cabling for the points around where the derailment happened run under the area where the possession is or is the cabling run in trunking inside or alongside the platforms?
 

FOH

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Latest update on SWT website says P13 will be closed all day. P11/12 reopened first thing this morning but further damage was found and they've subsequently been closed.
 

swt_passenger

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Just after 0815 saw on the OTT live map a 5Z50 and a 5Z01 leave P11 and P12 in close succession via the UMR, the train IDs were not showing up on RTT, can someone confirm if they were yesterday's units? 5Z50 seemed to run to Clapham Yard, but I lost track of the other, 5Z01...
 

bb21

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5Z50 was indeed the incident train, 15mph to Clapham Yard.
 

Antman

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The 08.40 is just leaving Waterloo now and running fast to Guildford
 

GBM

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Completely routine in this situation.
First automatically test for drugs and alcohol anyone involved in any incident. Plus they also perform random tests for all staff. Most, if not all companies would have this process in place nowadays.
 

gavin

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Platforms 20 to 24 blocked due to a points failure
 
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