Class 458/5

[Class377/5]

Is that what this is on Tuesday?

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q02002/2013/11/26/advanced
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q02001/2013/11/26/advanced
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q01998/2013/11/26/advanced

I suspect not because there would presumably need to be an STP movement from Wimbledon Park to Clapham Yard first and I can't see one of those on Realtimetrains but I thought it was worth asking.

Those paths are timed for 100mph but aren't the 458/5 75mph units?

 

[JonathanH]

Those paths are timed for 100mph but aren't the 458/5 75mph units?

The pathing speed doesn't mean much on the Waterloo to Reading line given the maximum speed is IIRC 70mph.

 

[455driver]

the 379s spent quite a while with Bombardier fitters riding them- or at the very least, riding morning services to Cambridge and back to supervise the coupling to form the 12-car peak services.

So the drivers had to put up with some computer geek telling them how to couple some trains together!

I would have got out of the cab and said "if I cant be trusted to couple them up on my own, you do it" and then just stad there. Either the drivers are trained to do it or they are not.

As for the 458/5s not talking to each other (not sure on that one?) they wont talk to the Desiros because there is a bit of a height issue involved!

 

[306024]

The Bombardier chaps were there to ensure their train didn't misbehave, not to tell the driver how to do his job. Just good practice whenever a new train is introduced.

 

[Class377/5]

The Bombardier chaps were there to ensure their train didn't misbehave, not to tell the driver how to do his job. Just good practice whenever a new train is introduced.

They had to do that for 18 months after the introduction of the 377/5 fleet (not coupling but checking they behaved).

 

[Railengineer]

So the drivers had to put up with some computer geek telling them how to couple some trains together!

I would have got out of the cab and said "if I cant be trusted to couple them up on my own, you do it" and then just stad there. Either the drivers are trained to do it or they are not.

As for the 458/5s not talking to each other (not sure on that one?) they wont talk to the Desiros because there is a bit of a height issue involved!

Here we go..... another expert (airline pilot qualified?) driver ! Fitters are rarely 'computer geeks' as their title suggests.

 

[jopsuk]

So the drivers had to put up with some computer geek telling them how to couple some trains together!

I would have got out of the cab and said "if I cant be trusted to couple them up on my own, you do it" and then just stad there. Either the drivers are trained to do it or they are not.

As for the 458/5s not talking to each other (not sure on that one?) they wont talk to the Desiros because there is a bit of a height issue involved!

THey were there because there were reliability problems, where the drivers would follow correct procedure and the units would not talk. the "computer geek" could in that case try and debug it. From my position on the platform, it appeared (as they wandered from the coupled cabs to the driving cab for the service) that the drivers were getting on well with the fitters. I'd imagine that it will have made identifying the problems and putting in place a permanent fix simpler.

For better or worse, modern units are much more complicated than your beloved 455s.

 

[YorkshireBear]

Think you may have jumped the gun a little bit there 455driver. If they are there just to assist then i don't see why there should be a problem.

 

[455driver]

Think you may have jumped the gun a little bit there 455driver. If they are there just to assist then i don't see why there should be a problem.

I was replying to this bit-

supervise the coupling

Which makes it sound like they were, oh I dont know, supervising the coupling up! :roll:
Now if it had been posted that 'ensure the trains coupled properly' or 'checked for electrical problems during coupling' then fine but the line above makes it sound like the driver is operating under some 'Hornbyfixers' supervision!

 

[YorkshireBear]

I was replying to this bit-



Which makes it sound like they were, oh I dont know, supervising the coupling up! :roll:
Now if it had been posted that 'ensure the trains coupled properly' or 'checked for electrical problems during coupling' then fine but the line above makes it sound like the driver is operating under some 'Hornbyfixers' supervision!

I see your point, hadn't noticed supervise in the original post which makes your reply seem more reasonable

 

[455driver]

THey were there because there were reliability problems, where the drivers would follow correct procedure and the units would not talk. the "computer geek" could in that case try and debug it. From my position on the platform, it appeared (as they wandered from the coupled cabs to the driving cab for the service) that the drivers were getting on well with the fitters. I'd imagine that it will have made identifying the problems and putting in place a permanent fix simpler.

For better or worse, modern units are much more complicated than your beloved 455s.

So why didnt you post that then instead of your

supervise the coupling

line, it would have saved Hornbyfixer blowing a gasket!

Maybe I need a crystalball so I can see what you meant to say over and above what was written.

That last line is meant in a humourous fashion!

The line above is to inform those with no discernable sense of humour just in case they dont 'get' it!

 

[cjmillsnun]

As for the 458/5s not talking to each other (not sure on that one?) they wont talk to the Desiros because there is a bit of a height issue involved!

Ooops. Someone screwed up there. I thought they were supposed to be able to couple mechanically for emergency purposes?

 

[Shrub Hill]

Last time I was in the depot, their were some incredibly qualified engineers with state of the art hammers giving it a wack!

 

[Techniquest]

Ooops. Someone screwed up there. I thought they were supposed to be able to couple mechanically for emergency purposes?

Supposed to be the case (according to the article on 458/5s in the current copy of Todays Railways UK) that a 444 or 450 can couple up in a rescue situation, with no such planned workings currently involving a mixed pair.

Should be interesting to see what happens there then...

 

[Monty]

Ooops. Someone screwed up there. I thought they were supposed to be able to couple mechanically for emergency purposes?

They should be able to mechanically, but to my knowledge the Desiro and Juniper TMS will not communicate with each other nor will they have any brake continuity. The Desiro in effect would be dragging a dead unit in every sense of the word. There was an issue with the coupling height between the first two 458/5 units but this has been corrected, the current problem is the units will not 'talk' to each other as they should.

 

[4-6-2 Coast]

They should be able to mechanically, but to my knowledge the Desiro and Juniper TMS will not communicate with each other nor will they have any brake continuity. The Desiro in effect would be dragging a dead unit in every sense of the word. There was an issue with the coupling height between the first two 458/5 units but this has been corrected, the current problem is the units will not 'talk' to each other as they should.

Rode the District Line to Wimbledon this afternoon and saw both units out in the yard, coupled together and creeping along. A number of engineers were walking alongside, paying close attention to the join between them.

So maybe progress is being made? (Or maybe one unit was dragging the other!)

 

[Goldfish62]

Is that what this is on Tuesday?

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q02002/2013/11/26/advanced
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q02001/2013/11/26/advanced
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q01998/2013/11/26/advanced

I suspect not because there would presumably need to be an STP movement from Wimbledon Park to Clapham Yard first and I can't see one of those on Realtimetrains but I thought it was worth asking.

It was a pair of 450s. No idea what they were up to.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Rode the District Line to Wimbledon this afternoon and saw both units out in the yard, coupled together and creeping along. A number of engineers were walking alongside, paying close attention to the join between them.

Maybe so maybe progress is being made? (Or maybe one unit was dragging the other!)

Doesn't exactly bode well, does it? Back in September SWT were expecting the first pair in service by now. Given that many of the new stop boards have yet to be installed and that none of the new platform-end monitors are yet working would appear to indicate that service entry is not happening any time soon.

 

[455driver]

It was a pair of 450s. No idea what they were up to.

Possibly a driver training run, I have got the headcodes upstairs somewhere and those look familiar.

There are some that take a 455 from Clapham jn into Waterloo and down to Basingstoke and back as well.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
(not allowed to) Edit-

They are driver training runs but its normally 458s on that one.

 

[4-6-2 Coast]

Caught sight of both units between Wimbledon and Raynes Park this afternoon, on the up slow line and apparently moving at a normal speed. I think it's this one:

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q03733/2013/11/28/advanced

So it would appear whatever communication problem they were having between the units has been at least partially rectified. Seemed like a very long train as it went by...

Edit: Or perhaps it was this one:
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/O42063/2013/11/28/advanced

Not sure why there are two.

 

[Juniper Driver]

As for the 458/5s not talking to each other (not sure on that one?) they wont talk to the Desiros because there is a bit of a height issue involved!

I've heard there was some sort of computer problem of that ilk.I seem to remember working a 458 four car down to Reading (for the rush hour return) a year or two ago due to the same sort of problem.

 

[Goldfish62]

Caught sight of both units between Wimbledon and Raynes Park this afternoon, on the up slow line and apparently moving at a normal speed. I think it's this one:

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q03733/2013/11/28/advanced

So it would appear whatever communication problem they were having between the units has been at least partially rectified. Seemed like a very long train as it went by...

Edit: Or perhaps it was this one:
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/O42063/2013/11/28/advanced

Not sure why there are two.

The 5000 miles running in was said to be starting this week, so maybe it really has.:roll:

 

[Juniper Driver]

The 5000 miles running in was said to be starting this week, so maybe it really has.:roll:

If that's in the yard only it's going to take forever.

 

[4-6-2 Coast]

Another trip past Wimbledon this afternoon yielded an interesting sight: parked right next to the main line, one of the 458/5s was coupled up to a 450! Everything looked like it fitted correctly.

 

[Matt Taylor]

458531/534 coupled up outside Wimbledon since yesterday, saloon seating still wrapped in plastic

 

[Railengineer]

Think you may have jumped the gun a little bit there 455driver. If they are there just to assist then i don't see why there should be a problem.

Looks like a personal vendetta developing here? SWTDriver is currently my hero and knows EVERYTHING about railways. :roll:
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Another trip past Wimbledon this afternoon yielded an interesting sight: parked right next to the main line, one of the 458/5s was coupled up to a 450! Everything looked like it fitted correctly.

They were moving the pair up and down the yard as I went past this afternoon.

 

[Bigfoot]

10 car test ran from the Park to Staines then 2 return trips to Reading today before back to Wimbledon. Running Wed-Friday this week apparently.

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q04266/2013/12/04/advanced
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q04267/2013/12/04/advanced
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q04268/2013/12/04/advanced
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q04269/2013/12/04/advanced
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q04270/2013/12/04/advanced
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q04271/2013/12/04/advanced

 

[Goldfish62]

10 car test ran from the Park to Staines then 2 return trips to Reading today before back to Wimbledon. Running Wed-Friday this week apparently.

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q04266/2013/12/04/advanced
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q04267/2013/12/04/advanced
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q04268/2013/12/04/advanced
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q04269/2013/12/04/advanced
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q04270/2013/12/04/advanced
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/Q04271/2013/12/04/advanced

They've been running today.

They pulled into Martins Heron at about 1130 and the doors were released. The ASDO worked.

They certainly look like brand new trains and look much better than in photos. The door release chime is now a pleasant very subdued sound - unlike the awful eardrum-rupturing screech on current 458s. The destination screen above the gangway, though, is a complete waste of time. It's obscured by the gangway when viewed at platform level as the train is approaching.

Also, the large number of single seats and the mostly face-to-face configuration would explain why they have less seats than an SWT 455.

 

[swt_passenger]

When I saw it in Reading yesterday the chaps onboard said they were making dummy calls at all stations - that was my first close up view and it definitely does look much more spacious than before, as you point out.

However, I found that I could read the destination display OK as the train approached - I was stood by the platform end displays at Reading and could still read it in the train's stopped position, which is about a carriage length away from there?

 

[Uzair]

I'm guessing no one has been able to get a quick picture of it on the runs it's been doing?

 

[swt_passenger]

A couple showed up on flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/iainbrownston/11220488866/in/photostream/