Coal Falling Off

[sonic2009]

Train involved :

0347 Redcar B.S.C. Ore T. to MargamT.C.

Whilst awaiting the 1033 XC Birmingham service at Tamworth, the above freight passed through chucking a load of coal of in the process all over the platform, luckily nobody was injured.

Is there a set procedure if a load is too high like this, not only a danger to the public, but also other trains. I reported it to the Guard on the 1033, who has passed it on to his control, who will then pass it on to Network Rail.

What will happen to this train, will be stopped and the driver investigates?

 

[Tomnick]

Yes, the train should be brought to a stand (preferably somewhere convenient!) for the Driver to go back and have a look. I'm not sure, to be honest, what the Rule Book says should happen next, but I'd imagine it'd be allowed to run forward, at reduced speed if necessary, to a suitable location for it to be dealt with properly.

 

[tsr]

I would have been strongly inclined to use the Help Point, rather than wait until I found the guard of the next train! If there's a noticeable amount of the load coming off, the emergency button may be appropriate, as even a small bit of debris could injure someone if it hits them awkwardly.

The train should be stopped, I would think, yes.

 

[sonic2009]

I couldn't locate a help point and the next train came through 3 mins after.

As soon as I mentioned it to the guard he immediately phoned his control as he could see it on the platform.

 

[michael769]

Perhaps a good reason to have Network Rail's Emergency number handy.

It's 08457 11 41 41

 

[tsr]

Perhaps a good reason to have Network Rail's Emergency number handy.

It's 08457 11 41 41

Indeed. I actually have this on my smartphone's home screen (protected by a series of gestures to ensure I don't auto-dial it) as I figure I will need it sooner or later, given how much time I spend on trains and stations, and the easier it is to dial, the better.

 

[GB]

Train was stopped and examined with no issues found. It is suspected that it was light weight coke rather than coal and as such excess was blown from the train as it moved.

 

[sonic2009]

Train was stopped and examined with no issues found. It is suspected that it was light weight coke rather than coal and as such excess was blown from the train as it moved.

Thanks for that info. I will keep that network rail number handy, where abouts was it stopped?

 

[GB]

where abouts was it stopped?

Whitacre Jnc

 

[tsr]

Whitacre Jnc

To add further info (derived from RTT), this was at approx. 1041, with the train stopped for around 30mins.

 

[WillPS]

Perhaps a good reason to have Network Rail's Emergency number handy.

It's 08457 11 41 41

Off topic but it's insulting that they're using an 0845 number rather than an 03xx or 080x.

 

[tsr]

Off topic but it's insulting that they're using an 0845 number rather than an 03xx or 080x.

It is, but it's better than nothing (for now).

 

[pinguini]

Off topic but it's insulting that they're using an 0845 number rather than an 03xx or 080x.

You can use saynoto0870 website to find 01/02/03 alternatives for this number.

 

[High Dyke]

You can use saynoto0870 website to find 01/02/03 alternatives for this number.

Network Rail - 0845 711 4141 or 020 7557 8000 Melton Street switchboard

 

[TDK]

Yes, the train should be brought to a stand (preferably somewhere convenient!) for the Driver to go back and have a look. I'm not sure, to be honest, what the Rule Book says should happen next, but I'd imagine it'd be allowed to run forward, at reduced speed if necessary, to a suitable location for it to be dealt with properly.

This would be classed as a train with an unsafe load and as a rail employee you should get the train stopped immediately with an emergency call if nessessary..

 

[reb0118]

There is regularly loose coal lying around the platforms on the EGS (Edinburgh to Glasgow Central via Benhar Jn.). I've never seen it blown of trains but don't for one minute think it was the coal fairy. What would be the legality in taking and using said coal? Not any good for me as I have only a coal effect gas fire ~ as an aside I wish visitors to my humble abode would stop treating it as coal fire by throwing in their rubbish! Does this coal still belong to its original owner or does the railway take possession as it is now on its land?

 

[barrykas]

Network Rail - 0845 711 4141 or 020 7557 8000 Melton Street switchboard

Network Rail are no longer at Melton Street...Though the Switchboard number hasn't changed since the move to Kings Place (and is given on their Contact Us page).

It's incorrect to list it as an alternative to the 0845 number, however, as that goes directly to a dedicated Helpdesk.

 

[Mojo]

Does this "dedicated helpdesk" have a proper number? I'm not in the position to be able to call an 0845 number. Would contacting the National Operations Centre suffice?

 

[High Dyke]

Does this "dedicated helpdesk" have a proper number? I'm not in the position to be able to call an 0845 number.

Can't be certain... The only time they ring me they state it is the "Switchboard in Glasgow" calling

 

[Tomnick]

This would be classed as a train with an unsafe load and as a rail employee you should get the train stopped immediately with an emergency call if nessessary..

Obviously if you see it yourself, you're in a better position to judge whether it needs to be brought to a stand immediately. In this case, I'm sure it'd take some time for the information to trickle down from Control who would probably decide for you! Sounds like the sensible course of action of getting it clear of the main line was taken here, given that it had already run a couple of hundred miles!

 

[TDK]

Obviously if you see it yourself, you're in a better position to judge whether it needs to be brought to a stand immediately. In this case, I'm sure it'd take some time for the information to trickle down from Control who would probably decide for you! Sounds like the sensible course of action of getting it clear of the main line was taken here, given that it had already run a couple of hundred miles!

If a piece of coal had come off that train and hit a trains windscrenn travelling in the opposite direction it could have killed the driver so soryy to dissagree with you but that train should have been stopped immediately or run at a reduced speed until it could be inspected, I suppose the signaller was more worried about delays than the welfare of a driver!

 

[Tomnick]

As I said, I doubt the Signalman was made aware of the issue other than by a vague instruction from Control to recess the train for it to be inspected - so the decision had already been made. At no point did I suggest that performance should come ahead of anyone's safety, and if I (as a Signalman) observed something wrong with a passing train, then I'd be able to make my own decision based on what I've seen. I don't think it's too uncommon for small, light lumps of whatever to be lifted out of wagons though, so unless the train's obviously overloaded or there's bigger bits (which, as you say, can potentially do some damage) involved, I'm not sure I'd stop the job. If there was any hint of a dangerous situation though, that's a different kettle of fish!

 

[Cab2Cab]

As I said, I doubt the Signalman was made aware of the issue other than by a vague instruction from Control to recess the train for it to be inspected - so the decision had already been made. At no point did I suggest that performance should come ahead of anyone's safety, and if I (as a Signalman) observed something wrong with a passing train, then I'd be able to make my own decision based on what I've seen. I don't think it's too uncommon for small, light lumps of whatever to be lifted out of wagons though, so unless the train's obviously overloaded or there's bigger bits (which, as you say, can potentially do some damage) involved, I'm not sure I'd stop the job. If there was any hint of a dangerous situation though, that's a different kettle of fish!

Hi,

Dependent on the method of work at the loading location the train should be checked before leaving with a train list (weights, etc), you have a care of duty to passing through stations, other rail operators, OHLE and lineside equipment, somebody has to sign for the train and it's load.

Because the train has been reported and bought to a halt questions will be asked.

Cheers

 

[sonic2009]

And it didn't come off lightly either, it came off like someone had thrown it at the platform although we now know that it's light coke that came off not coal, it still came off and a few of the wagons were loaded right to the top.

If someone had been hit it would of caused a serious injury at which the speed it came off

 

[Death]

Shouldn't loose loads like coal, ballast and sand be sheeted over if being carried at speeds over 30-40mph?
(I know nowt about rail freight operations, but I know for certain I'd be "sheeting" my load if I was driving a truck loaded close to/at capacity with aggregates like that...)

 

[Welshman]

While I have no desire to detract from the seriousness of this matter, the headline of this thread also reminded me of tales of how coal used to regularly "fall" off the tenders of steam engines. And I'm equally sure that it was merely coincidental that a friend just happened to be passing at the bottom of the embankment with a wheelbarrow.

 

[No Fault Found]

If a piece of coal had come off that train and hit a trains windscrenn travelling in the opposite direction it could have killed the driver QUOTE]

I'd be very surprised if that would happen. Windscreens are amazingly tough and in 10 years on the railway i've not known anything penetrate a windscreen.

I've even taken a sledge hammer to a windscreen that had been removed due to being cracked and could not puncture the polycarbonate layer.

 

[LE Greys]

About fifteen years ago, I went to get some shots of Flying Soctsman going through Baldock, and a massive lump of coal came off the tender and hit me on the leg. It now sits on an old ashtray underneath my gas fire. She was doing about fifty at the time, and it fealt a bit like being trapped LBW by a fast bowler, only without pads on.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

There is a charge against freight companies for coal spillage - less and less common these days. I recall trains of somewhat overloaded MGR wagons having the overheight pile of coal smoothed off by the first overbridge ! Coal , not being particularly heavy and likely to fragment is less of an issue than say flying stone or ballast , or scrap metal.

 

[306024]

During the war............

Coal used to regularly fall from the steam loco's on the Thetford - Swaffham line, right into my aunt's garden.

Pure co-incidence